ASA TA vote NO?

[socrates1]

I am surprised by managements current offer. It seems good right now. However, management called for the last negotiation session, and then came to the table ready to meet most of our request. I hope our safety campaign had something to do with it. Maybe Delta pressured them into reaching a deal. There are many things in the TA that we haven't seen yet. We will, of course, see them prior to voting on it. Alpa wanted trip and duty rigs per day. Management wanted them to be a monthly average. A monthly average will not increase our paychecks. It needs to be day for day. The profit sharing has yet to be defined. Is it the current performance plus, or is it a pilot defined profit sharing. I know we will see this prior to a vote, but I think management wants this signed. Maybe they need a cost structure to bid for additional flying. Maybe it's another underlying issue. Either way, we might have some additional leverage right now. If we were to turn it down, will they come back with a better offer? Management just seemed very eager to get this done now after five plus years.

 

[GeekMaster]

This TA was agreed to OUTSIDE of a release. That's a very good thing at this point. Yes, we should ALL look thouroughly at the terms contained in the TA rather than rubber stamping it. To reject it simply because you are "suspicious" about why management came out of the blue to get it done is absurd however. You are probably correct to suspect something's up with our parent company, but if the agreement is acceptable to our demands.....then...uh...it is. You don't "up the price" just because willing to pay what you actually asked for.

As for your suspicions, they are probably warranted. Word on the street is Scotty is telling recurrent ground that they are preparing for a major collapse by another regional carrier. (probably Mesa) Either way, Jerry has "plans" that require a valid contract be in place

 

[Airboss]

Here is what I heard.
Profit Sharing not performance plus-75% Based on company profits, 25% based on performance.
I believe trip rigs are per day.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Why all the excitement? Have a look at it, pay attention at the roadshows, ask questions, and get answers.

It's a TA. Get over it. And don't vote YES just because we finally got one.

 

[socrates1]

Geek master

I'm glad you find my suspicions warranted. However, I do not yet know if the current TA meets our demands. I think we need to be cautious still.

 

[DX Rick]

DEMAND MORE MONEY!!!
$.90 IS A JOKE!
No wonder management loves it.

Make a clause that is management gets a bonus or raise, so do all pilots!

 

[OzBushWhacker]

New hire pay?

Any increase in new hire pay? Interested in staying in the southeast.

 

[DX Rick]

Any increase in new hire pay? Interested in staying in the southeast.

yeah, $.90.

 

[socrates1]

Mr Rick

I will admit that I have not looked at the FO rates. If it truly is $0.90 an hour, than I feel as if we should say no. I don't want to hang my FO's out to dry. However, as a nine year 200 captain, I will go from $68.xx/hr to $84.xx/hour in the next three years. I think that is acceptable. As for the rest of contract, that is yet to be seen.

 

[DX Rick]

Mr Rick

I will admit that I have not looked at the FO rates. If it truly is $0.90 an hour, than I feel as if we should say no. I don't want to hang my FO's out to dry. However, as a nine year 200 captain, I will go from $68.xx/hr to $84.xx/hour in the next three years. I think that is acceptable. As for the rest of contract, that is yet to be seen.

So what will be acceptable to sell your FO's out, just to get what you need? 9 Year captain making $84/hr is a little light in a drawls.
Like I said before, They want to give you a couple more bucks an hour, and you get all giggly, thinking you've hit it big time.
The regionals do all the work, why not get paid for it? We're the ones doing 5-legs a day for 5 days a week.

 

[PCL_128]

DEMAND MORE MONEY!!!
$.90 IS A JOKE!
No wonder management loves it.

Make a clause that is management gets a bonus or raise, so do all pilots!

Pay rates seem pretty good to me. Only Horizon makes more, and you'll never get anywhere with the Bush NMB if you hold out for a few more dollars. With legitimate complaints about job security or retirement, then you'd probably get a release eventually, but I don't see the Bush NMB releasing anyone over a few dollars of hourly pay.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

FO's are nice, but not entirely necessary. They could be replaced by a magazine rack.

 

[jetracer5]

First year FO went up $4 from $19 to $23. The rest of the FO scale didnt go up much more than a buck or 2 but were still the highest paid FO's. Just not by much.

 

[DX Rick]

Pay rates seem pretty good to me..

Of course they do. You're a scum bag who paid (paid an EAL SCAB) for all his time and his first job.

 

[DX Rick]

First year FO went up $4 from $19 to $23. The rest of the FO scale didnt go up much more than a buck or 2 but were still the highest paid FO's. Just not by much.

And still on food stamps. But hey, atleast you can say you're the "highest paid FO's"......hope that pays the bills for you.

 

[socrates1]

Mr. Rick

$84.00/Hr for a 50 seat aircraft is $1.68 per seat per hour. Lets assume a 777 CA makes $170.00 per hour. They sure aren't making the $290.00 per hour they were before 9/11. I think $170.00 per hour is an accurate amount. If not, please tell me what they make. At $170.00 per hour, that CA is making $0.56 per hour per seat.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

And still on food stamps. But hey, atleast you can say you're the "highest paid FO's"......hope that pays the bills for you.

You're right. We should absolutely hold out for $50 an hour for newhires and $200 an hour for 10 year Captains. Absolutely. You know, some dose of reality needs to come into play here at some point. This TA appears at first glance to be near or at the top of the regional industry in every category, and it may really be a big step up for us. The next company to reach a TA can build on it and so forth. You can't change the economic realities of the industry with one TA. Do you really think that after we refused to give in for 5 years that we're going to sign off on something we feel is unacceptable? We're not undercutting anyone here. Plenty of other people have already done that. On the surface, the TA appears to be a step in the right direction for the industry. Don't like it? Tough. Feel free to vote no on as many TAs as you like when your company gets into Section 6. Your rants make it clear that you really don't have enough experience in this industry to understand how this whole process works.

 

[DX Rick]

Mr. Rick

$84.00/Hr for a 50 seat aircraft is $1.68 per seat per hour. Lets assume a 777 CA makes $170.00 per hour. They sure aren't making the $290.00 per hour they were before 9/11. I think $170.00 per hour is an accurate amount. If not, please tell me what they make. At $170.00 per hour, that CA is making $0.56 per hour per seat.

You guys have the leverage in the world right now to get what you deserve. Yes, YOUR pay raise is a nice/decent one. Hell, ALPA needs to step up to the plate and do something, because over all moral of the Union has gone down hill, except in the dreams of PCL-128.
UAL and USAir are looking to vote them out, Colgan voted them down and several friends at SkyWest say it doesn't look to good of the Union getting voted in.
I have flown with several captain who want to vote them off the property.
All of mainline flights, ASA and Comair flights are leaving the gates full. It's pretty damned hard for management to say they're not making money, therefore we can't have the nice pay raise.
I garuntee you, management will take some form of a multi million dollar bonus of some sort within 2 year of signing the new contract. Always happens.
Hell, after they took their $18mil in concessions from us, management took a $18mil bonus for "bringing the airline out of bankruptcy"
We're doing all the work. Why not get paid for it? They're getting million salaries for working 6 hour days, weekends off, home everynight and a day off here and there.
Get with it.

 

[PCL_128]

Your rants make it clear that you really don't have enough experience in this industry to understand how this whole process works.

Exactly.

 

[socrates1]

Hey guys

We are "commuter commanders". I am happy with the current pay scales on the TA. My kids eat three squares a day, and have shoes on their feet in February. If you want more, than try to move on.
However, please don't think the TA is "the cats meow." Let's see the final version, and than vote you mind.