ASA Screw Scheduling

[ohplease!]

Just because you have had a good run lately, it would be short-sighted to believe this is the "new and improved" scheduling."

aside from being on reserve a couple years ago ( of my own choice ) I've NEVER had issues with scheduling. I've had dto do a couple things I didn't like but, they needed it and were within their rights. Perception/reality.

 

[Turkey Shoot]

Gotta disagree with you there. I can remember explaining integration to a mainline jumpseater one day (about 3-4 years ago), and he was completely floored by it. As he put it "that's like putting everyone back on reserve for the first few days of the month....what's the point in having seniority if that's how they do it?" I don't know how they did it at mainline, but I know they were not doing PBS at that point, and they also didn't have this crazy integration system we have either. Anything man-made can be made better to better serve man. Once you stop believing that you might as well cash it all in because you've officially given up.

-Blucher

I understand that intergration comes due to how the requests from mainline come down. I would have to believe they have a little bit different setup for their own guys since it's planned much farther than for the regional feed. At least that was how my buddy in scheduling from my last company explained it.

With Pref Bid, there is no more transistion period but I'd rather deal with it at the beginning of the month until pref bid works in my favor.

 

[jehtplane]

those rat bastards did it to me again! I had a great schedule for Aug. and they went and integrated me for a freakin' 2 day worth almost 12 hours! And if that wasn't bad enough, when I said I didn't like the trip and I had something planned those days, you know what they did?!?! they traded it for something else I did like. DAMIT!!! Those jerks!

oh yeah, two days ago, they called me at home and I answered the phone on my off day. You know what they did?!?!? They asked me if I would like to come to work for JR. man pay. I had somethng planned with my kids and told them I didn't really want to come to work that day. DO YOU KNOW WHAT THOSE A'HOLES DID?!?!?! They said "o.k. no problem. We'll call someone else. Have fun with the kids".

The nerve of those people! Now I see what you guys are always bitchin' about. Lets shut this f'ing place down!!!!! Nobody should have to be treated this badly.

I think you have had enough beer this morning

 

[BCpilot81]

I have not really had a problem with scheduling yet either, but I will say that they have their own internal problems with their system and with one another. But, I have had schedulers cover my @$$ in some pretty major ways already. Plus, their schedules SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! especially for what they are paid.

 

[rightseatjocky]

I don't see what the complaining is about. He answered his phone on a off day. You are told in BI and during your training, dont answer the phone on a off day. I guess you learned it the hard way, get over it and take the pay, if not quit and get a job you can be home with your kids.

 

[sweptback]

I understand that intergration comes due to how the requests from mainline come down. I would have to believe they have a little bit different setup for their own guys since it's planned much farther than for the regional feed. At least that was how my buddy in scheduling from my last company explained it.

With Pref Bid, there is no more transistion period but I'd rather deal with it at the beginning of the month until pref bid works in my favor.

Why not let us bid on integration/carry-in trips just like we bid on initial open time? They could even have a number of off days that one could bid on as well. It seems like such a simple concept, really.

This could all happen without PBS, by the way.

 

[AuburnRedneck9]

I think I flew with your dumbass when I was a newhire several years ago. Let me guess your old man was a US Air guy and you know a scheduler personally...now it all makes sense. Game is up you jerk I know exactly who you are.

 

[rightseatjocky]

I think I flew with your dumbass when I was a newhire several years ago. Let me guess your old man was a US Air guy and you know a scheduler personally...now it all makes sense. Game is up you jerk I know exactly who you are.

Who is that direct to? Mmm I guess it's not me.

 

[Willy21]

ah ha! now you may be onto something here. PERCEPTION vs. REALITY.

He is right on point. I know because I got drafted twice this week for a total of three days. Maybe you need to step into reality. It is a staffing issue.

Look at Scott Hall's letter about the SLC base closing. In it he said that anybody that wanted to go to SkyWest would be given the first class date after their interview for DOE and would not go to class until October. That was the plan to keep the staffing loss at a minimum until the base closed. We have lost I think four f/o's to SkyWest in the last weeks, Mr. Hall's letter was not what really happened and that has put SLC in a staffing bind.

Look at the awards for next month, four reserve f/o's to cover 53 hard lines and the unpublished trips. One of them was in a crashpad with me and has found and started another job, I am happy for him. So now there are three.

Management has learned nothing about what happens when you close a base. They lost a lot of f/o's from DFW because they didn't want to move to ATL and we are seeing this again. Those people find other jobs and it is up to management to forcast this and have replacements ready to fill the void. ASA management didn't do their job and now the SLC f/o's will pay for their error.

A word to SLC f/o's: check the block times when they reschedule you, crew schedueling is starting to fudge the times. Fly safe and remember you are the only one that will keep yourself from being violated.

I am now off the box.

 

[rightseatjocky]

He is right on point. I know because I got drafted twice this week for a total of three days. Maybe you need to step into reality. It is a staffing issue.

Look at Scott Hall's letter about the SLC base closing. In it he said that anybody that wanted to go to SkyWest would be given the first class date after their interview for DOE and would not go to class until October. That was the plan to keep the staffing loss at a minimum until the base closed. We have lost I think four f/o's to SkyWest in the last weeks, Mr. Hall's letter was not what really happened and that has put SLC in a staffing bind.

Look at the awards for next month, four reserve f/o's to cover 53 hard lines and the unpublished trips. One of them was in a crashpad with me and has found and started another job, I am happy for him. So now there are three.

Management has learned nothing about what happens when you close a base. They lost a lot of f/o's from DFW because they didn't want to move to ATL and we are seeing this again. Those people find other jobs and it is up to management to forcast this and have replacements ready to fill the void. ASA management didn't do their job and now the SLC f/o's will pay for their error.

A word to SLC f/o's: check the block times when they reschedule you, crew schedueling is starting to fudge the times. Fly safe and remember you are the only one that will keep yourself from being violated.

I am now off the box.

I have chosen to answer my phone, but only when Connelly calls me personaly. Yes, I have been called at home, but I answered the phone on purpose. I make them positive space me there and back home and I make them give me a conformation number. With all my credits this month, I will get paid for 147 hours this month. It's not fabrication or expanding anything, check out my schedule.
Willy, you're right in the fact that we have had 4 leave already. We also have 7 fo's out of slc leaving next month also. We are going to be hurting like there's no tomorrow.
I make sure my times are up to date at the time of the next duty in. I also still call in my out times so they're right and I don't have to wait 3-5 days for them to correct themselves off the paper work. We should all still call in the times.

 

[ohplease!]

I don't see what the complaining is about. He answered his phone on a off day. You are told in BI and during your training, dont answer the phone on a off day. I guess you learned it the hard way, get over it and take the pay, if not quit and get a job you can be home with your kids.

re -read the post

 

[Willy21]

I make sure my times are up to date at the time of the next duty in. I also still call in my out times so they're right and I don't have to wait 3-5 days for them to correct themselves off the paper work. We should all still call in the times.

It is not the on and in times they are changing. They are changing the flight plan times from what is published in the bid packet. (ie MSP - SLC is less block than SLC - MSP by 30 minutes) By doing that they think that they can create a legal extension or jr man schedule.

 

[Blucher]

re -read the post

Hate to admit it, but I finally agree with something Ohplease said. Jockey, please re-read the post.

-Blucher:erm:

 

[sweptback]

It is not the on and in times they are changing. They are changing the flight plan times from what is published in the bid packet. (ie MSP - SLC is less block than SLC - MSP by 30 minutes) By doing that they think that they can create a legal extension or jr man schedule.

I am not entirely positive on this, but I believe it is allowed for them to change the block times, provided that the release has been generated and realistic taxi times are included. Technically these would be "more accurate" since it would account for current winds, not a historical average, however I've never seen it go in favor of the pilot.

I would definitely double check the times vs. the release and the realistic taxi times though.

 

[ohplease!]

Hate to admit it, but I finally agree with something Ohplease said. -Blucher:erm:

now see? that didn't hurt so bad did it?

 

[AuburnRedneck9]

Excuse me, I was speaking of our semi managment puke, Oh Please. The tool has a friend in scheduling which is why they don't treat him like everyone else. I love it when scheduling calls it's like sport to see what kind of idiotic plan they have for you and how many different ways that it is illegal.

 

[Turkey Shoot]

See why it pays to drop pizzas off with scheduling when you're on reserve? some people call it sucking up, I prefer watching out for one's self ecspecialy when you're scheduling's biotch.

 

[ohplease!]

Excuse me, I was speaking of our semi managment puke, Oh Please. The tool has a friend in scheduling which is why they don't treat him like everyone else. I love it when scheduling calls it's like sport to see what kind of idiotic plan they have for you and how many different ways that it is illegal.

funny how anyone who doesn't agree with you guys is management. Just how many management pilots do you think ASA can have?... tool? why the name calling? not able to leave your middle school years? time to grow up and stop name calling when someone doesn't agree with what you're saying. maybe, just maybe, you're not as smart as you think. I know the older I get the smarter I was. I was the smartest human alive when I was in middle school. You'll see how it works once you grow up.

 

[rightseatjocky]

Willy, I understand what you meant by changing the times. I have had them do that for me so they can get a flight out on my block time. Per flica, I have gone over 100 2 times this month. They have to drop you back down to 97.30 and then they can do what they want. Again, to fit the trips in they want, yes they will manipulate the times to fit it in so someone can do it. I have had it done and when they do that for lets say jr man. I keep very good track of what I have flown in the month and for that trip I will still get over block and submit it in the pay form that way. When they do something like that, I just fly at .74 and I will make money that way, when they try to take off 30 minutes. It works both ways.

 

[~~~^~~~]

I am not entirely positive on this, but I believe it is allowed for them to change the block times, provided that the release has been generated and realistic taxi times are included. Technically these would be "more accurate" since it would account for current winds, not a historical average, however I've never seen it go in favor of the pilot.

I would definitely double check the times vs. the release and the realistic taxi times though.

Sweptback is correct. They routinely scheduled me with 2 minute taxi outs in Atlanta. They have also insisted on using CR7 block times for the ATR. The thing is that they know you are rushing like heck just to get your 8 hour block (9:55) actual of flying done so you can go home, eat, get some sleep, or whatever you do during the 332 hours left in the month after your 340 hours Time Away From Base.

Yes, you can call them on it. You will argue with them until you are "disconnected," then you call your dispatcher for the "real times," you call crew scheduling back, but they don't recognise what the dispatcher told you, the flight control manager and some assistant chief pilot get involved. In the mean time you could have flown a round trip to CYUL.....

After going through this a couple of times a pilot learns just to do the stupid MCN turn (after all, crew scheduling promises you will be off when you get back to ATL). The weather gets bad, there are ground holds and you end up back in ATL after 15:55 of duty. Crew scheduling then reminds you that you have 9 hours reduced in domicile because of "operational delay." But they are nice enough to tell you at 02:50 your duty in is now 11:50 for a 12:10 departure - "see you in the morning, I mean, umn, later today, he he he...."

It infuriates me that "operatonal delay" is "legal" because you could not fly an CR7 day line in an ATR with scheduled 2 minute taxi times.

You just have to get to the point where you tell the Bastards, "NO."

Crew scheduling might have been nice once, but when people are bailing out of ASA because of the lack of any future opportunity (to make the current sacrifice worth enduring) and the weather goes down - watch out. All they want is a butt in a seat, they don't care if their actions results in incidents, or accidents, that is your problem.

Crew Schedulers don't have Certificates, you do. Be careful.

Look up the definition of a slave:

Slavery is the social and legal designation of specific persons as property, for the purpose of providing labor and services for the owner without the right of the slave to refuse.

That is why I want to restrict involuntary junior maning in this next contract. I currently have 4 ocurrences, 3 of these were on my scheduled time off. If they want to fire me for refusing extensions when I'm fatigued, let them try.

Dave, Shelia and Rochelle need to be recognized as the true "Award of Excellence" winners they are.