ASA Mgmt cannot staff properly; wants new hire pay raises

[spudskier]

Look I don't normally post here in fear of my britches catching on fire as a thread is flamed into a useless pile of charred embers, but this is a hot button topic for me.

I am a new hire. I recently passed my checkride (been on the property a bit over 2 months and gained many many numbers on the new list).

First off, Bull honkey! I am 100% qualified to be here. Admittedly there are some 250hr new hires which drive me nuts but I'm not one of them. Sorry about your luck that when you got here times were... more selective. Argument that people under 2000hrs or whatever don't deserve it is total idiocy and you know it.

*whew* that being said, the new hires like myself are stuck between a rock and a hard place in terms of our loyalties. On the one hand, our first year pay blows harder than Katrina. Other hand I'm glad they rejected the raises because it's all or none, not just new hires. I want to see the entire pilot group as a whole do better and I know ALPA is doing what they're supposed to do by rejecting the offer. Then on the other hand I want to see the company do well, hire enough pilots so I might have a few days off and be financially successful so i have a job in a year or two from now.

In our new hire classes we're taught to hate the company because they won't budge on the "few remaining issues", were taught to be pissed at the MEC because it looks from the outside to a new guy that they're asking for the moon and then some. Were taught to dread the crusty disgruntled captains we're going to be flying with. Oh yeah, and there's always the threat looming over our heads that this might result in a strike (which might ACTUALLY be a good thing from what we're told) but would take away those hefty 3-digit paychecks we're getting. (Disclaimer: This is NOT being taught by the people who actually are paid to teach us things, don't want anyone in trouble here)

So why did I choose to work here again? Oh yeah, damn good training dept, decent airplanes, lotta good people to work with, quick upgrade time livable pay the 2nd year (not to say it shouldn't be higher), really good people to work with (did I mention that already?)

So keep things in check... things could be a LOT better, but could be a LOT worse. Us newbies want whats good for the company as well as ourselves and the pilot group as a whole.

 

[USCtrojan]

Look I don't normally post here in fear of my britches catching on fire as a thread is flamed into a useless pile of charred embers, but this is a hot button topic for me.

I am a new hire. I recently passed my checkride (been on the property a bit over 2 months and gained many many numbers on the new list).

First off, Bull honkey! I am 100% qualified to be here. Admittedly there are some 250hr new hires which drive me nuts but I'm not one of them. Sorry about your luck that when you got here times were... more selective. Argument that people under 2000hrs or whatever don't deserve it is total idiocy and you know it.

*whew* that being said, the new hires like myself are stuck between a rock and a hard place in terms of our loyalties. On the one hand, our first year pay blows harder than Katrina. Other hand I'm glad they rejected the raises because it's all or none, not just new hires. I want to see the entire pilot group as a whole do better and I know ALPA is doing what they're supposed to do by rejecting the offer. Then on the other hand I want to see the company do well, hire enough pilots so I might have a few days off and be financially successful so i have a job in a year or two from now.

In our new hire classes we're taught to hate the company because they won't budge on the "few remaining issues", were taught to be pissed at the MEC because it looks from the outside to a new guy that they're asking for the moon and then some. Were taught to dread the crusty disgruntled captains we're going to be flying with. Oh yeah, and there's always the threat looming over our heads that this might result in a strike (which might ACTUALLY be a good thing from what we're told) but would take away those hefty 3-digit paychecks we're getting. (Disclaimer: This is NOT being taught by the people who actually are paid to teach us things, don't want anyone in trouble here)

So why did I choose to work here again? Oh yeah, damn good training dept, decent airplanes, lotta good people to work with, quick upgrade time livable pay the 2nd year (not to say it shouldn't be higher), really good people to work with (did I mention that already?)

So keep things in check... things could be a LOT better, but could be a LOT worse. Us newbies want whats good for the company as well as ourselves and the pilot group as a whole.

Great post, I think you're preaching to the choir here, brother.

Trojan

 

[ualdriver]

ASA flight operations management today sought relief in the Status Quo of our current contract to give raises to new hire pilots. Management stated they are having difficulty attracting qualified applicants to ASA.
After consultation with the voting members, MEC Chairman responded to managements request by stating quite simply, “If management wants to attract quality pilots to ASA – settling the remaining open issues of our entire contract will both attract new pilots and stabilize the current pilot groups’ frustrations with management.”
While the MEC is all for working together for win-win situations, we are not interested in carving out special treatment for one segment of the group (new hires) while the remainder of the pilot group have been waiting almost 5 years for pay raises and much needed work rule changes.
One additional point; previous statements by management like, “zero-net-gain contract,” and “we need to be the second lowest paid pilots or we’ll shrink-and-die,” do not help attract quality pilots either.
Your MEC is committed to achieving the goals set out by the ASA pilots; to conclude these negotiations with a fair and equitable contract. At the same time we recognize the value of building a working relationship with management to address our common goals and interests. It is this MEC’s position that the quickest and most successful way to attract quality and experienced pilots to ASA is to conclude these negotiations quickly and acknowledge the hard work and dedication of the ASA pilots as a whole.

I don't have a dog in your fight (other than I want to see you guys kick ASA management A$$), but I 100% agree with your MEC's position. You have to use every bit of leverage possible, and this is a nice little lever.

 

[ERJDRVR]

They could bypass this all by simply saying, "hey newhires, we will give you 10K bonus once you complete training".

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but this does not violate any CBA's.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Don't get me wrong. I agree that the union did the right thing. They had no choice. It's just too bad it has to come to this. Really, the newhires should blame the company for being so petty.

 

[www.]

Regardless, both the offer by the company, and the response by the union were very predictable.

I support and I would expect no less from the MEC on this issue. Business is business.

 

[www.]

Great post, I think you're preaching to the choir here, brother.

Trojan

I got your brother right here...You back in ATL or commute?

 

[www.]

They could bypass this all by simply saying, "hey newhires, we will give you 10K bonus once you complete training".

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but this does not violate any CBA's.

A change in pay.

 

[jstyle13]

If they wanna get new hires in here, they can raise the pay with a new rate in the new contract that they seem to be in no hurry to wrap up. Aside from that, they are wasting their time blowing that crap up the unions/pilot groups a$$.

 

[FishandFly]

So the company and the MEC take the newhires hostage. It was bound to happen sometime.

While I agree it's unfair to the rest of the pilots to only give a raise to newhires, and I also agree that it's counterproductive to give the company what it wants without quid-pro-quo, it's still sad that the lowest paid pilots at the company are going to have to carry our water.

It seems the gamesmanship on both sides continues...

Alpa reacted correctly. It is ASA mgmt's operating philosophy to screw everyone they can until they pay a numerical price. Other than minute issues where individuals in mgmt have gone out of there way to be good (or normal) people instead of maintaining the ASA mgmt status quo, this company insists on putting employees last.

And although new hires do need a significant raise, asa mgmt's attempt to bandage up there utterly inept company philosophy should not be accepted.