ASA furloughs 80 pilots

[filejw]

This had to be the most intelligent posting that you have ever made.

But your still a Bozo.

He may be a Bozo but he is right. Ripping things down never helped anybody.

 

[CFI2766]

I along with 186 pilots vote against the CBA. If the no furlough protection was so important to many, why didn't you guys hold out until the contract language protected any ASA pilot?

So are you part of this problem?

To quote, from Websters:

–verb (used with object) 1. to ascribe (one's acts, opinions, etc.) to causes that superficially seem reasonable and valid but that actually are unrelated to the true, possibly unconscious and often less creditable or agreeable causes. 2. to remove unreasonable elements from. 3. to make rational or conformable to reason. 4. to treat or explain in a rational or rationalistic manner.

 

[Texx]

To quote, from Websters:

–verb (used with object) 1. to ascribe (one's acts, opinions, etc.) to causes that superficially seem reasonable and valid but that actually are unrelated to the true, possibly unconscious and often less creditable or agreeable causes. 2. to remove unreasonable elements from. 3. to make rational or conformable to reason. 4. to treat or explain in a rational or rationalistic manner.

yawn..

 

[ohplease!]

Honestly, I don't see the contradiction. I could be missing something here, but what did you mean here?

It's not in the financial interests of ASA/SKYW to train pilots with the intention of furloughing them. I don't think that this action had any overt malice towards the pilot group. Am I wrong here?

well then, step back and take a deep breath...I'll wait..........ok, better?

Now, if you feel that the company did everything they could and put off furloughs as long as possible and laid off a few as possible, then by all accounts, even yours, everything has been done that could have been done.

There was always open time before (forever) and there was no problem with people picking it up.....if everything has been done to soften this blow....and even according to you it has....then why should picking up open time now be any different than before? Its not going to bring anyone back any sooner than they would have gotten back anyway.

It will just fall to RES first then JM next and if that doesn't get it, it'll get canceled which directly affects our performance/reliability and that will directly affect future flying (negatively) and they may NEVER get back. possibly even being joined on the street by more of our fellow ASAers.

BTW, if you do see a list, what will you do? vandalize their car/home/bag/mail box? punch them out? What?

 

[Tarzan]

I have always picked up time to ensure I could feed my children on put food on the table. If you want to call me on, you're more than welcome to but last time I checked, you weren't paying my bills. I'm sorry if I sound callous because I am not. I know how it goes when a job is lost and your back is against the wall wondering how you're going to feed your kids and keep a roof over their heads. Sorry but the only one out there ensuring these things are done is me.

I don't see ASA keeping guys laid off when we are struggling to make on time numbers that are crew related. I for one am going to do my part to keep this company going forward and not resort to hurting the company just to show them. It only hurts me, you and the guys getting furloughed.

 

[zawillif]

Furloughs suck. Period. But bickering among the pilots about who's picking up open time, or who's not donating $$$ etc. isn't helping the situation. Personally, I take this as a kick in the ass to do everything I can do, to make ASA a viable option for future growth. That is the only way we are getting these guys back, and everyone needs to get on board with that. There are still a lot of crews who are apathetic to fuel conservation, D-0 and customer service. So instead of arguing, second guessing our management, and cursing Delta, do something about it. There's 1630 of us after Feb. 9th who can give the furloughed guys the biggest gift of all, and that's just by doing our jobs, and doing them in the most efficient, professional manner possible.

I nominate The Nuge for president of FI for the day.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Furloughs suck. Period. But bickering among the pilots about who's picking up open time, or who's not donating $$$ etc. isn't helping the situation. Personally, I take this as a kick in the ass to do everything I can do, to make ASA a viable option for future growth. That is the only way we are getting these guys back, and everyone needs to get on board with that. There are still a lot of crews who are apathetic to fuel conservation, D-0 and customer service. So instead of arguing, second guessing our management, and cursing Delta, do something about it. There's 1630 of us after Feb. 9th who can give the furloughed guys the biggest gift of all, and that's just by doing our jobs, and doing them in the most efficient, professional manner possible.

Will somebody please log McNugent out of the hotel computer. I don't think I've ever heard him write something so poignant.

I've already been doing this stuff, and will continue to do so.

 

[CFI2766]

well then, step back and take a deep breath...I'll wait..........ok, better?

Now, if you feel that the company did everything they could and put off furloughs as long as possible and laid off a few as possible, then by all accounts, even yours, everything has been done that could have been done.

There was always open time before (forever) and there was no problem with people picking it up.....if everything has been done to soften this blow....and even according to you it has....then why should picking up open time now be any different than before? Its not going to bring anyone back any sooner than they would have gotten back anyway.

Now I see your point. I don't necessarily agree with it, which, is okay in the grand scheme of things.

It will just fall to RES first then JM next and if that doesn't get it, it'll get canceled which directly affects our performance/reliability and that will directly affect future flying (negatively) and they may NEVER get back. possibly even being joined on the street by more of our fellow ASAers.

Concur. I am not, in any way, suggesting that I would do anything to harm the company. That would only put the recall further back in time for these guys/gals.

What's different now than just a couple of years ago is that the current management has made a compelling argument that the best interests of ASA are the same as the best interests of the pilot group.


BTW, if you do see a list, what will you do? vandalize their car/home/bag/mail box? punch them out? What?

Nah, I'm no internet tough guy; that's not my thing. Though capable, if I have to physically assault someone to make a point, that individual is probably not worth the effort and time. However, it would be interesting to see a list of folks who pick up open time to see if the name of any of my ex-friends are on that list.

Several names of people that I currently call friends are on the list that will be out of a job as of 9 Feb.

 

[cheerios2]

Feed your family? Really?

If you cant feed them on 75h .. havent you overextended yourself a bit?

 

[ASA_Aviator]

Yes. That is EXACTLY what I'm advocating.

If the company can cover the open time with the amount of pilots on the active roster, why should the company recall the furloughs?

Look, I'm not throwing a barb at the company here. It's an awful situation; apparently it appears to be a situation that the company put off as long as it could. (Granted, I have only the obvious public information. As a line flying, habitually fatigued, underpaid, pilot, I probably do not have all of the facts.) The company is doing what it can in the interests of its shareholders first. Frankly, that's the way business works.

If I were one of the guys furloughed, as we all could be, I would want the guys left on the schedule thinking about me in the same way that I'm thinking about them. As pilots, no one will ever look out for us but ourselves. Bottom line, if you pick up open time at ASA, you are keeping an ASA pilot out of a job.

Initial open time or future open time? There is a difference, after all.

One thing to consider is that the staffing projections look historically at how many crews it takes to cover a given amount of flying. That includes historical levels of picking up open time, sick calls, etc.

So, the company decides how many to furlough based on that staffing model. They then furlough the 80 people, but now no one picks up open time (in your perfect world), so the staffing model is incorrect. So now line pilots get extended more frequently, and get paid more money to fly time and a half when it could have cost the company just straight time.

The fact is that the staffing model is set, and picking up open time or not is certainly not going to lose or save anyone's jobs. It is purely in your head that you are making a difference.

I understand the sentiment, and it certainly is not a good situation we have going here, but monkeying around with the system will only make things worse.

Besides, if you think anyone is REALLY going to show any solidarity and not pick up open time, you are smoking something. When it is all said and done, people are going to do what they have to do for their families. That has been shown time and again in this industry.