ASA finally Sold....really

[bvt1151]

Be careful ASA. I'd strongly suggest getting your case together to merge the lists. If the Skywest corporation is to grow, its not going to the ASA part, it'll be their own baby. Reference Continental and Eastern. You can be bled dry until there's just enough left to sell you, or more probable, IPO. Don't forget that you're in contract negotiations and Skywest doesn't look to favorably on unions. I'd expect you to be made an example for the Skywest pilot group. "See what we could do to you if you were unionized?"

 

[Bluto]

"See what we could do to you if you were unionized?"

Are you kidding? Do you honestly think they could do something to us then that they can't do to us now? They can do whatever they want, whenever they want with or without our consent or approval. How could it be worse?

 

[ASApilotboy]

Interesting, indeed, this development. Naturally concerned about the pilot community, the good news is that pilots will continue to be paid to fly fairly new aircraft while somebody else puts gas in the tank. The questions which concern me most, however, are these: will the new management team implement quality changes in how the ATL hub operation is conducted? How quickly can the new mgmnt team figure out how to park more flights than concrete allows in ATL? Will there be any more money directed toward the non-pilot support community which accommodates the paying passenger, thus improving the quality of employee attainable on the ramp, gate and Operations? How will the portions of the non-pilot community which have traditionally eyed ASA as an entry position for experience react (i.e.; mechanics who work for $13 hourly waiting for that major job at $43 hourly; dispatchers who work for much less than those who are employed at a major; etc.) And, bottom line, how will the benefits package for non-contract employees (as well as for the pilot community) be modified?
It has been my privilege to be associated with the ASA ATL pilot community in one way or another for parts of the 20th and 21st centuries. I truly believe - honestly - that you will find no better group of people, or aviators, anywhere. 99 percent of them have soldiered on with total professionalism despite the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune which have been directed at them by the mess associated with the contract.
But the real story of ASA - in ATL at least - has been how a company has been able to fly into prosperity with little or no regard for the cost in human terms: lives of people who came to work for peanuts looking to improve their modest backgrounds have been shattered; hundreds (literally) of foreign nationals who came to ATL and shared accommodations while saving what money they could until possible to bring their families to America; people with no propensity for college who learned (on-the-job mostly) what works, and doesn't work, for an efficient operation and who busted their fannies, only to be used up and discarded with health problems, emotional distress, financial disaster; these are the ones who have paid, and will continue to pay the price - in human terms - for the disaster that has been Delta mismanagement.
Pilots, like everyone else, have problems. The pressure from those problems sometimes vent most easily when it seems the support community which parks, downloads, uploads, pushes, fuels, schedules, and dispatches their aircraft is not motivated in the most optimal fashion.
But in the weeks ahead, as SkyWest management seeks to transition (and forget not that the people they will trust to aid in that transition will be current ASA management) the acquisition, let's all be mindful of the non-pilot community and their situations. In some cases, working for ASA in ATL is all these folks have known, or been able to do. For some, success (in whatever limited fashion compared to being a jet driver) at ASA has been the greatest thing they - or anyone in their family - have ever done. That cabin service agent who busts his ass in the C24-28 zone every day washing windshields... that lav driver on the night shift who is virtually the only one who will service lavs anywhere on the property...the occasional rampers who, on 100+ degree days, still run to park you...
The airline will always need pilots. No company will ever pay pilots what they are worth. But at least they will pay pilots a living wage to do what they do.
The non-pilot community at ASA has always labored for little money, but the insurance and travel benefits carried a lot of weight for many low-income folks who otherwise would have little or no chance to provide for their families and to see the world, thus broadening their horizons.
It'll be interesting to see which managers at ASA survive the transition. In fact, all you really have to do to judge the sincerity (and thus, the eventual success) of the new management team, is to watch and see which of the ASA ATL managers are retained, and which ones are discarded. Who gets thrown out and who gets promoted will tell you all you need to know.
It is my greatest hope that everyone will get well with this acquisition. It is my greatest hope that the pilot community will be treated as the single most treasured resource any airline could have. And it is my greatest hope that, concommitant with that first class treatment of pilots, the new management treats the non-pilot community better, also.
Clear-and-a-million and happy landings to one and all.

 

[spinproof]

ASApilotboy



Paragraph breaks are free please use them at will.....

 

[vc10]

How will Skywest prevent Skywest and ASA from being characterized as a single transportation system, subject to having the workforces being considered as one from a union/non union standpoint?

Why wouldn't ALPA immediately seek to have the two carriers viewed as a single transportation system?

Straight from the Acquisition Q&A on skywest.com:

http://www.skywest.com/qa/index.php

The SkyWest, Inc. pay philosophies of being fair to employees while maintaining a competitive cost structure will be applied to both companies, but this does not necessarily mean that all pay scales will be identical. SkyWest, Inc. will be in the unique position of allocating resources, including growth aircraft to the two carriers, so it is imperative that both carriers have competitive cost structures to support future growth opportunities. Each carrier may arrive at competitive costs in different ways.

Seniorities will not be merged since the companies are independent.

There are many questions and issues regarding employee travel privileges and benefits that we will have to work through. This may take some time, and there will not be immediate answers. Our general guiding principle will be to improve wherever possible.

Jerry Atkin will serve as chairman of the board and chief executive officer (CEO) of SkyWest, Inc., SkyWest Airlines and ASA. Brad Rich will serve as chief financial officer (CFO) for SkyWest, Inc., SkyWest Airlines and ASA. Ron Reber will serve as president of SkyWest Airlines, while Bryan LaBrecque will serve as interim president of ASA.

 

[kngarthur]

I believe DL paid $800 million. (Somebody correct me if I am wrong). Not exactly a good return on their investment.

I thought SW paid 400 mil.

 

[Palerider957]

Paragraph breaks are free please use them at will.....

You are an idiot.....

 

[Palerider957]

ASApilot Boy:

Well said, there is much more at steak than just the pilot group. If DAl tanks, then the whole ATL economy stands to take a huge hit.

 

["GO AROUND"]

bvt115,

Do you really think SKW managment wants the headache of trying to merge two companies? I think not. Do you really think SKW could shrink ASA or replace all we do in ATL? We can't cover all the flying we do in ATL ( our inept managment' inability to staff our airline), do you really think SKW could with all the other flying you do? Keep that dream " they'll just grow SKW and not ASA" alive over there in the SKW pilot group, cause you are the olny ones that think it will happen. Furthermore, Delta would have covered their a$$ in the sale agreement to keep anything from disrupting the service ASA provides. SKW managment wants two companies that make money for the shareholders by keeping Delta happy with the flying they do for them and giving them more flying. SKW managment can look favorably on our union or not, but it doesn't change anything from our current situation. Our current managment doesn't look favorably on our union as it is. SKW can choose to work with us to make a better airline or against us and drag the airline further down than it is, and you along with us. My hope is that we can turn a new page and make both companies a better place.

Here I sit, hopefully optimistic yet disillusioned.........

 

[Monster Buck]

First, I want to wish everyone luck in this process. As far as RJ debt is concerned, I am certain that the leases or RJ debt will be assigned to Skywest. Do you think that Delta would continue to guarantee the debt of a non-owned regional? Highly doubt it. Skywest will likely assume any debt or aircraft leases - period.

I agree that the whipsaw negotiating tool will likely be used in the future, unfortunately. For example, if the ASA guys don't agree to Skywest CR7 wages, then all growth will go to the "compliant" Skywest pilot group... And back and forth and back and forth - it's a classic negotiations strategy.

Good luck to everyone involved

Right on the button. Here come the whipsaws. I hope you guys can stick together, and give them hell.

 

[bailout]

If Delta goes BK, and they will, Not much will change from a travelers point of view. Look at United. Sure they had some schedule changes and different equipment, but they are still flying as if they were not in BK to the outside public. Delta is not going away, BK or not.

 

[Bluto]

How will Skywest prevent Skywest and ASA from being characterized as a single transportation system, subject to having the workforces being considered as one from a union/non union standpoint?

How did Delta manage to do exactly what you suggest with ASA and Comair since 1999? With the same union at both companies? Just because the parent company changes, why would you automatically assume circumstances would be different than they were? In fact, since SkyWest serves UAL as well, it seems even more possible that they will remain seperate.

 

[Beantown]

In my opinion, both pilot groups need to start pushing for one list. The airline can keep both airlines alive but using ONE LIST. THIS NEEDS TO BE A PRIORITY.

Long story short

• Mesa bought CCair in 1999.
• Promised no changes but both airlines would remain separate.
• Mean while both pilot groups got together and created a merged list on there own.
• With in 6 months Mesa was asking CCair to take pay cuts for growth (jets)
• (btw: CCair had a industry+ contract full of work rules that Mesa still doesn't have)
• Within one yr, Mesa started shrinking CCair while Mesa was growing fast.
• Every yr Mesa came back to CCair and asked for pay cuts and when turned down, shrunk CCair some more.
• Mesa then started replacing CCair flights with Mesa flights.
• Then CCair was gone.

(Mesa pilots got the CCair pilots back to work, using the merged list in 1999 by giving up other QOL improvement in the last contract. )

PUSH FOR ONE LIST, EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO GIVE UP A LITTLE IN THE SHORT TERM. OTHER WISE EVERYONE WILL LOSE IN THE LONG TERM. Good Luck guys-Bean

 

[spinproof]

You are an idiot.....

....and I'm an idiot because I find run on paragraphs hard to read?

 

[ASApilotboy]

Spinproof:
I apologize for being computer challenged. I have tried my best to make the paragraphs look like paragraphs. They look good on the draft and the review, then show up in one megaparagraph.
Most of all, however, I'm sorry you failed to grasp what I was trying to say while you were critiquing my typing.
RUMOR OF THE DAY: An ASA Operations Agent told me that he had heard ASA employees would be alllowed to keep Delta flight privileges for four (4) years before losing them. I find that hard to belive.
FACT OF THE DAY: Delta has entered into what Delta calls a "long term ASM contract" with ASA to provide the feeder traffic into the ATL hub for 15 years. This will remain in force no matter what SkyWest does with ASA, no matter how they paint the planes, no matter if they sell ASA again. The entity known as ASA will fly the DL master schedule and provide between 20-40K passengers (daily) for the DL ATL hub.
Again, my apologies to you, Spinproof, for what must be an interminable and uphill battle to read my offerings. This'll probably be the last one, as I am, in fact, paranoid.
Happy landings to all.

 

[spinproof]

I didn't fail to grasp anything. I don't see why you feel anywhere in my comments this applies. It is a simple matter of hitting the return bar a couple of times to seperate the paragraphs. Why is this so difficult to, as you say, grasp!

 

[bigshooter]

is that you Nat, if so thanks for all u have done for the pilots at asa we all thank you. Hope that things work out for us all. Improvise , Modify , Adapt , Overcome!

 

[JoeMerchant]

is that you Nat, if so thanks for all u have done for the pilots at asa we all thank you. Hope that things work out for us all. Improvise , Modify , Adapt , Overcome!

Well said bigshooter!

 

[ProLine4]

FACT OF THE DAY: Delta has entered into what Delta calls a "long term ASM contract" with ASA to provide the feeder traffic into the ATL hub for 15 years. This will remain in force no matter what SkyWest does with ASA, no matter how they paint the planes, no matter if they sell ASA again. The entity known as ASA will fly the DL master schedule and provide between 20-40K passengers (daily) for the DL ATL hub.

Excuse the skepticism, but that's a classic mgmt statement (one of many) designed to keep the masses from storming off the property and shutting the place down. They have to say that at this time, much like the response to "what will happen to my pass benefits/insurance" is "we will know more during the next 30-60 day transition period" (this was the response at the 1900 meeting last night from SB and BL).
With all this uncertainty mgmt has to spew the "everything is fine" crap so the airline can still (roughly) operate. Without incentives such as nonrev and insurance to keep working at this circus, every ramper, FA, gate agent, and other hourly employee might as well go work elsewhere for better pay and less hassle.
Mgmt probably learned that lesson from the hackjob DFW shutdown. The Sept 8, 2004 1730 meeting content boiled down to "If you are a pilot or FA, you will A) move, B) commute with no commuter clause, or C) quit. If you are not a pilot or FA,you will A) quit, or B) reapply AND re-interview for your current job elsewhere in the company."
There were people crying, fuming mad, mgmt was put on the spot, DB was up there being a jerk, I'll never forget it. Many people started quitting left and right, there was a shortage of rampers on the late shifts for weeks, etc. On Jan 31, the last day of operations, the place was mostly in chaos because it was all over for those poor workers at the end of their shift.

Sure, the ASA -certificate- may be contracted to DL for 15 yrs, blah blah blah, but you can't tell me OO has any obligation to maintain the ASA certificate's future operations with the current personnel. (Who cares about airplanes, thats irrelavent for this discussion.) Regardless of all the happy rhetoric that's going on now, employees would be foolish to think their ATL positions, pay and benefits are not subject to change dramatically with the new ownership.