ASA D-0 Flight Crew Babysitting

[John Pennekamp]

You are WRONG here! The FOM states in section 10-1.8 that "Flight Crew members are required to have a thorough knowledge of all applicable bulletins, memos and notices."

OK, that said...why is everyone getting so wrapped around the axel about this? The reason we are doing this "go to the gate, get the release and talk with the gate agent procedure" is because that is what delta does. It isn't a big deal...AND once we get all the jet bridges installed, it will be on the way. Walk down the concourse, stop at the counter to get release (and yes, COMMUNICATE with the agent while there), go to aircraft...if it needs something, call for it (which we have always done). Then if something is wrong, hold boarding, otherwise, board on time.

Not a big deal folks!

Spoken like a true ASA manager...

Key word: APPLICABLE.

And is ourASA email considered an official memo? I'm not even required to check ourASA unless it's a "priority message" and the union is even looking into that.

If it wasn't in my mailbox or the revisions file, it's not an official memo. Nice try, though.

And no, I'm not helping them out. I don't care what Delta does. I don't work for Delta! Why don't you people understand that? Why don't you just work for free? Go ahead and load the bags yourself too. Fuel the plane. Dump the lav. Whatever it takes in the name of "teamwork" . Yet we're not really part of that "team" unless they want something from us. If we want something from them, all of the sudden the team concept comes to a screeching halt.

 

[John Pennekamp]

We get profit sharing now...which means our performance has an impact (although I will admit somewhat indirectly) on what we make. Lets work together now people...

And those of you in management are going to make sure you hold it over our heads and squeeze a little extra work out of us for it too, apparently.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Be VERY CAREFUL about any communication with ramp personnel....

...there have been a few cases of flight crews being charged with racist remarks, sexual harrassment, and assault, all with "witnesses" to the accusation provided by ramp co-workers.

ALWAYS have a witness on your side before ANY exchanges with those people.

Bingo. And I guarantee their story will be the one believed. I talk to NO ONE.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Be VERY CAREFUL about any communication with ramp personnel....

...there have been a few cases of flight crews being charged with racist remarks, sexual harrassment, and assault, all with "witnesses" to the accusation provided by ramp co-workers.

ALWAYS have a witness on your side before ANY exchanges with those people.

This is a very troublesome comment. Has this happened? God, I hope people would be above either making a racist comment or making up a story about one.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Yes Stifler and 79%,

Now we are catching on. But, its more than just the money. Its about telling people who you work for with a straight face. I am SO TIRED OF BEING EMBARASSED to tell people where I work. "OH, you mean the airline that never gets me where I want to go on time....or loses my bag" (granted, we have little control over the bags now).

So you see, the money is great, but respect, enjoyment of our job, satisfaction for what we do, pride...those things are very important as well!

You can't change that with flight crews. The reason people hate us is that their flight is late (for reasons beyond our control like maintenance, wx, etc), the gate is mean, the ticket cost too much, you name it.

I'm sick and tired of the management lackeys at this company trying to blame everything on the flight crews, and holding us responsible to fix it.

 

[John Pennekamp]

As a side note...I whole heartedly disagree with this ENTIRE QUOTE. This "new" policy is not all that new to me. When possible, I try to go to the gate and get the release and chat with the gate agent. 99% of the time, they are open and friendly. I SET THE TONE AS THE CAPTAIN!! When I walk up with a smile on my face and am cordial to them, they warm up and react in kind. Its all in how you approach them (granted, every now and again, people have a bad day, but I have found negative responses to a kind approach to be very rare). I hear people calling ops all the time "barking" at them and then acting shocked when the response is rude...you all know what i am talking about! (and yes, I understand that it is frustrating when you call for a lav dump 5 times before it gets done...but that may not be OPS fault..don't take it out on them)

So, if you are getting a constant negative response, perhaps it isn't them...maybe its your negative approach? Just something to think about.

He sets the tone, lol. I'm picturing him jumping up and down at the gate shouting I AM THE CAPTAIN DAMNIT!!! RESPECT MY AUTHOTITAY!!!!

FL990, you need to stop. I don't tell you how to do your job, don't tell me how to do mine. You want to go play pattycake with the gate, good for you. Don't tell me to.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Really though, this is strictly an attempt by management to harass crews and payback for the new contract. Watch for more responsibilities being forced on the crews like we don't have enough to worry about.

At least someone "gets it"!!!

 

[Stifler's Mom]

You can't change that with flight crews. The reason people hate us is that their flight is late (for reasons beyond our control like maintenance, wx, etc), the gate is mean, the ticket cost too much, you name it.

I'm sick and tired of the management lackeys at this company trying to blame everything on the flight crews, and holding us responsible to fix it.

Consider yourself lucky that people deplane out the back of your aircraft. The rest of us are within earshot of those comments on a daily basis.

 

[John Pennekamp]

This is a very troublesome comment. Has this happened? God, I hope people would be above either making a racist comment or making up a story about one.

I've seen it as an ALPA rep. Several times. And funny, there were 3 rampers working the flight, but 5 will swear they "witnessedit".

 

[John Pennekamp]

Consider yourself lucky that people deplane out the back of your aircraft. The rest of us are within earshot of those comments on a daily basis.

True...

 

[blesko]

Sure, profit sharing, yadda yadda, we all have different motivating factors. Whether is money, job satisfaction, etc, that's all personal and individual. That's not the issue. The issue is accountability, or lack thereof. We all know our jobs, and they know we're supposed to be at the plane, and get it ready for departure. It's what we do. Its our job, go point A to point B.

The problem is: why are we now required to hold everyone accountable as a 3rd party contractor? Is it the fact that someone notices that we as pilots actually keep the operation afloat?

Or is it that Delta has no idea how ineffective the operation really is and someone from ASA (BH possibly?) wants to give Delta some raw numbers as to what's actually wrong?

When a plane pulls in, it must be cleaned, catered, lavs serviced, etc. Everytime, all the time. Its not a new concept. Every time I jumpseat on mother Delta, I dont see their pilots calling for fuel, catering, releases (even though their pilots go to the gate before they board the plane), but the below wing operations seem to go smoothly.

Point is, the below wing opeation needs to be held accountable....and we shouldn't be the ones to do it. If we're late to the airport from the hotel, we're accountable, if we blow a bag cart over with jetblast, we're accountable. We're held accountable for our jobs, they should be as well.

 

[Caveman]

.... (and yes, I understand that it is frustrating when you call for a lav dump 5 times before it gets done...but that may not be OPS fault..don't take it out on them)......

If OPS isn't rsponsible for ground handling, who is? It's absolutely their fault. Getting the lav dumped should be a routine part of ground handling.

Reading this thread has brought back some godawful memories of trying to negotiate the ATL DCI ramp cluster********************. It sounds like nothing has changed.

When I try and convince my friends still at regionals to get the hell out of there and move on it's this kind of stuff I talk about. I'm not saying flying for an LCC or major is always an operational delight, but by comparison to an average regional pilot's day it's a walk in the park.

 

[atlcrjdriver]

Some things on this board will never change. Someone at the G.O. makes a change/modifies a procedure and the FLinfo board goes crazy.

Going to get the release is simply another procedure from DL and frees up an agent for customer svc. I believe that Comair crews print the release for themselves in CVG. While you are at the gate if you have any issues that could delay boarding tell the agent and your "huddle" is done. If you need svcs, call ops as soon as possible.

Relax, Do your job and communicate your needs

 

[John Pennekamp]

Some things on this board will never change. Someone at the G.O. makes a change/modifies a procedure and the FLinfo board goes crazy.

Thenb why are you still here if you don't like it. The conversation is much more what you'd call "professional" over at APC. I'd call it boring. This stuff is what makes FI great. You can bitch about anything and get it off your chest!

Going to get the release is simply another procedure from DL and frees up an agent for customer svc. I believe that Comair crews print the release for themselves in CVG. While you are at the gate if you have any issues that could delay boarding tell the agent and your "huddle" is done. If you need svcs, call ops as soon as possible.

Relax, Do your job and communicate your needs

Why is Delta, who I don't work for, dictating policy to me? This is the point you are missing. If Delta wants better control over its product, assimilate us the way they did the rampers. Don't just boss us around and make us follow their rules for the same crappy money and benefits! THIS is the point!!!

 

[Cpt Oveur]

I think the point that Pennekamp is trying to make is that this is not the way it was done on the Connie

 

[John Pennekamp]

I think the point that Pennekamp is trying to make is that this is not the way it was done on the Connie

YOU GOT THAT RIGHT, SON!!!!

 

[atlcrjdriver]

Thenb why are you still here if you don't like it.

I am still here because I find it comical how even the smallest things can make your blood pressure rise. Did you also get thise upset when they stopped selling beer on sundays?:beer:

Also, your paycheck may not say Delta on it but if you follow the paper trail that is ultimately were the money comes from as they are our only customer. DL has been in business allot longer than ASA has been around. If the new procedures work then what difference does it make if the idea came from in-house or from DL.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Personally, I'm happy if the TLR isn't screwed up for the fourth time that day with the same mistake over and over and over.....

Now, thanks to Uncle Rico and his Sweet Huddle, I'll be wasting more time fighting the crowds and their unwieldy bags up and down the stairs to pick up a release and discuss overbookings and delays I can't possibly know about yet because I had to be there at D-35 and just got to the airplane about 8 minutes ago. I would have been there 2 minutes earlier, but the fat lady with two kids and a stroller wouldn't let me by.

 

[FL990]

JohnPen,

I really don't even know where to begin with you. It is difficult to debate you...NOT because of anything you say being valid, because it ISN'T...but because you hate everything about your life. Quite simply, you need to go somewhere else because I don't want to associate with someone like you. Everything you have said in your posts regarding my comments has been construed and wrong.

First, I am not management...just a line captain trying to make a living and enjoy life along the way. The only one of your comments that I will dignify with a specific response is in regards to the captain setting the tone. YOU TWISTED THAT BEYOND RECOGNITION. I DON'T DEMAND ANYTHING. What I was referring to in that post was that my ATTITUDE toward the job (and life in general for that matter) sets the tone. When i walk up to them with a smile, the react with a smile and are polite.

In summary JohnPen, every post you make on here is negative. Yes, ASA is not the best place to work, but I MAKE IT WHAT IT IS FOR ME! I show up, do what I can to get out on time and life is enjoyable. Try it some time...

For what its worth.

 

[crjskipper]

i respect jp since he has the cahones to speak his mind. i do disagree with most of what you say though jp, but respect it. i dont think this is that big of a deal, i go to the gate most of the time to get the release and find it makes most things simpler and run smooth.

i do have to ask why anyone would stay working at a place they dislike so much. like fl99 said, i shake my head at a lot of asa things, but dont think everyone i work for is a moron. i like my cps, most pilots fear them, i like my schedule, i like my pay, i like most of the people i work with.

and i dont think the gate thing is optional jp, unless you send your fo, is it really that bad? why dont you at least give it a try and see if it works. you never know.