ASA callback rumors

[JettBoii]

Those 50 seaters are hx. Delta wants nothing to do with them. They will furlough in the fall and so will we. The economy is not going to get any better. Being negative? No. Just realistic. Sucks for those that are layed off. Sucks for those that will be. Sucks for those that are 5 year F/O's that will be 6 year F/O's and maybe even 7. Think differently? Nobody knows. Dont think that you do. I hate it. So does everyone else that is waiting to upgrade or be recalled. Keep your teller job. May be better in the long run.

 

[CFI2766]

You really think captains' open time has any bearing on furloughed FO's?

Noooo, but the fact that IPs are flying the line as FOs, but still getting paid as captains, certainly is affecting the furloughed FO's.

Why again is this happening?

 

[rf285]

Those 50 seaters are hx. Delta wants nothing to do with them. They will furlough in the fall and so will we. The economy is not going to get any better. Being negative? No. Just realistic. Sucks for those that are layed off. Sucks for those that will be. Sucks for those that are 5 year F/O's that will be 6 year F/O's and maybe even 7. Think differently? Nobody knows. Dont think that you do. I hate it. So does everyone else that is waiting to upgrade or be recalled. Keep your teller job. May be better in the long run.

Delta as in mainline will furlough? I doubt it, costs too much now. Hope for the best for my former ASA guys.

 

[Tarzan]

Noooo, but the fact that IPs are flying the line as FOs, but still getting paid as captains, certainly is affecting the furloughed FO's.

Why again is this happening?

Yup. Bunch of BS. If you are getting paid to be a CA, get your sorry tail in the left and act like it. If you are not competent enough because you've spent your whole life in the training department, get paid FO pay.

 

[N1VIBS]

Noooo, but the fact that IPs are flying the line as FOs, but still getting paid as captains, certainly is affecting the furloughed FO's.

Why again is this happening?

The main reason is the contract allows it. Some IP's are bidding FO lines because they can get there top choices. As Captains they would not be senior enough to hold what they want. Fair? As I said before the contract and company allows it. Lets be honest, if any of us were relatively junior ip's, we would probably do the same thing. Not saying I like it, but I can certainly understand it.

 

[sweptback]

The main reason is the contract allows it. Some IP's are bidding FO lines because they can get there top choices. As Captains they would not be senior enough to hold what they want. Fair? As I said before the contract and company allows it. Lets be honest, if any of us were relatively junior ip's, we would probably do the same thing. Not saying I like it, but I can certainly understand it.

I believe the IPs were told to bid FO lines because of the shortage of FOs (something to do with furloughing maybe?) Also, there's not exactly a lot of training going on right now...

 

[Texx]

The main reason is the contract allows it. Some IP's are bidding FO lines because they can get there top choices. As Captains they would not be senior enough to hold what they want. Fair? As I said before the contract and company allows it. Lets be honest, if any of us were relatively junior ip's, we would probably do the same thing. Not saying I like it, but I can certainly understand it.

From one IP, they are being told / assigned to the right seat. Not by their choice.

 

[OCP]

From one IP, they are being told / assigned to the right seat. Not by their choice.

I'll second that.

 

[enuffalready]

question...

if an IP bids a line and is junior to me, does he get it ahead of me as an FO?

 

[CFI2766]

question...

if an IP bids a line and is junior to me, does he get it ahead of me as an FO?

The way I read the contract; no, they should not. I don't believe that there are any IP's left that are junior enough to put an existing 200 FO in that situation, though. I could, and probably am, be wrong on this.

 

[enuffalready]

just curious... i was hired in 2001.

 

[anon]

I believe all existing IP's are senior to that by at least 2 years.

 

[CFI2766]

From one IP, they are being told / assigned to the right seat. Not by their choice.

As an FO, I'm not sending any ill will to any one specific IP in this situation. I do fully believe that you were asked to fly the line by the folks that run the airline. From all I've researched on the subject, it wasn't a decision that the IPs made. I have, however, lost quite a bit of goodwill towards the company for making the decision to get through the summer by any means possible without bringing back any of the FOs that are currently on the street. Despicable actions like this are how businesses bring collective bargaining from their labor force upon themselves.

So far as the IPs flying as FOs, however, I do strongly believe that they should be paid as FOs. I understand that in several people's situations, it was in their best interests to fly as an FO rather than as a Captain. Let's face it, being an IP with the seniority on the FO list to pick the schedule that you want, have very little responsibility, yet still get paid as a Captain, is a good deal for the IP.
However, if forced to accept the pay of an FO, I doubt that any IP would have accepted the assignment. Let's play the devil's (management) advocate here: using the logic of helping the company to accept this (?) temporary assignment, why not really help the company? Obviously this assignement was meant to limit costs, why not really help the company out and accept FO pay for FO work? Get where I'm coming from as an FO?

 

[asayankee]

so....instead of bringing back some furloughs at $34 per hour.....they will pay the IP's roughly $95 per hour. Makes sense!!!

 

[Smoke Toliet]

Any idea exactly how many are in the right seat right now? I feel like i've be pushed back 20 in my seat.

 

[Texx]

so....instead of bringing back some furloughs at $34 per hour.....they will pay the IP's roughly $95 per hour. Makes sense!!!

Not enough work to keep them busy. You do the math. Look for more cuts after Sept. 2009.

 

[Texx]

As an FO, I'm not sending any ill will to any one specific IP in this situation. I do fully believe that you were asked to fly the line by the folks that run the airline. From all I've researched on the subject, it wasn't a decision that the IPs made. I have, however, lost quite a bit of goodwill towards the company for making the decision to get through the summer by any means possible without bringing back any of the FOs that are currently on the street. Despicable actions like this are how businesses bring collective bargaining from their labor force upon themselves.

So far as the IPs flying as FOs, however, I do strongly believe that they should be paid as FOs. I understand that in several people's situations, it was in their best interests to fly as an FO rather than as a Captain. Let's face it, being an IP with the seniority on the FO list to pick the schedule that you want, have very little responsibility, yet still get paid as a Captain, is a good deal for the IP.
However, if forced to accept the pay of an FO, I doubt that any IP would have accepted the assignment. Let's play the devil's (management) advocate here: using the logic of helping the company to accept this (?) temporary assignment, why not really help the company? Obviously this assignement was meant to limit costs, why not really help the company out and accept FO pay for FO work? Get where I'm coming from as an FO?

Did you vote for OR against the current contract?

 

[N1VIBS]

Obviously this assignement was meant to limit costs, why not really help the company out and accept FO pay for FO work? Get where I'm coming from as an FO?

I think you're living in a fantasy world. How many Captains (IP's or otherwise) are going to voluntarily accept Fo pay?

 

[Speedtape]

As an FO, I'm not sending any ill will to any one specific IP in this situation. I do fully believe that you were asked to fly the line by the folks that run the airline. From all I've researched on the subject, it wasn't a decision that the IPs made. I have, however, lost quite a bit of goodwill towards the company for making the decision to get through the summer by any means possible without bringing back any of the FOs that are currently on the street. Despicable actions like this are how businesses bring collective bargaining from their labor force upon themselves.

From your perspective, I know it does not seem fair. However, if it keeps this company afloat, then being one that is still here, I say do what you need to do. Bringing back pilots for 3-4 months would have cost more money, and I doubt many would want to come back with the guarantee of being on the street again in the fall. That would be despicable! I hope not, but I am guessing that there will be 57 more on the streets in the Fall.

So far as the IPs flying as FOs, however, I do strongly believe that they should be paid as FOs. I understand that in several people's situations, it was in their best interests to fly as an FO rather than as a Captain. Let's face it, being an IP with the seniority on the FO list to pick the schedule that you want, have very little responsibility, yet still get paid as a Captain, is a good deal for the IP.
However, if forced to accept the pay of an FO, I doubt that any IP would have accepted the assignment. Let's play the devil's (management) advocate here: using the logic of helping the company to accept this (?) temporary assignment, why not really help the company? Obviously this assignement was meant to limit costs, why not really help the company out and accept FO pay for FO work? Get where I'm coming from as an FO?

The IP's may be flying in the right seat, but they are still being paid Captain pay. The IP's and the Chief Pilots are the only pilots that can sit in either seat.

 

[Smacktard]

Not enough work to keep them busy. You do the math. Look for more cuts after Sept. 2009.

Given Delta's recent announcement about further cuts, consider this thread closed...the furloughed aren't coming back anytime soon.