APA's contract opener?

[magrs]

Thanks,

Again, pre-911 $$$ is the least that APA should ask for!

 

[EA6BDriver]

Having payed absolutely no attention to any of this BS for the last several years, I'm now mildly curious about one thing. What job does Brundage have at AMR?

 

[AA717driver]

ILS2--why is this contract any different than any other at AA? The first time I looked at the Green Book, it scared the crap outta me. There was nothing concrete there.

It's like a DFW friend said years ago--they put nothing in the contract then they write LOA's as time goes on to define the contract. These openers didn't surprise me a bit.

As for the "TWA-stacked" nego committee, I obviously know the individuals. One is a good friend. The other, I wouldn't trust as far as I could throw him.

But for you, that situation is less 'dangerous' than a 'PDP-stacked' committee would be for me.

What APA absolutely HAS to avoid is to become irreversibly divided into two camps (ie. radicals v. pro-company). That's exactly why the TWA MEC came up with the merger commitee we had. That's exactly why the negotiations went the way they did.

EA6B--Brundage is in charge of Employee Oppression at AMR. He's VERY busy.

Magrs--No. But you're REALLY close. TC

 

[aa73]

ILS2--why is this contract any different than any other at AA? The first time I looked at the Green Book, it scared the crap outta me. There was nothing concrete there.

It's like a DFW friend said years ago--they put nothing in the contract then they write LOA's as time goes on to define the contract. These openers didn't surprise me a bit.

As for the "TWA-stacked" nego committee, I obviously know the individuals. One is a good friend. The other, I wouldn't trust as far as I could throw him.

But for you, that situation is less 'dangerous' than a 'PDP-stacked' committee would be for me.

What APA absolutely HAS to avoid is to become irreversibly divided into two camps (ie. radicals v. pro-company). That's exactly why the TWA MEC came up with the merger commitee we had. That's exactly why the negotiations went the way they did.

EA6B--Brundage is in charge of Employee Oppression at AMR. He's VERY busy.

Magrs--No. But you're REALLY close. TC

Unfortunately, TC, APA has always, always been divided into two or more camps. This dates back to the B-scale days. However, I would venture that this is the first time in APA history that such a high percentage of pilots are united in the "pi$$ed off" department. This will hopefully be a good thing.

Brundage is actually an ex ACA pilot who I believe was also active in ALPA. Figures.

-R,
73

 

[ils2minimums]

ILS2--why is this contract any different than any other at AA? The first time I looked at the Green Book, it scared the crap outta me. There was nothing concrete there.

As for the "TWA-stacked" nego committee, I obviously know the individuals. One is a good friend. The other, I wouldn't trust as far as I could throw him.

But for you, that situation is less 'dangerous' than a 'PDP-stacked' committee would be for me.

I agree with you about the green book. It has morphed into a rough set of guidelines rather than the binding contract it is meant to be.

With regard to my statement referenced above, I have a very hard time accepting the premise that we fielded the best negotiating committee possible, no offense intended to your friend. American Airlines has 9 pilot bases and a 5 member negotiating committee. STL is one of the smallest bases and the TWA pilots are a very small percentage of our pilot group, yet the negotiating committee is comprised of 60% STL and 40% TWA? The ability of this committee to negotiate a contract that is not concessionary is questionable and quite frankly, doubtful. Their accomplishments must be viewed throught the prism of the last couple of TWA contracts. This negotiating committee appears to be good at two things; concessions and PBS, the latter of which would be a disaster for this pilot group on the same level as the B-scale.

What about the PDP would be 'dangerous' for you? They are a group of pilots who want substantial improvements in total compensation, improvements in QOL and a union leadership that not mired in corruption and self-serving motives. They are not 'radicals' (whatever that means), and if you think so, I'd like to know what leads you to believe it, other than rumor. If you haven't done so already, I'd suggest that you go to the PDP website and look around at some of the tireless work their pilot advocates have done, and to participate in the Free Speech Zone forum. If you've not been over there and would like to, I'll PM you the URL for their site. Our careers and QOL are being handed to AMR by the leadership of APA, who sees their future not as pilots, but as managers at AMR. At a time when the company is making money, and the top 1000 managers received bonuses totaling $100,000,000, the negotiating committee should be seeking to restore our pay and get our furloughees back. Instead, they're contemplating givebacks through PLI and PBS. Hopefully the upcoming national elections will clean house down in DFW and put some guys in charge who are pilots, not MBA's and management-wannabe's. ALPA did it recently, hopefully the APA membership will do the same thing.

 

[AA717driver]

ils2--I've spent enough time on C&R and have gotten enough PDP emails to know that they wouldn't lose a wink of sleep if CC went away tomorrow.

I'll be more than willing to replace the word "radical" with "hardliner" but I won't water it down any more than that--I was one of the hardliners at TWA for quite a while.

There is certainly a place for the PDP. We've seen what the "kinder, gentler" approach gets with AA. Unfortunately, people like Sammy, Shayman and Pliske make me uneasy. I've seen them before in different uniforms.

I do agree that APA probably doesn't have the best people avilable on many of the committees. The Nego. Comm. is particularly difficult for people to work on because you have to live in DFW most of the time. That limits you to those who do live there or are willing to spend 5 days a week or more away from their families (not that there are a shortage of people willing to do that in this business). TC

 

[Swaayze]

Yes, Brundage was the ACA MEC Chairman for quite some time. He was highly regarded within ALPA and chaired the original do-nothing Scope Committee that had a chance to recommend negotiating standards within ALPA 10 years ago.

 

[magrs]

What is the ballpark date for having a contract agreed upon?

 

[80drvr]

What is the ballpark date for having a contract agreed upon?

2010.