Any news from Washington from ASA/alpa?

[JoeMerchant]

You know the answer to that one. I guess we agree on that issue.

Yes we do. WF says we have still been using this person as a "consultant" and that he still has an ALPA phone. Do you think that is true? If so, then isn't the current MEC partly to blame also?

 

[Texx]

Yes we do. WF says we have still been using this person as a "consultant" and that he still has an ALPA phone. Do you think that is true? If so, then isn't the current MEC partly to blame also?

No comment.

 

[regionalcap]

ASA made about half of that, which would be about 75 million. Throw in the rest of the improvements, and the total increased cost would be about 75 million, maybe more. No company in their right mind would agree to give over their entire annual net profit to one employee group. What happens when the other employees then want the same thing? ASA quickly goes from profitable to losing money.... not going to happen....

Put your request under your pillow..... the tooth fairy is more likely to deliver.....

As far as the "5 years of negotiating", that cuts both ways. BOTH sides have drug their heels at different points. It was actually our side that started dragging out feet.... we were waiting for better times.... that didn't work out so well now, did it?

I still disgree with your line of thinking on retro pay. It does not contribute to future operating cost. Are we going to cost 75 million more annually now? NO! Retro pay is a one time deal. How much as ASA made in the last 5 years?
Heck, Skywest INC has over 600 million in the bank.

 

[GearUpLightsIn]

2​

1. [FONT=Arial,Arial]
   Mediated negotiations resumed Friday in Washington, D.C. We are disappointed to report that after two days of intense negotiations we were unable to reach a tentative agreement. The remaining open issues have been narrowed to five. They are: Scope, Pay rates, Retro pay, Duty rigs and Retirement 401(k) contributions.
   The Association tried various approaches in attempting to resolve the open issues. The mediators were very helpful in trying to bring the parties to agreement but despite their efforts we were unable to reach an acceptable agreement. Here is a breakdown of the remaining open issues:​
   1. •
   1. [FONT=Arial,Arial]Scope: [/FONT]The Association attempted two different approaches to protect our jobs. Both concepts have been rejected by management. Management’s offer was woefully inadequate and would not provide the job security that the ASA pilots have demanded.
      
      [*]• [FONT=Arial,Arial]Pay rates: [/FONT]Management offered SkyWest rates on the CR2 but offered no cost of living allowance (COLA) increases for the duration of the agreement. On the CRJ 700, management offered a date of signing increase of 1 percent as previously proposed but with no additional increases.
      
      [*]• [FONT=Arial,Arial]Duty Rigs: [/FONT]The parties are apart on the application of the duty rig. The company-proposed duty rig would only apply to scheduled duty and the Association’s position should apply to all time on duty.
      
      [*]• [FONT=Arial,Arial]Retro pay: [/FONT]Management offered a signing bonus of two million dollars for the entire pilot group. Such an offer is obviously inadequate, especially after four and one-half years of negotiations.
   1. [/FONT]
      [FONT=Arial,Arial]
   
   [*]• [/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial]Retirement: [/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial]Management failed to offer any increase over their last proposal which only provides an increase to pilots with 10 years or more years of service.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Arial]

There were several issues agreed to, such as line check override pay, long term disability insurance, and new hire pay.​

[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial]The session was adjourned by the mediators in the evening. The mediators will now be reporting to the members of the National Mediation Board (NMB) who will ultimately decide how our case will proceed. At this time we do not know when the NMB will advise the Association as to how this case will be handled. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Arial]The CNC believes that our proposals are very reasonable. We tried various methods to resolve the open issues and showed flexibility in trying to reach an agreement, while maintaining the positions necessary to achieve the agreement that you have demanded and deserve. The CNC will report any new information as soon as we receive it. [/FONT]​

 

[GearUpLightsIn]

My copy and paste skills suck, but the info is there.

 

[JoeMerchant]

No comment.

I'll take that as an affirmative.

So we have established that mistakes have been on the local level, and I think we can all agree that mistakes have been made on a national level... so maybe we should make some changes..... just a thought....

 

[DrunkIrishman]

I'd like to point out that a poll is a scientific sampling; whereas, a census is a 100% participant turnout. What some of you are looking for is a census, not a poll.

Joe-

Your JayWalking example is weak at best. I don't need to know the difference in LEC/MEC to tell you what my contract goals are when I am polled.

 

[JoeMerchant]

I still disgree with your line of thinking on retro pay. It does not contribute to future operating cost. Are we going to cost 75 million more annually now? NO! Retro pay is a one time deal. How much as ASA made in the last 5 years?
Heck, Skywest INC has over 600 million in the bank.

Fine... I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.... but don't cry when this goes on for another 2 or 3 years while you still hold out for that big backpay check. Meanwhile, the deficit increases as we hold out....

 

[JoeMerchant]

I'd like to point out that a poll is a scientific sampling; whereas, a census is a 100% participant turnout. What some of you are looking for is a census, not a poll.

Joe-

Your JayWalking example is weak at best. I don't need to know the difference in LEC/MEC to tell you what my contract goals are when I am polled.

Drunk,

You're more educated on these issues than the average pilot. My point was that the average pilot doesn't understand ALPA, the RLA, negotiations, or what the industry standard is, but they are demanding these things.... They don't even know who their reps. are..... Democracy is a dangerous thing if the population isn't educated...

Oh and what everyone here is asking for is actually a survey, not a census... nobody is asking for a count of the pilots...

 

[ohplease!]

Your right, but that is only because this is dragging out so long and the majors are hiring now. The backpay/bonus cost will continue to become a smaller piece of the total cost... and at some point it will become palatable to management. The longer this drags out, the smaller the total cost of what we are asking for becomes.... as longevity continues to shrink, costs are coming down.

I agree with you, but this was based on the pilot who told 79%N1 that he expected $40,000 in back pay... to simplify I cut that in half.... It just isn't realistic for people to be expecting $40,000 or even half of that in back pay....

agreed. 40k is "pie in the sky" so is 20K.

 

[John Pennekamp]

So two days passed and all they could agree on is line check pay, disability pay, and new hire pay. But I bet they had some great dinners and lots of jocular back slapping at the bar.

And now we get to stew for another three months as we watch our assets and routes continue to be transfered to other airlines. Way to go, y'all!

Maybe it's time to give the "other" coalition a shot...

 

[Tomct]

agreed. 40k is "pie in the sky" so is 20K.

Ask the ConEx pilots if that is Pie in the sky?

 

[MELIT]

No comment.

Then don't comment!

 

[ohplease!]

Ask the ConEx pilots if that is Pie in the sky?

apples to oranges. Not that I'd expect you to be able to understand.

 

[Tomct]

apples to oranges. Not that I'd expect you to be able to understand.

When do you leave us??? Of course you have this LAME comeback....you have NO FAITH in your pilot group! I believe that I can speak for everyone here...except your boyfried Joe, when I say....PLEASE make it soon. YOU are a DISGRACE to this PILOT GROUP! Unfortunately the folks at Airtran didn't see you for the dirtbag that you are....GOOD RIDANCE!!:smash:

 

[ohplease!]

When do you leave us??? Of course you have this LAME comeback....you have NO FAITH in your pilot group! I believe that I can speak for everyone here...except your boyfried Joe, when I say....PLEASE make it soon. YOU are a DISGRACE to this PILOT GROUP! Unfortunately the folks at Airtran didn't see you for the dirtbag that you are....GOOD RIDANCE!!:smash:

who said anything about Airtran?

 

[Tomct]

who said anything about Airtran?

Oh, I should have known....SKYBUS! NICE!!!!

 

[DrunkIrishman]

Cesus:

"A census is the process of obtaining information about every member of a population (not necessarily a human population). The term is mostly used in connection with national 'population and housing censuses' (to be taken every 10 years according to United Nations recommendations); agriculture censuses (all agriculture units) and business censuses (all enterprises)."

 

[FightingIrish]

Who cares what you call it, just put something out for all of us to vote on! This is getting old.

 

[ASARJMan]

Who cares what you call it, just put something out for all of us to vote on! This is getting old.

There has to be a TA first. There is not one at this time. The MEC and CNC are only doing what the majority want. I myself wouldn't mind looking at where we're at too, but it's not the way it works. And no COLA for the length of the contract? You gotta be sheting me BL! While you and the rest of the mgt idiots get your bonuses, but nothing for anyone else huh?