Another ignorant celebrity

[Ty Webb]

Originally posted by ifly4food
I think it's sad that we as Americans are so brainwashed by the White House rhetoric that we changed our minds so quickly. Before the bombs fell, over 60% of Americans opposed the war. Now, over 60% are in favor

Did you ever think that maybe it is you who are brainwashed by the media, nearly all of whom have a strong anti-war bias? The numbers are more like 75% in favor, right now, and it is not because of rhetoric.


, and we're publicly crucifying a singer for speaking her mind.

Wake up, IFF. Freedom of speech does NOT mean that the people who hear that speech won't become angry and do some "speaking" themselves . . . . and that is what happened here.

It's sad that we have gotten to the point where we punish people for speaking their minds. Being able to speak your mind is what America was founded on. That's freedom. You don't have to agree with Ms Maines, but you don't have to punish her by boycotting her.

Maines used her forum as a singer to state her message. Her audience can't get up on stage and grab the mike to rebut her remarks, so they are sending their message through the means available to them . .. It's not "punishing" her.

I just went and bought their new CD. It's great. I'm also calling my local radio stations to request their songs.

Don't you see the hypocrisy of what you are saying? You agreed with her, so you called radio stations, and bought their CD. The others disagreed with her, and refused to buy her CD and called radio stations to complain.

We need more people with that courage and less who are willing to march in lockstep just because their government tells them they should.

Dude, drop the hackey-sack, and look around you. You are being manipulated. There were more civilians dying in Iraq each week before this campaign than during (source: NPR!). Those countries who went against us have huge economic and political reasons to do so, completely unrelated to the Iraqi people.

Maybe you should spend a little more time reading about the real facts of what is going on in the Middle East, and a little less time drinking wine coolers and listening to some singing airheads.

 

[Buffettpilot]

Here is something folks might want to think about.

You say what you mean, then you stand behind your words!!!!

Why would you say something, then after a backlash, recant your quote. The Ditsy Chicks did just that. Talk of being ashamed that the president is from texas, then the following day say....opps, I'm sorry, I didn't mean that, I support the president, etc....

If you are going to say something, stand behind your word. Don't just waffle around on your beliefs because you think it might effect your album and concert sales.

 

[HueyPilot]

Our allies

Reasons why our "allies" aren't with us....

France- Since as early as 1996, France (along with Russia...suprised?) advocated a total lift of the sanctions on the Hussein regime. The reason? There were millions of Francs locked up in Iraqi oil deals put on hiatus because of the sanctions, and Iraq was one of Dassault/Aerospatiale/Eurocopter's better Middle Eastern clients.

Russia- Not suprising, there was quite a bit of illegal sales of Iraqi oil outside the "Oil for Food" program. Of course Iraq couldn't do this by themselves....help came in part through a smuggling cartel that involved Jordanian and Syrian business interests, and a Russian oil production firm that helped Iraq sell illegal Iraqi oil to the Russian federation. Russia has always had close oil ties with Iraq, going back to the USSR days. And upon the end of the 1991 war, the USSR lost out on unfullfilled oil deals, as well as having to deal with a now-bankrupt Iraq that was unable to repay Russia the millions of dollars Iraq owed it from providing the bulk of Hussein's military might in the form of tanks, airplanes, guns, cannons, missiles and other hardware. Russia also lost out on the lucrative support and maintenance deals to repair all this equipment because the sanctions also banned these as well. So, Russia has a significant financial interest in Iraq (and the Hussein regime in particular).

Germany- Schroeder was facing a possible defeat, until W. saved him. Yes, our G. W. Bush. Germany had been experiencing one of the more serious economic downturns in German recent history, and Schroeder's administration was taking alot of heat for it. Then came talk of war in Iraq, and the German people, who in the past 50 years have always been hesitant to commit to war (even in 1991, they only provided limited support compared to other allies). Schroeder hit upon this as his re-election platform, to brush the economy under the rug for now and focus on the anti-war stance. This won him a slim victory in Germany, and since then he has continued to push the anti-war rhetoric while in the backstage has frantically tried to fix the economy, so far to no avail. One wonders if Germany would have been so inflexible had it not been those circumstances. Germany has always leaned anti-war since WWII, so the fact that they oppose the war isn't too suprising...but the vigor with which Schroeder attacked this issue smacks of political maneuvering to resurrect his ailing administration.

China- Gee, this is a no-brainer. China opposed the 1991 Gulf War too, so it's not suprising at all to expect the Chinese government to oppose this one. And since when has China ever been an "ally"? It's openly stated by Chinese doctrine that they fully expect to become the new super power to balance the USA.


Alot of jokes have been made of the "coalition of the willing". Granted, many of the countries are there as garnishing. But some of the countries, while not political heavyweights like the French and Russian, do hold sway within NATO, and are at least moderately affluent on the world power stage. Spain, Italy, Australia, UK, Japan are all countries with a decent amount of credibility. Add in rapidly growing and developing countries like Bulgaria, Hungary, and Poland (who are on the way to becoming influential within the EU...so long as France doesn't "black ball" them), and the list does show at least a moderate amount of support.

 

[ArcticFlier]

Snakum,

Don't let all of these chickenhawks get you down. By signing on the dotted line, you've done a lot more for this country than they ever will. They're all talking out of their fourth point of contact anyway.

chickenhawk motto- I'm all for going to war, just as long as its not me.

So that makes him better than someone who hasn't served?

AF

 

[ArcticFlier]

Chickenhawk,

First of all, the term "chickenhawk" is a commonly used term for people that talk tough on war issues, but never served or avoided service in the military. Kind of like Trent LOtt and Tom Delay and Dick Cheny. These guys are big on war, but when Uncle Sam was calling them during Vietnam, they said, sorry, not for me.

You forgot Bill Clinton..............you know.....the last President ............the guy who "loathes the military."

AF

 

[HueyPilot]

For the war does not = afraid to serve

It was that quote by Toecutter that got to me....somehow if you advocate this war, you're a "chickenhawk", and they assume (wrongly) that most of us harbor a phobia of wearing the uniform. I've worn it for 11 years. I just got notified I'm going to deploy over there in the near future, so spare me the whole "you are for war but afraid to serve" garbage.

Truth be told, 90% of those opposed to the war have the benefit of doing so from their living room armchairs. So you can stop lecturing me on how I'm a "chickenhawk" as I pack my bags for my "undisclosed location".

 

[ArcticFlier]

Re: For the war does not = afraid to serve

It was that quote by Toecutter that got to me....somehow if you advocate this war, you're a "chickenhawk", and they assume (wrongly) that most of us harbor a phobia of wearing the uniform. I've worn it for 11 years. I just got notified I'm going to deploy over there in the near future, so spare me the whole "you are for war but afraid to serve" garbage.

Truth be told, 90% of those opposed to the war have the benefit of doing so from their living room armchairs. So you can stop lecturing me on how I'm a "chickenhawk" as I pack my bags for my "undisclosed location".

Good luck..............................................

AF

 

[FL000]

I think it's sad that we as Americans are so brainwashed by the White House rhetoric that we changed our minds so quickly. Before the bombs fell, over 60% of Americans opposed the war. Now, over 60% are in favor, and we're publicly crucifying a singer for speaking her mind.

It's sad that we have gotten to the point where we punish people for speaking their minds. Being able to speak your mind is what America was founded on. That's freedom. You don't have to agree with Ms Maines, but you don't have to punish her by boycotting her. Frankly, I find that extremely childish to do so.

Boeingman says he "ordered their music removed from his clubs". I say I hope someone at the controls of a heavy Boeing has more maturity than that.

I just went and bought their new CD. It's great. I'm also calling my local radio stations to request their songs.
I disagree with Ms Maines's statement , but support her for having the courage to speak up.

We need more people with that courage and less who are willing to march in lockstep just because their government tells them they should.

That kind of thing happened in Germany in the late 1930s too.

Yeah, really brave of Ms. Maines to spout that verbal fecal matter off to a bunch of bee-bop Brits. I'd like to see her try that in her home state to see how many of her fans agree with her. She thought she'd just try to endear herself to a sympathetic audience without repercussions from back home since they'd probably never hear the statement anyway. That's not brave. It's absolutely cowardly. Well now she's getting what she very well deserves. Her former fans are speaking their opinions just as Ms. Maines spoke hers. The difference is they are speaking with their wallets and their actions. Are you saying that they do not have the right to do so? They feel just as strongly against her statement as she does for it. So they are now the villains??

To your first point...White House rhetoric?? Brainwashed?? Are you joking?? The White House is fighting an uphill battle against the press who can focus only on the negative. Despite this, poll after poll shows GROWTH in the President's support from the American public up to 73%. Even CNN admitted that the latest numbers were a reality check for them. For all rebuttals regarding media manipulation, please refer to Bias, by Bernie Goldberg. The 30-year CBS news veteran can lay it out much better than I can.

It's strange how the liberals are the only ones who think they are entitled to "speak their minds". Any opinions contrary to theirs are considered "immature", "punishing" and "crucifying".

I saw that idiot Janeane Garofalo on HBO last night. She was laying down some of the same hypocrisy.

 

[Timebuilder]

First of all, the term "chickenhawk" is a commonly used term for people that talk tough on war issues, but never served or avoided service in the military. Kind of like Trent LOtt and Tom Delay and Dick Cheny. These guys are big on war, but when Uncle Sam was calling them during Vietnam, they said, sorry, not for me.

Whew! For a minute there, I thought this applied to me. Luckily, I never used the 2-S deferment that I could have invoked, and took the risk of being 1-A for my time in "the pool". According to my friends in special ops, I was making the right move at the time.


On the UN: in the past 30 years, the UN has become a club for socialist nations, terrorists, and their appeasers. While trying to get the security council on board for this action, Bush finally had to make the hard choice and do what had to be done. What a refreshing change, to have a president who has a pair, sees his duty, and does it.

I'm not mad at the Dixie Chicks for speaking their mind. I'm frankly glad that they cleared up any misconceptions we might have had about their politics. I'm a little appalled that we can still produce young people who would say something so stupid.
While everyone is free to exercise their free speech right, a discerning and intelligent person will recognize when and where to exercise this right. Apparently, the Chicks made a poor decision. Perhaps they can feel better, knowing that they may become popular in France.

Perhaps they can do a double bill with Jerry Lewis.

 

[ArcticFlier]

UN with the U.S.....................an overfunded international debate society.

UN without the U.S.................a way underfunded and underdefended international debate society.

Either way...........just a bunch of hot air in New York.

AF