An open letter to the pilots of Skywest

[erikgigem]

We have negotiated this to protect us AND the pilots we affect in the indutry. In fact our union was working with protecting MESA pilots in the event that we took some of their flying from Delta. Why? Because it's the right thing to do. Those are the things we've done to improve the profession.

What are your thoughts?

While we all moan about our unions - unions are an asset for job protection from unfair management decisions and making sure (hopefully) the right thing is being done (by the company).

I applaud this because we cannot allow any codeshare or regional to leverage the pilot groups based on who gets paid the least. Healthy compeitition between the regionals in the free market should come from (1) a quality product (safety record, ontime performance, completiion factor, etc..) (2) reliability and (3) quality service to the customer.

 

[Superpilot92]

All the XJT pilots have to do is VOTE NO! Giving up scope isnt worth letting skywest whipsaw you all while furloughing XJT pilots and "offering" pref, interviews for you to start all over at hte same company that just furloughed you. absolute BS and that is why a union is needed, so to stop whipsawing. Whipsawing is mgmts wet dream for keeping regional pay down. Until everyone sees that then it wont get any better. ALPA has its problems but they are a necessary evil in this industry. The real shame is everytime a regional "peaks" they instantly become a target. Look at the history of the "good" regionals, they get really big and do really well and then before you know it the cycle comes full circle. Vote NO! Good luck XJT

 

[HockleyPilot]

Mcpickle, I certainly understand what you are saying....Again, I really do. And if I read this as a XJT pilot, I would probably say the same thing.


But, you act like there is a VIABLE alternative to the situation. You look down on me because I am realistic about today's industry. I would love to take a stand if there is even a snowball's chance in hell it would work.......But right now is not the time.

You want to be a regional but act like a Major with regards to it's power. You have none! CAL/UAL, etc. can show you, me, us, everyone the door if we flex more muscle than the sytem can hold. Anything else is just foolish.

You can't just demand things like when you were the only CAL carrier or even the only, wholly owned, regional for CAL. The leverage right now, is gone. The majors can atleast try to play hardball, while defending their routes and ops. (but they haven't given all they can give and rightly so) YOUR routes on the otherhand, along with mine, are not ours. With $120 oil and possible shrinking feed, we have nothing. Zip.

We can try to be a major but as long as the UAL's and CAL's control the payments and the routes, we can do nothing. Again, not defeatist, just realistic when you have 4 months or so, cash on hand. You act like if you lose the CPA next month that you can just place those planes. Again, it's not the 90's or the post 9/11 environment for RJ's.

You will call me names and call me weak. Call me a fool and say I the reason for bringing the industry down. You will call me a bottomfeeder and that I have no heart. Sir, I believe you are wrong.

Just so you know, I don't like where this is going. I could "take a stand" with you and say right now that I deserve 150 dollars to fly a CRJ for one hour. SkW could do that and lose all it's contracts, and we would go down with you.
You blame me for being productive and a company sheep, when in reality, I am just maximizing my output for the company. Does the company notice.... Nope? But I have a decent job and don't work very hard. Am I properly compensated? Nope? But, again it is the reality of today's environment. So what do we do? I am open ears.....

I guess the schools we build in Texas go to the highest bidder. Nope. Let's try again. I guess the highways are built by the highest bidder. Ah, nope again. I guess all contracts that are put out are ALWAYS won by the highest bidder. Nope, not even close.

Do some places that take the lowest bidder get burned? Absolutely. But I'm guessing that is a chance CAL is willing to take. But that's SKW pilots fault too. Also, haven't you noticed that since the Comair strike, all carriers, including CAL, isn't willing to have one carrier disrupt their ops ever again? Diversification, my friend. But you tell them what you want and what you willdo and that you run the show. That will show them. Wrong.

Look, I am not trying to flight and I respect your opinion even though you don't respect mine.

You see me as a punk kid, happy to steal flying from anyone I can. That just isn't it. You basically say, anyone with a opinion unlike mine is just wrong. No if, ands, or buts. We will have to agree to disagree.


PS. I could understand your attitude if the situation was like when the regionals were growing and the airline industry was extremely profitable. If Jerry tried to buy XJT during that time and you didn't like the offer, then fine ridicule us and say no and go your merry way. But, with the current situation, I am scratching my head to figure why you act like you have a sure-fire hand for the poker game when the house's cards are stacked against you.....

But I guess we will see. Again, good luck.

 

[MONKEY]

XJT finds itself in a very precarious situation. Who’s fault is it? Is it SKW pilots for not unionizing? Is it XJT management? How will this benefit SKW pilots?

I believe that most SKW pilots would prefer some type of union representation, but due to the MANY failures of ALPA with the majors and complete lack of representation of the regionals, it will not be anytime soon. ALPA has failed you. By failing to bring up the standards of Mesa, they force the bar down. You can serve your ALPA brand koolaide in any flavor you want. You can say that ALPA is only as strong as local leadership. BUT, if that’s the case ALPA national is only as strong as Mesa. When ALPA bargains for brand scope and truly begins to protect regionals you will see a change in attitude with our group. Until then I will go with the status quo.

Is your current state the fault of your management? I would have to say yes. Your management has built a great airline. You have a quality product and a great pilot group. The problem is, your management lacks vision. They thought that flying 50 seat aircraft for 1 carrier is a great business plan. When CAL took some of the flying and re-assigned it to Chataqua, your management backed you at the total cost of your business. This was a mistake. They put your entire workforce in jeopardy. I know, I know, it is all about the cost of oil right? Same thing happened to ACA. 50 seat rjs cannot operate profitably. When your management failed to diversify and/or place these aircraft with another major they failed you. At that point you were doomed to fail.

Now that your management has put you in this position, one of two things will happen:

Option 1: You are able to renegotiate scope with SKYW Inc. Hopefully if this happens, you will negotiate to keep all of your aircraft. Inc will demand that you give up your merger portion of your contract.
Option 2: You give SKYW management the finger and stand your moral ground. CAL pulls more of your aircraft and gives them to SKW. Now the aircraft will be flown by pilots on the SKW or ASA pilot seniority list.

I don’t think that either of these offers is pleasant, but I think you do have a say in the matter. I do believe that you could have the opportunity to negotiate with SKYW management to improve your situation. Your MEC should be negotiating right now.

Now if SKW pilots were the blood-sucking vampires that you portray, they would vote for option 2. After all, they would have quicker upgrades. I think that most of us here are hoping for option 1.

Good luck to all of you.

 

[yellowfever]

Mcpickle, I certainly understand what you are saying....Again, I really do. And if I read this as a XJT pilot, I would probably say the same thing.


But, you act like there is a VIABLE alternative to the situation. You look down on me because I am realistic about today's industry. I would love to take a stand if there is even a snowball's chance in hell it would work.......But right now is not the time.

You want to be a regional but act like a Major with regards to it's power. You have none! CAL/UAL, etc. can show you, me, us, everyone the door if we flex more muscle than the sytem can hold. Anything else is just foolish.

You can't just demand things like when you were the only CAL carrier or even the only, wholly owned, regional for CAL. The leverage right now, is gone. The majors can atleast try to play hardball, while defending their routes and ops. (but they haven't given all they can give and rightly so) YOUR routes on the otherhand, along with mine, are not ours. With $120 oil and possible shrinking feed, we have nothing. Zip.

We can try to be a major but as long as the UAL's and CAL's control the payments and the routes, we can do nothing. Again, not defeatist, just realistic when you have 4 months or so, cash on hand. You act like if you lose the CPA next month that you can just place those planes. Again, it's not the 90's or the post 9/11 environment for RJ's.

You will call me names and call me weak. Call me a fool and say I the reason for bringing the industry down. You will call me a bottomfeeder and that I have no heart. Sir, I believe you are wrong.

Just so you know, I don't like where this is going. I could "take a stand" with you and say right now that I deserve 150 dollars to fly a CRJ for one hour. SkW could do that and lose all it's contracts, and we would go down with you.
You blame me for being productive and a company sheep, when in reality, I am just maximizing my output for the company. Does the company notice.... Nope? But I have a decent job and don't work very hard. Am I properly compensated? Nope? But, again it is the reality of today's environment. So what do we do? I am open ears.....

I guess the schools we build in Texas go to the highest bidder. Nope. Let's try again. I guess the highways are built by the highest bidder. Ah, nope again. I guess all contracts that are put out are ALWAYS won by the highest bidder. Nope, not even close.

Do some places that take the lowest bidder get burned? Absolutely. But I'm guessing that is a chance CAL is willing to take. But that's SKW pilots fault too. Also, haven't you noticed that since the Comair strike, all carriers, including CAL, isn't willing to have one carrier disrupt their ops ever again? Diversification, my friend. But you tell them what you want and what you willdo and that you run the show. That will show them. Wrong.

Look, I am not trying to flight and I respect your opinion even though you don't respect mine.

You see me as a punk kid, happy to steal flying from anyone I can. That just isn't it. You basically say, anyone with a opinion unlike mine is just wrong. No if, ands, or buts. We will have to agree to disagree.


PS. I could understand your attitude if the situation was like when the regionals were growing and the airline industry was extremely profitable. If Jerry tried to buy XJT during that time and you didn't like the offer, then fine ridicule us and say no and go your merry way. But, with the current situation, I am scratching my head to figure why you act like you have a sure-fire hand for the poker game when the house's cards are stacked against you.....

But I guess we will see. Again, good luck.

Pattern bargaining could work, and that is one of the reasons that the expressjet contract is written the way it is. Unfortunately, it is difficult when you have a pilot group (Skywest) that is willing to fly a 99 seat jet for same rate that they fly a 50 seat jet for. You say now is not the time to make a stand, but the point is ... you can't ever take a stand. Your management has been telling you over and over how bad the industry is and that they can't pay you any more. In the mean time they saved enough money to buy a couple of airlines. This gives them an opportunity to pit you against the others and drive labor costs down (your pay/benefits). Fortunately, your management bought a pilot group that was willing to take a stand. Now the threats of bleeding a/c from that airline will not work.

 

[XPOO]

Yellow Fever...get your facts straight. No SkyWest pilot has flown anything over 50 seats for 50 seat pay in over 2 years now. That little jab of yours is totally asinine now.

 

[Hoodabundy]

I believe that most SKW pilots would prefer some type of union representation, but due to the MANY failures of ALPA with the majors and complete lack of representation of the regionals, it will not be anytime soon. ALPA has failed you.

As a SKW pilot I agree with this. I think a union is the answer, just not ALPA. I've been with an ALPA carrier before and was not impressed. A union is a necessary evil, but why does it always have to be ALPA???

 

[WAVIT Inbound]

way to change a quote, well done. if skywest goes to the grave doesn't that mean that everybody will then go to the grave. that also means that since we are "bottom-feeders" somebody would have to go lower, that must mean you!!!!! Bash mormons all you want, i'm not even one!!! plus i agree with that quote.

Then your both idiots.

 

[mckpickle]

Mcpickle, I certainly understand what you are saying....Again, I really do. And if I read this as a XJT pilot, I would probably say the same thing.


But, you act like there is a VIABLE alternative to the situation. You look down on me because I am realistic about today's industry. I would love to take a stand if there is even a snowball's chance in hell it would work.......But right now is not the time.

You want to be a regional but act like a Major with regards to it's power. You have none! CAL/UAL, etc. can show you, me, us, everyone the door if we flex more muscle than the sytem can hold. Anything else is just foolish.

You can't just demand things like when you were the only CAL carrier or even the only, wholly owned, regional for CAL. The leverage right now, is gone. The majors can atleast try to play hardball, while defending their routes and ops. (but they haven't given all they can give and rightly so) YOUR routes on the otherhand, along with mine, are not ours. With $120 oil and possible shrinking feed, we have nothing. Zip.

We can try to be a major but as long as the UAL's and CAL's control the payments and the routes, we can do nothing. Again, not defeatist, just realistic when you have 4 months or so, cash on hand. You act like if you lose the CPA next month that you can just place those planes. Again, it's not the 90's or the post 9/11 environment for RJ's.

You will call me names and call me weak. Call me a fool and say I the reason for bringing the industry down. You will call me a bottomfeeder and that I have no heart. Sir, I believe you are wrong.

Just so you know, I don't like where this is going. I could "take a stand" with you and say right now that I deserve 150 dollars to fly a CRJ for one hour. SkW could do that and lose all it's contracts, and we would go down with you.
You blame me for being productive and a company sheep, when in reality, I am just maximizing my output for the company. Does the company notice.... Nope? But I have a decent job and don't work very hard. Am I properly compensated? Nope? But, again it is the reality of today's environment. So what do we do? I am open ears.....

I guess the schools we build in Texas go to the highest bidder. Nope. Let's try again. I guess the highways are built by the highest bidder. Ah, nope again. I guess all contracts that are put out are ALWAYS won by the highest bidder. Nope, not even close.

Do some places that take the lowest bidder get burned? Absolutely. But I'm guessing that is a chance CAL is willing to take. But that's SKW pilots fault too. Also, haven't you noticed that since the Comair strike, all carriers, including CAL, isn't willing to have one carrier disrupt their ops ever again? Diversification, my friend. But you tell them what you want and what you willdo and that you run the show. That will show them. Wrong.

Look, I am not trying to flight and I respect your opinion even though you don't respect mine.

You see me as a punk kid, happy to steal flying from anyone I can. That just isn't it. You basically say, anyone with a opinion unlike mine is just wrong. No if, ands, or buts. We will have to agree to disagree.


PS. I could understand your attitude if the situation was like when the regionals were growing and the airline industry was extremely profitable. If Jerry tried to buy XJT during that time and you didn't like the offer, then fine ridicule us and say no and go your merry way. But, with the current situation, I am scratching my head to figure why you act like you have a sure-fire hand for the poker game when the house's cards are stacked against you.....

But I guess we will see. Again, good luck.

You're missing my point entirely. My point is, had SW pilots voted in a union you would have negotiated scope protection for yourselves and those whom you steam roll. This is not about pay. This is about scope. Thats all.

This is reality because you and your fellow pilots accept it as such. You haven't learned from what Mesa went through with Freedom. You haven't learned from what Chataqua went through, you haven't learned from what Trans States went through with Go Jets. What have you learned other than to look out for only yourselves? Your day will come. Long after myself, with 11 years and 10,000 hours is our of a job and out of aviation, your pilot group will be in this possition. I hope you learn before it's too late for you and whom ever else you take over.

I respect your opinion but may I humbly suggest there is a better way. One that you may have to fight for, as we did.

 

[yellowfever]

Yellow Fever...get your facts straight. No SkyWest pilot has flown anything over 50 seats for 50 seat pay in over 2 years now. That little jab of yours is totally asinine now.

I know my facts. You guys have a crj200 base rate. Your meager BHO is nothing. I know how it came about and I know how it works. Maybe YOU have never flown a 70/76 seat jet for a 200 rate, but the Skywest pilots do. Most pilots that value their skills do not defend the BHO. The pilot group will fly anything up to 99 seats for that 200 rate...even if it's a different type. Sim, ground instruction, training, vacation, sick time, soft pay, all at 50 seat rates. If Skywest gets E175's they will fly them at a CRJ200 rate (even in the sim). The jab is that Skywest was instrumental in driving down the earning potential in a a/c that has been stretched to 100 seats. These are not toys...they are airliners. This is my career, not yours (I understand you are a dispatcher...not a jab at what you do). I feel I have earned/deserve better pay/benefits than what Skywest has to offer. That is why I gave them my resignation.

 

[MYFpilot]

Yellow Fever...get your facts straight. No SkyWest pilot has flown anything over 50 seats for 50 seat pay in over 2 years now. That little jab of yours is totally asinine now.

Can you answer this riddle?

A SkyWest CRJ-200 pilot flys a 4 day trip with 3 hours of block time each day of the trip. A SkyWest CRJ-900 pilot flys the same 4 day trip with 3 hours of block time each day of the trip. Who makes more money?

 

[XPOO]

Can you answer this riddle?

A SkyWest CRJ-200 pilot flys a 4 day trip with 3 hours of block time each day of the trip. A SkyWest CRJ-900 pilot flys the same 4 day trip with 3 hours of block time each day of the trip. Who makes more money?

Uncle Jerry!

 

[XPOO]

....you have to work so many hours, credit so much of this, fly a lot of that.... yeah I understand. Not as stupid as you think.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Perhaps if ALPA national took a little time to UNIFY (novel concept for a union, eh?) all of its member pilot groups

Two edged sword... how do you get the membership to particapte if the leadership is poor, if the leadership is poor how do you get the membership invovled...

But here is the kicker... its domocracy and each pilots career... at some point a sense of ownership is going to have to kick in...

Just like any democracy...

and get behind things like a national seniority list

This is proven unworkable.... why do you even suggest it... and try to make ALPA accountable?

instead of pitting all of the member groups against each other in a massive clusterfark...maybe, just maybe, the pilots who don't have such a strained relationship with their
management would be more inclined to join.

Agreed. It is a double edged sword. The ALPA leadership can do better...

95% of an LEC membership showing up at a meeting saying we are mand and we want change....

Rez, you always talk about ALPA being as strong as the local leadership. As the outside man looking in, that tells me that national is weak.

Your first sentence...local leadership.. then you say National is weak...

Why should national be strong...?? Was it ever intended to be?

And, based solely on my conversations with friends that are pilots and what I read on this God-forsaken message board...it is the national, universal QOL issues that ALPA needs to be working on...and spending a little less time on the small things like the FFDO program and keeping Captain Kangaroo...er, I mean, Captain Prater's moustache so neatly trimmed.

So the two aren't connected. The power to get QOL issues is all about the RLA....

Don't get me wrong, I applaud ALPA's work as a safety advocate...however, there apparently needs to be more work on actually taking care of the livelihoods of the current member pilots before even considering chasing more membership.

Agreed... is minor minority particaption the key? Or should the leadership just do whatever they think is best... oh wait that is happening now...

I think, when faced with the decision of whether or not to organize, the average pilot doesn't put alot of thought into ALPA's advocacy on The Hill

Do you put allot of value in the things you take for granted? Satisfied needs are not motivators... IOW the only thing pilots want to know is... what has ALPA done for me....lately...

...they look at the state of QOL of other ALPA pilots. And, when they see the messes of US Airways/America West...ALPA pilots losing jobs left and right...and the general lack of brotherhood and unity amongst all of the ALPA pilot groups...not to mention the "Me vs. The World" and general unhappiness with life
mentality conveyed by many ALPA pilots...and can you see why 2/3 of SkyWest pilots might not want to join up.

The trick is to look beyond all of that... the above quote is big problems... but are those problems going to solved my apathetic members and non members?

I wish nothing but the best for the ExpressJet guys and gals. I truly hope this doesn't go down the way you guys are saying. However, if it does...you must remember that this is business...and your management deserves the blame, not the SkyWest line pilot.

SO if/when Skywest fails and all of you are suffering and it looks like your jobs are on the line... if we all turn our backs on you.... that is ok?

That is not my M.O. but it seems to be yours... so if the rest of the pilots treat you the way you are treating us... that's cool?

 

[HockleyPilot]

You're missing my point entirely. My point is, had SW pilots voted in a union you would have negotiated scope protection for yourselves and those whom you steam roll. This is not about pay. This is about scope. Thats all.

This is reality because you and your fellow pilots accept it as such. You haven't learned from what Mesa went through with Freedom. You haven't learned from what Chataqua went through, you haven't learned from what Trans States went through with Go Jets. What have you learned other than to look out for only yourselves? Your day will come. Long after myself, with 11 years and 10,000 hours is our of a job and out of aviation, your pilot group will be in this possition. I hope you learn before it's too late for you and whom ever else you take over.

I respect your opinion but may I humbly suggest there is a better way. One that you may have to fight for, as we did.

I appreciate your candor. I sincerely do.
I must also apoligize for my presumption with regards to your responses. You have been courteous with your posts even with your given disdain for for SKW pilots in general.

I am inclined to agree that scope is pivotal. Again, though, how to acheive uniform scope....still leaves alot to be desired.

For the record, I completely hope that CAL doesn't cave on scope and I would be all for (jet flying) to go back to the majors. Even if it meant I would be furloughed.