American Decapitated.

[enigma]

Re: JCJ

I have no doubt that the U.S. could "take" pakistan. But would the price of a nuke going off in New York or Washington D.C. be worth the price of such escalation?

There is an old saying that goes something like this: "Close doesn't count, except in nuclear warfare and horse shoes"

One Nuke detonated anywhere in the US, regardless of size or location, would absolutely devastate our economy, and our way of life for the rest of yours and my lifetime. Be careful what you wish for.....

jarhead, you've got to know that the islamists would have set off a bomb in New York on Sept, 11 had they had one. Listen closely, they started this conflict, and they are fighting it with all out effort. They are not the Government of Pakistan. Obviously, Pakistan understands the principle of mutually assured destruction, or said differently - they know that they would be wiped out regardless of the damage they do to us; Pakistan isn't a player in this deal. They are radical islamic terrorists who's game plan is warfare by terrorism. If they were reasonable people, they wouldn't have flown airplanes into buildings/ran boats into destroyers/bombed barracks; these scumbags think that they are doing gods work and they intend to wipe us out. I doubt that avoiding conflict with them will make much of an impact for peace.

enigma

 

[enigma]

liberal

adj.
etc. etc. etc.

Now define a modern political liberal. Tell me how Teddy Kennedy, John Kerry, Patty Murray, Chuck Schumer, Hillary Clinton fit your definition. 40 year Republican my a$$.

enigma

 

[jarhead]

Enigma

. I hear you, and I take your point. What I was alluding to was frequent irrational comments put forth on these boards, and other boards, that The U.S. Should just "nuke" all the Arab and Persian countries into oblivion. Also, it was not a nation state that did the 9-11 deed to us. That was a stateless, govenmentless (if that's a word) terror group known as Al Queda, and led by a Saudi extremist based originally in Afghanistan, and Islamic state, controlled by the Taliban Government.

The government of Pakistan has a very unstable history in Government authority. The current leader, Musharif, himself took power via the coup route. His control over his army and his populace is tenuous at best. Pakistan is an Islamic state.

If the people advocating "nuking' Iraq had their wish come true, the Islamic world in unison, would rise up against the U.S. Musharif would have no control, and the army there along with Islamic clerics would seize the government. No one would know who had control of Pakistan's nuclear arsenal, or where the nuclear codes would reside. Islam could create the dooms day scenario in this bizarro world.

 

[jarhead]

enigma

Why such hate and venom? I've done nothing to you but express opinions of mine. As an American, that is my right, and yours as well. I did vote Republican for 40 years, and you chose to call me a liar.

If you look up in dictionery.com, further information on the hated word "liberal", you will find the antonyms to be 'stingy' and 'close minded'. Are you either of those?

 

[Dizel8]

"Islam could create the dooms day scenario in this bizarro world."

I think that is what they are trying to do, their rally cry: Death to the infidels!

Okay, since you object to a nice warm nuke, how about a wee bit of carpet bombing a la Linebacker?

 

[jarhead]

Yes, some are! And we are at war with that radical extremist group who are trying to destroy America and kill us.

That said, it is an irresponsible position to take, that genocide for all Arabs is the answer, any more than genocide to all Irish people because of what Tim McVey did.

 

[Dizel8]

Well, other than Guiness, what has the Irish ever done for us?

On a more serious note. Yes, you are correct, we are at war with the radicals, but what has me somewhat peed off, is the fact, that we do not see an outcry in the Muslim world against those people. When we finally hear a bit of outrage, it is always followed by reasons as to why the americans had it coming, be it that we are occupiers, zionist lovers or infidels.

How about they gather their garb and call a spade a spade. Decry terrorism, denounce Jihad, call for the apprehension of terrorist. Now that would be something, but I am not holding my breath.

 

[jarhead]

The "River Dance"?

 

[Dizel8]

Okay, Guiness and the River Dance, but other than that, what have the Irish ever done for us?

 

[jarhead]

How about St. Patty's day parade in NYC, Boston. and Chicago, along with green beer on March 17th?

 

[TonyC]

He was dead well before they got his head all the way off.

... but he dies in about 15 seconds, ...

Well, I guess since he was dead before they got it ALL the way off, that makes it better. At least he couldn't scream any more after thay cut through his larnyx, and since we couldn't really see the terror in his eyes, we don't really know if he could still feel the pain when he could no longer scream.

I can't even believe I'm having this conversation. This is ludicrous. Go have someone drive a dumptruck on your arm for only 15 seconds, and then come back and tell us all how "at least" applies in any way.

Saying "at least ..." is tantamount to saying, "Well, it could have been worse." Frankly, what was seen in that video is the lowest low of anything even distantly related to humankind. NO, it could NOT have been worse. Different, perhaps. Worse, no.

Even if you think I'm wrong, I really don't think you want to start telling folks how you could have made it worse - - you don't want to go there.

 

[Dizel8]

Okay, so we got Guiness, River Dance and green beer on St.Paddys day, but it's not like they gave us sanitation, medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, a fresh-water system or public health, so really, how much has the Irish ever done for us?

 

[flyifrvfr]

Jarhead,
Did you watch the video? If so does it make you mad to see it, and if it does make you mad are you mad at the cowards that did this to him, or the few soldiers who supposedly brought this on by humiliating the iraqi prisioners?

The U.S. soldiers who humiliated the iraqi prisoners did not bring this on. Remember Wall Street journalist Daniel Pearl, he was executed? Remember Jessica Lynch's company who got lost and soldiers in her company who were hostages were executed? Remember the four civilians who were burned, dismembered, and strung from a bridge? These executions happened before the photos of the prisoners were published. These terrorists used the excuse of the treatment of prisoners to justify thier cause. The problem is the media published these photos in the name of the first amendment, but all they really did was put our country and it's people at greater risk.

There are certain things that happen that I don't need to know about and telling me only puts the country at risk. The other problem is that we are fighting an enemy which can't be distinguished from friendly people. These terrorists have no reguard for human life. How do you deal with an enemy who will take his own life to take yours. These people are evil, yet they do these evil things in the name of religion, go figure!

 

[FinalApproach]

what is it going to take

for us...the U.S. to wake up...

I saw the video and so did my brother....

My brother was part of the Forensic Odontology Go Team (volunteer) that identified the remains at the WTC...for 2 weeks...that's after putting in a full days work mind you ...when you have a discussion with him about those 2 weeks and what he witnessed...You'll understand then what truly is at stake here..

this whole issue surrounding the war...the jihad against us...political correctness...etc..and now this...

Talking ...rationalizing...liberal thinking... round table discussions among the powers that be...doesn't cut it anymore...our complacency is doing us in...in a very bad way...

Look at the evil we are contending with....until we truly feel the pain...worse than 9-11...maybe we'll wake up...and do what is necessary...

 

[Floyd94]

How do you deal with an enemy who will take his own life to take yours.

Carpet bombing, followed by nukes... as a result?

Iraq=51st US state

FinalApproach knows what Im talking about...

 

[captjim]

John 16:2b...in fact, a time is coming when anyone who kills you will think he is offering a service to God. 3 They will do such things because they have not known the Father or me. 4 I have told you this, so that when the time comes you will remember that I warned you.

If these five don't change their ways, and I have no reason to think they will; they will go to Hell, and rightly so. Things like this make me want to go to war. I'm having a real hard time feeling sorry for the detainees of the U.S. Army being 'humiliated.'

I avoid getting into conversations about religion and politics, but this I have to say this. God has a way of exacting revenge in such a way, that you have pity on those that have done wrong. "Vengeance is mine sayth the Lord". They will get what they deserve X 10!

 

[s.o.sJTB]

Re: Here's some related food for thought...

I am glad to be absent from these halls of banter, but here I am now with a true recent story that is relative to the battle that we face, for those of you familiar with Rick Mathes.

CC


Read below:

ALLAH OR JESUS



Stay Safe and May God Bless America


Allah or Jesus? by Rick Mathes


Last month I attended my annual training session that's required for maintaining my state prison security
clearance.

During the training session there was a presentation by three speakers representing the Roman Catholic,
Protestant and Muslim faiths, who explained each of their belief systems.



I was particularly interested in what the Islamic Imam had to say. The Imam gave a great presentation of
the basics of Islam, complete with a video.



After the presentations, time was provided for questions and answers. When it was my turn, I directed
my question to the Imam and asked: "Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but I understand that most Imams
and clerics of Islam have declared a holy jihad [Holy war] against the infidels of the world. And, that by
killing an infidel, which is a command to all Muslims, they are assured of a place in heaven. If that's the case,
can you give me the definition of an infidel?"



There was no disagreement with my statements and, without hesitation, he replied, "Non-believers!"


I responded, "So, let me make sure I have this straight. All followers of Allah have been commanded to kill
everyone who is not of your faith so they can go to Heaven. Is that correct?" The expression on his face
changed from one of authority and command to that of a little boy who had just gotten caught with his
hand in the cookie jar. He sheepishly replied, "Yes."



I then stated, "Well, sir, I have a real problem trying to imagine Pope John Paul commanding all Catholics
to kill those of your faith or Dr. Stanley ordering Protestants to do the same in order to go to Heaven!"



The Imam was speechless.



I continued, "I also have problem with being your friend when you and your brother clerics are telling your
followers to kill me. Let me ask you a question. Would you rather have your Allah who tells you to kill me
in order to go to Heaven or my Jesus who tells me to love you because I am going to Heaven and He wants
you to be with me?"



You could have heard a pin drop as the Imam hung his head in shame.


* * * *

Needless to say, the organizers and/or promoters of the 'Diversification' training seminar were not happy
with Rick's way of dealing with the Islamic Imam and exposing the truth about the Muslim's beliefs.


I think everyone in the US should be required to read this, but with the liberal justice system, liberal media,
and the ACLU, there is no way this will be widely publicized. Please pass this on to all your email contacts.


This is a true story and the author, Rick Mathes, is a well known leader in prison ministry.

This quote is about "killing infidels" is always taken out of context by non-Muslims and extremists.First of all when the Quran(Muslim holy book) mentions Infidels it does so in context of the Idol worshipping Arabs of Mecca. The Quran refers to Christians and Jews as "people of the book" believers in only one god. The revelation in the Quran that was being referred to was presented to the prophet Mohamed during a time of war. The Idol worshipping Arabs in Mecca had declared war on Mohammed and his teaching's of one God, the same monothesitc belifs taught by Abraham, Moses, Jesus, and Many other prophets. After Mohammed and his follower's were expelled from Mecca this was the revelation he gave:



"Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight you, but dont be the aggressors, because Allah dosent approve of aggression. Fight them wherever they are found, and drive them out from where they drove you out, because being oppressed is worse than being slaughtered...But if they cease being hostile,remeber that Allah is the forgiving, the source of all mercy. But if they continue to oppress people, then battle them until the oppression is no more and justice and faith in God prevail. If they seek peace, then you seek it as well."(Quran 2:191-194)


I dont believe the story Rick Mathes told...

 

[flyboydk]

How about we take the list of prisoners that they said they demanded the release of in exchange for Nick Berg, hack their heads off, throw their bodies in the street, let them have the video of their deaths... maybe they'll think about killing hostages next time. Some people say we shouldn't stoop to these animals' level, but I think that this is the only thing they will understand. Give them a taste of their own medicine. And how about their oil, I think to the winner go the spoils... I GUARANTEE you Bush would be re-elected if we took over Iraqi oil and dropped our gas prices to 50 cents a gallon.

 

[enigma]

Re: enigma

Why such hate and venom? I've done nothing to you but express opinions of mine. As an American, that is my right, and yours as well. I did vote Republican for 40 years, and you chose to call me a liar.

If you look up in dictionery.com, further information on the hated word "liberal", you will find the antonyms to be 'stingy' and 'close minded'. Are you either of those?

No hate here bud, however I do have a distaste for disengenous people.

No venom, just sarcasm.

Your words continue to sound like a lifelong Republican hater, instead of a lifelong Republican.

enigma

 

[Timebuilder]

I dont believe the story Rick Mathes told...

Unfortunately, that doesn't mean he did not tell it exactly as it happened, nor does it mean that the growing radical Muslim movement does not believe that all non-Muslims are the "infidel."