ALPA loses latest appeal in TWA lawsuit...

[Dizel8]

ALPA, despite it warts, are still the best thing we pilots have going for us.

 

[Dan Roman]

ALPA, despite it warts, are still the best thing we pilots have going for us.

Absolutely, most of it's criticism seems to ignore the fact that certain economic realities are out of their hand, they can't save the jobs of pilots working for inept or scrupulous management and ALPA is only as good as it's local reps and members make it. It's not ALPA nationals fault for many of the decisions individual airline groups have made.

 

[aa73]

64% of the pilots were stapled, 14 year captain stapled behind a new hire. Fact. I lived it.

Not to cherry pick but the exact percentage was more like 53% stapled, 47% integrated, a little more than half. Remarkably similar to the percentage of OZ pilots tacked on to the bottom of TWA under their Date of Hire integration (the same arbitrator was used in both deals.. no kidding.)

 

[aa73]

They got DOH period.

Yes, correct - they got DOH. However, the hiring demographics between OZ and TWA during those years resulted in approx. 55% of OZ pilots ending up on the bottom of the TWA List, despite DOH.

No different than if AA merges with Jetblue and gives them DOH - guess where the Jetblue pilots will end up?

 

[ironspud]

Yes, correct - they got DOH. However, the hiring demographics between OZ and TWA during those years resulted in approx. 55% of OZ pilots ending up on the bottom of the TWA List, despite DOH.

No different than if AA merges with Jetblue and gives them DOH - guess where the Jetblue pilots will end up?

...and the OZ Captains were seat protected for 3 years.

 

[dicko]

Ok. Thanks for the info!

Consider the source and their motivation with care.

If 1000 people witnessed Lee Moak carrying bags of cash into his house and burning his ALPA computers - PCL128 would describe it as a "clear victory for ALPA and big win for its members".

 

[Turtle21]

1 On strike with EAL. The president Duffy (DAL) gets very few if any striking Eastern pilots on with DAL...
2 UAL goes through there bad time with Duane (NWA) who tells us there is no money in the war chest for us....majically there is money when NWA needs it. At the same time my "ALPA brothers" at NWA and DAL are actually writing letters to Washington to convince them NOT to allow UAL any ATSB money. One of the two carriers that was actually attacked during 9/11
3 Later ALPA "forgives" all of my "new Coworkers" who crossed picket lines in 83 and the crews that walked right by us in 89 when we were on strike at EAL.

ALPA can not get flushed fast enough in my opinion.

+ plus 1

 

[Turtle21]

Does anybody know what this is going to mean for the membership. The Damages hearing is set for October, and rumor is that it will be more than the insurance can pay.

Will there be a dues increase or assessment?

Thanks.

Dream scenario.. Insurance pays max limit which doesn't cover whole bill, ALPA assesses the rest on members, which is so high they decertify and never pay, but all have new unions. Everyone that deserves to lives happily ever after. The End.

 

[B6Driver]

seriously?

Food for thought.....how was Ozark treated when TWA bought them? Hint, pretty similar to the way AA treated TWA. I know I know, two wrongs don't make a right, but it is food for thought when you consider that now AA is on the block and they mistreated TWA who mistreated Ozark..........

Danny boy, you're not a student of history are you?
Ozark received DOH with fences and you can Google it very easily.
I’ve heard the unfounded complaints and the facts shot them down in short order.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Absolutely, most of it's criticism seems to ignore the fact that certain economic realities are out of their hand, they can't save the jobs of pilots working for inept or scrupulous management and ALPA is only as good as it's local reps and members make it. It's not ALPA nationals fault for many of the decisions individual airline groups have made.

Really ? Want to try telling that to my "eastie brothers from another mother ? " Seems they didn't get the memo.:erm:


By the way, I agree.

PHXFLYR

 

[aa73]

...and the OZ Captains were seat protected for 3 years.

True... and I would expect the same to happen to Jetblue pilots if they got DOH as well (which I don't think they will, as they would all be on the bottom.)

Again, not judging what was fair and what wasn't - just making sure the facts are there.

 

[PCL_128]

Consider the source and their motivation with care.

If 1000 people witnessed Lee Moak carrying bags of cash into his house and burning his ALPA computers - PCL128 would describe it as a "clear victory for ALPA and big win for its members".

You must have me confused with someone who likes Lee Moak.

 

[SWA Bubba]

Agreed, There are too many emotions and different perspectives to ever be able to combine two seniority lists in a reasonable manner. It really should be decided by an impartial arbitration process, providing everyone agrees to accept it and not renege on giving their word like one group we all know did......

Wow Dan, you can't even talk about ALPA and its carriers without working in a Southwest slam. Say, are you still pretending that you're impartial and don't have anything against Southwest? Or did you give that up since no one believes you anymore?

Bubba

 

[KarmaPolice]

Consider the source and their motivation with care.

If 1000 people witnessed Lee Moak carrying bags of cash into his house and burning his ALPA computers - PCL128 would describe it as a "clear victory for ALPA and big win for its members".

Ha Ha Ha!

 

[XTW]

...and the OZ Captains were seat protected for 3 years.

Also, they were not fenced off the biggest equipment that their seniority numbers could hold when they lost their CA bids. Many were flying 747 and L1011 international as FOs. To this day, no former TWA pilot can bid the 777 as an FO, no matter what their assigned seniority number could hold.

X