Allegiant 4Q results in 23.4% operating margin and $25 million share buyback

[Daytonaflyer]

No worries, we're working on it. It's just a matter of time before our wages are standard for an airilne our size.

 

[Blue Dude]

That's what we said at JetBlue. We're still waiting.

 

[PCL_128]

No worries, we're working on it. It's just a matter of time before our wages are standard for an airilne our size.

How are you working on it? Is there a union drive going on?

 

[chperplt]

How are you working on it? Is there a union drive going on?

Why would we need a union drive? Our pilot advisory group (AAPAG) has gotten this pilot group a 40% increase in pay over the last 4 years. There's no reason to think they won't continue to make improvements to our pay and work rules as time goes on.

When we stop seeing improvements, we can talk about a union drive.

 

[PCL_128]

That's what I thought.

 

[Blue Dude]

Why would we need a union drive? Our pilot advisory group (AAPAG) has gotten this pilot group a 40% increase in pay over the last 4 years. There's no reason to think they won't continue to make improvements to our pay and work rules as time goes on.

When we stop seeing improvements, we can talk about a union drive.

Good luck with that plan. Sounds like us circa 2002.

 

[chperplt]

That's what I thought.

How about you worry about your company and let us worry about ours? Last I checked, you guys weren't doing so hot... Since you think you have all the answers, fix your own sh-t first.

I guess you could always go PFT somewhere else if your current gig doesn't work out... Heck, maybe Gulfstreme will take you back???

 

[chperplt]

Good luck with that plan. Sounds like us circa 2002.

So far so good Dude... We have a lot of work to do, but the progress we've made has been better than any union could have done.

If our management keeps an open mind and wants to stay union free, they'll do what needs to be done. I don't think the pilot group will have a problem pulling the trigger on a union if and when the time comes.

 

[crxpilot]

How about you worry about your company and let us worry about ours? Last I checked, you guys weren't doing so hot... Since you think you have all the answers, fix your own sh-t first.

I guess you could always go PFT somewhere else if your current gig doesn't work out... Heck, maybe Gulfstreme will take you back???

A little touchy are we?

 

[PCL_128]

How about you worry about your company and let us worry about ours?

I am worried about my pilot group. We're trying to negotiate pay raises while you guys who fly similar equipment are doing it for far less than our 8-year old contract rates. We're trying to get our FOs up to respectable rates, but your FOs top out at a rate that is less than our 3rd year rate. We're trying to bring our Captains up to something close SWA rates, while you top out at barely more than half that. You don't exist in a vacuum. Your rates affect everyone else.

 

[Ameriagle]

Good luck with that plan. Sounds like us circa 2002.

I'm not sure a failed union drive is a better plan. Sounds like you think you should have done it in 2002......but you could not get the support in 2009! How has that worked out for your pilot group? There is a place and time, for everything. I think the effort was commendable....just not effective. If you are trying to garner the respect of your fellow aviatior by getting on FI and telling everyone you voted yes, maybe, if you are trying to make progress at your carrier then your message was loud and clear!

 

[Ameriagle]

I am worried about my pilot group. We're trying to negotiate pay raises while you guys who fly similar equipment are doing it for far less than our 8-year old contract rates. We're trying to get our FOs up to respectable rates, but your FOs top out at a rate that is less than our 3rd year rate. We're trying to bring our Captains up to something close SWA rates, while you top out at barely more than half that. You don't exist in a vacuum. Your rates affect everyone else.

So what you are saying is we should be pushing the union drive at Allegiant, yet you continue to tell us how ineffective yours is? You certainly weren't in marketing at Gulfstream!

 

[OurMoney1]

Why would we need a union drive? Our pilot advisory group (AAPAG) has gotten this pilot group a 40% increase in pay over the last 4 years. There's no reason to think they won't continue to make improvements to our pay and work rules as time goes on.

When we stop seeing improvements, we can talk about a union drive.

Allegiant pay scales represent a true assault on our profession. Any self respecting professional would seek more than what they have accepted. This AAPAG is humerous. When your making industry scraps its hard to not improve your hourly wage. Allegiant management has made sport of paying their people nothing and raking in healthy profits. Its wrong and represents all of our struggles to do better for ourselves and families.

 

[PCL_128]

So what you are saying is we should be pushing the union drive at Allegiant, yet you continue to tell us how ineffective yours is?

Are you kidding? Even with our contract that's been amendable for years, our payrates are still far superior to what you've got. Our pilots are demanding huge raises, and yet you're out there pretending that $59/hr is a reasonable wage for an MD-80 FO. So who is it that's ineffective?

 

[Mr Wu]

... Even with our contract that's been amendable for years... Our pilots are demanding huge raises... So who is it that's ineffective?

I think you answered your own question.

 

[chperplt]

Allegiant pay scales represent a true assault on our profession. Any self respecting professional would seek more than what they have accepted. This AAPAG is humerous. When your making industry scraps its hard to not improve your hourly wage. Allegiant management has made sport of paying their people nothing and raking in healthy profits. Its wrong and represents all of our struggles to do better for ourselves and families.

Not close to being correct....

 

[chperplt]

Are you kidding? Even with our contract that's been amendable for years, our payrates are still far superior to what you've got. Our pilots are demanding huge raises, and yet you're out there pretending that $59/hr is a reasonable wage for an MD-80 FO. So who is it that's ineffective?

Obviously you're the ineffective group. We (AAPAG) have received raises of 40% in the last few years, with continuing raises and PROFIT SHARING expected each year.

Are we still below where we need to be? Absolutely we are..

What your thick PFT heard can't wrap itself around is that we continue to make progress each year. You expect us to be stars overnight, and it doesn't work that way.

Spend your time and energy worrying about and working to fix your ailing company. Leave Allegiant to the Allegiant folks.

BTW... Does your union (or any union for that matter) have issues with the fact that you paid to get into this industry? I mean... If you really want to talk about "lowering the bar", wouldn't that be you when you wrote that $18,000 check for a Beech 1900 job? You were taking a job away from someone qualified to be there, and you were keeping pay down for everyone that wasn't willing to pay for their own job... Look in the mirror man... You're everything you're on here bitching about, and I mean EVERYTHING!

 

[PCL_128]

Obviously you're the ineffective group. We (AAPAG) have received raises of 40% in the last few years, with continuing raises and PROFIT SHARING expected each year.

Do you not find it pathetic that even after 40% raises you still make a fraction of what everyone else makes? That really says something for how horrible your payrates were before.

What your thick PFT heard can't wrap itself around is that we continue to make progress each year. You expect us to be stars overnight, and it doesn't work that way.

I don't expect you to be "stars" overnight, I just want you to become part of the solution. Join the labor movement and start working with the rest of your profession.

Spend your time and energy worrying about and working to fix your ailing company.

Ailing company? We're doing just fine. We should record record profits this year, actually.

BTW... Does your union (or any union for that matter) have issues with the fact that you paid to get into this industry? I mean... If you really want to talk about "lowering the bar", wouldn't that be you when you wrote that $18,000 check for a Beech 1900 job? You were taking a job away from someone qualified to be there, and you were keeping pay down for everyone that wasn't willing to pay for their own job... Look in the mirror man... You're everything you're on here bitching about, and I mean EVERYTHING!

I think it's pretty telling that you can't defend your position and instead resort to petty attacks about something that I did a decade ago and have long since said was a mistake. But if that's the best you can do, have at it.

 

[Ameriagle]

Are you kidding? Even with our contract that's been amendable for years, our payrates are still far superior to what you've got. Our pilots are demanding huge raises, and yet you're out there pretending that $59/hr is a reasonable wage for an MD-80 FO. So who is it that's ineffective?

You highlight my point beautifully, thanks! I am not defending what Allegiant pilots have, I am defending the progress Allegiant pilots (specifically AAPAG) have made and hopefully will continue to make! As to what you are demanding from management, I could give a a s**t. Despite your complete lack of credibility, what you DEMAND seems to have empowered you to open your mouth, however I think it has little to do with how effective your orginization has been. After all, you have said as much yourself!

 

[Hovernut]

Join the labor movement and start working with the rest of your profession.

Is that the same 'labor movement' that summarily forced my ALPA pilot group to pay a 'merger assessment fee' to possibly merge with another wholly-owned ALPA regional?

Is that the same 'labor movement' that signed off on two successive sub-standard contracts at Mesa? That 'labor movement' cost me my left seat job and the jobs of many at my carrier thanks to its continued blind eye turned at the whipsawing of regional carriers.

If Allegiant management and pilots can get along with one another reasonably, then they can forgo the likes of ALPA just like SWA, AA, UPS, FDX, USAir, etc.

It also looks like they treat their first year FOs much better than most Majors as far as pay goes.