Alaska TA is out. Pay Rates.

[Ih8AFYesmen]

I'm somewhat curious what the dissenters were looking for in an agreement. What kind of pay rates were you hoping for? SWA+?

My personal MINIMUM for a 4 year contract:
$30,000 signing bonus
$190/hr for a 12 year captain
$133/hr for a 12 year FO

With 3% per year for the duration of contract, MINIMUM. This is more than reasonable for the company, IMO.

 

[Tatoosh65]

Increased allowable monthly credit through VSA and open time.. If this thing gets voted in, I think we will furlough in the fall. I can't figure out why the MEC didn't restrict VSA while we have guys on the street.. This is a big deal.
Not good.

 

[PCL_128]

My personal MINIMUM for a 4 year contract:
$30,000 signing bonus
$190/hr for a 12 year captain
$133/hr for a 12 year FO

With 3% per year for the duration of contract, MINIMUM. This is more than reasonable for the company, IMO.

I guess I can understand the bigger signing bonus and 3% step adjustments, but do you really think such big pay rate adjustments on DOS are achievable when you're the first legacy carrier to come up for negotiations post-concessions? I agree that you're worth it, but I don't see how it's achievable. Even with the Obama NMB that's about to be put in place, I don't think they'd release you for those demands. We're going to have to pattern bargain to get back up to pre-concessionary levels, and that means the first carrier in the pattern probably isn't going to be able to get all the way there.

Anyway, it's your contract, and I wish you guys luck. I'll be happy to walk a picket line with you if you reject it and end up striking to get an agreement that you're looking for.

 

[check6]

Not to add fuel to the fire. But total executive compensation for the AAG's top 5 Execs was around. . . .by my feeble calculations. . .close to. . . .7 Meeeellion Dollars!!

 

[Ih8AFYesmen]

I guess I can understand the bigger signing bonus and 3% step adjustments, but do you really think such big pay rate adjustments on DOS are achievable when you're the first legacy carrier to come up for negotiations post-concessions? I agree that you're worth it, but I don't see how it's achievable. Even with the Obama NMB that's about to be put in place, I don't think they'd release you for those demands. We're going to have to pattern bargain to get back up to pre-concessionary levels, and that means the first carrier in the pattern probably isn't going to be able to get all the way there.

Anyway, it's your contract, and I wish you guys luck. I'll be happy to walk a picket line with you if you reject it and end up striking to get an agreement that you're looking for.

The #1 problem with the current state of industry is YOU, ME, US.... the Pilots. It's not the company, it's not the union, but US. We undervalue ourselves and lower our expectations thereby setting low goals, then tell ourselves "well, maybe next time". It's human nature to search for that comfort zone. If you haven't realized by now, there is no comfort zone in this life. The sooner we realize that life ain't fair and that there is no comfort zone to park ourselves in, the sooner we will succeed in whatever we do.

We aimed low and we got a turd. We need to grow a spine, some big sacks, and take a stance. The choice is yours. Off the soap box now.

 

[PCL_128]

The #1 problem with the current state of industry is YOU, ME, US.... the Pilots. It's not the company, it's not the union, but US. We undervalue ourselves and lower our expectations thereby setting low goals, then tell ourselves "well, maybe next time". It's human nature to search for that comfort zone. If you haven't realized by now, there is no comfort zone in this life. The sooner we realize that life ain't fair and that there is no comfort zone to park ourselves in, the sooner we will succeed in whatever we do.

We aimed low and we got a turd. We need to grow a spine, some big sacks, and take a stance. The choice is yours. Off the soap box now.

I don't disagree, but how do you hope to be successful? If the NMB won't release you to strike with those demands, what are you going to do? Just sit around and wait with your current concessionary contract forever? What is the end game?

 

[Old School 737]

I just wonder. The Willson Pole is supposed to tell the N.C. the wants of the pilot group and the N.C. is to put those wants into an agreement the pilots will vote for. So if I believe that then this TA is what the majority of the pilots want and it will pass????

 

[Ih8AFYesmen]

"I don't disagree, but how do you hope to be successful? If the NMB won't release you to strike with those demands, what are you going to do? Just sit around and wait with your current concessionary contract forever? What is the end game?"

PCL....

That's the big unknown, used as a weapon to persuade this pilot group to accept this TA by both the union and the company. I, for one, am willing to call them on it. We'll each have to decide. If we, especially the FOs and junior captains, want to bend over once again, you'd better think twice because this contract is destined to leave all of behind the power curve for a very long time. Need I say more.

 

[kingair1]

My vote = NO !!!

 

[av8instyle]

I'm somewhat curious what the dissenters were looking for in an agreement. What kind of pay rates were you hoping for? SWA+?

I'll also answer this one. I'm not naive enough to believe the mediator would release us if we didn't get a 50% pay raise bringing us back to where we were, but I do believe there is more to be had. I believe the initial raise is just ok. Where it loses me is the paltry 1.5 % raises thereafter. In a 4 year deal it should have been at LEAST 5-7% annual raises to get us close to where we were prior to Kasher, also a clause giving us last year's inflation rate in a raise each year they stall negotiations for the next contract. In addition, the VSA changes and plus ups need to stay out so there won't be career stagnation for everyone who is not a line holding captain.
It would probably get my vote with these changes.

 

[skid]

I guess I can understand the bigger signing bonus and 3% step adjustments, but do you really think such big pay rate adjustments on DOS are achievable when you're the first legacy carrier to come up for negotiations post-concessions? I agree that you're worth it, but I don't see how it's achievable. .

I think they should aim high!
Especially when they got screwed so bad last time.

Remember, Alaska has never been in a super bad financial state as some other majors have seen the last few years. Just the raw end of arbitration

 

[Mookie]

Too many "Shall attempts" and "Mays" in the language for me right now. I know how they have driven hummers through these holes now, and unfortuantely I can't believe that they wouldn't in the future.

As long as the clowns in scheduling, with few exceptions, are running our lives on reserve...then I'm looking like I'm falling off the fence right now. And honestly, the payrates and bonus are about number 4 and 5 on my list of priorities right now in this TA...

I'm a no...

Mookie

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

Any junior FOs should be wary of joining the ranks of the unemployed and junior captains should be looking at a big paycut after they get downgraded with the improved work rules.

 

[Going2Baja]

Too many "Shall attempts" and "Mays" in the language for me right now. I know how they have driven hummers through these holes now, and unfortuantely I can't believe that they wouldn't in the future.

As long as the clowns in scheduling, with few exceptions, are running our lives on reserve...then I'm looking like I'm falling off the fence right now. And honestly, the payrates and bonus are about number 4 and 5 on my list of priorities right now in this TA...

I'm a no...

Mookie

Couldn´t have said it better. We will ALWAYS want more $$$ - that´s just life. But QOL is where it´s at for me. I know I won´t see the long call reserve and being on 2 hour forever doesn´t sound all that great. Also no furlough clause is scaring me with the new "improved work rules." I´m not going to drop the "no vote" just yet, but I will be at the road show asking some questions. I just don´t see how this will pass unless it´s a 55% by the senior guys who just want their $$ and bonus.

Baja.

 

[SkiFishFly]

Good luck to all you guys.
As a 4 yr FO at AAI (66.00) , I sure envy those pay rates...
I know the important stuff is work rules and scope these days.