Alaska demographics for merger?

[Flyby1206]

What is your argument for this statement?

We were great as a young start-up airline, but have yet to prove we can do anything except Northeast-FL/Caribbean markets. Beyond that we still aren't playing in the big boys sandbox when it comes to large industry issues like this slot stuff. Parker will get his way and keep the slots while we are pushed aside.

Our management team is a revolving door, the stock has been underperforming the industry, our labor costs are rising(but still well below market value) and revenue can't keep up.

We were given a fortunate opportunity to grow at a time when the legacies were too weak to do anything about it. Now they have put on some muscle, upgraded their onboard products to outshine ours, and will have no problems keeping us from growing any further into their territories.

 

[Flyby1206]

deleted....

 

[Smarta$$]

Interesting. You've chosen to use Parker's argument defending their DCA slots in order to defend JetBlue's LGB slots.
DCA is no longer a critical airport to DC; BWI and IAD are moving the bulk of the passenger traffic in/out of DC.

Is JetBlue's total dominance of slots at LGB in the public's interest?

DCA is THE preferred airport for those vacationing or doing business near the monuments. If it wasn't important, why does Doug want 66% of that market?

LGB is not NEARLY as important in L.A. compared to DCA in DC.

It is not apples to apples.

As far as JB and LGB being in the public interest, airfares in LA are already low due to too much competition. I have friends that fly out of LGB and other LA airports and they brag about how much cheaper their airfares are compared to us in MSP. DC is not the same.

 

[Andy]

DCA is THE preferred airport for those vacationing or doing business near the monuments. If it wasn't important, why does Doug want 66% of that market?

LGB is not NEARLY as important in L.A. compared to DCA in DC.

It is not apples to apples.

As far as JB and LGB being in the public interest, airfares in LA are already low due to too much competition. I have friends that fly out of LGB and other LA airports and they brag about how much cheaper their airfares are compared to us in MSP. DC is not the same.

DC also has cheap airfares; there are no slot restrictions at either BWI or IAD.
As far as THE preferred airport, I lived in the DC area and would always want to fly out of BWI or IAD because parking around DCA is both expensive and in short supply. Not to mention the traffic congestion.
As far as vacationers, all they care about is the cheapest price. If it's DCA, great. If it's BWI or IAD, they'll fly into there. And the same goes for many business travelers.

Barger's argument about divesting AMR of slots out of DCA is that no single airline should have that much concentration in a single slot controlled airport. Fine. Just make sure that policy is applied evenly across the board. If Barger wants AMR to have no more than 40% of the slots at DCA, then Jetblue should offer up any slots they have greater than 40% of LGB traffic. It is apples and apples because we're talking about two slot controlled airports. And while we're at it, how about Jetblue give up some of their JFK slots to other carriers that don't have as many slots as Jetblue at JFK?
Or is this more about Jetblue trying to grab some slots at DCA while giving up nothing?

 

[Mea25000]

No buddy wants LGB slots... Lowest yield airport in the country

 

[Andy]

No buddy wants LGB slots... Lowest yield airport in the country

If no one wanted the slots, then there wouldn't be a need for slots. There were more bidders than Air Carrier slots the last time slots were available. Jetblue has 32 of the 41 Air Carrier slots.

As for yield, what are you basing that on? With Jetblue controlling almost all of the slots, it would logically follow that they dictate yields in and out of LGB.

 

[Smarta$$]

DC also has cheap airfares; there are no slot restrictions at either BWI or IAD.
As far as THE preferred airport, I lived in the DC area and would always want to fly out of BWI or IAD because parking around DCA is both expensive and in short supply. Not to mention the traffic congestion.
As far as vacationers, all they care about is the cheapest price. If it's DCA, great. If it's BWI or IAD, they'll fly into there. And the same goes for many business utravelers.

Barger's argument about divesting AMR of slots out of DCA is that no single airline should have that much concentration in a single slot controlled airport. Fine. Just make sure that policy is applied evenly across the board. If Barger wants AMR to have no more than 40% of the slots at DCA, then Jetblue should offer up any slots they have greater than 40% of LGB traffic. It is apples and apples because we're talking about two slot controlled airports. And while we're at it, how about Jetblue give up some of their JFK slots to other carriers that don't have as many slots as Jetblue at JFK?
Or is this more about Jetblue trying to grab some slots at DCA while giving up nothing?

I'm gonna guess you work for AA or US? Or one of their feeders?

 

[Mea25000]

Our CEO... I didn't fact check him on it though. Maybe you are right everybody wants to fly into the trailer park. We don't even fly there anymore only Horizon does.

 

[Andy]

I'm gonna guess you work for AA or US? Or one of their feeders?

I'm gonna guess you didn't bother reading my 'Current Position', which is on the left hand side of every post. I haven't changed it in a year or so.

Granted, DCA slots are more valuable than LGB slots. But hypocrisy is hypocrisy.
I didn't even bother mentioning the under the table deal that JetBlue worked at JFK. Personally, I applaud Neeleman's genius in pulling that one off.

Our CEO... I didn't fact check him on it though. Maybe you are right everybody wants to fly into the trailer park. We don't even fly there anymore only Horizon does.

For those on the southern side of LA, SNA may be more convenient than LGB but it's also slot limited. And the drive to LAX can take forever. I've averaged less than 10 MPH at times on the 405.

 

[B6Busdriver]

If no one wanted the slots, then there wouldn't be a need for slots. There were more bidders than Air Carrier slots the last time slots were available. Jetblue has 32 of the 41 Air Carrier slots.

As for yield, what are you basing that on? With Jetblue controlling almost all of the slots, it would logically follow that they dictate yields in and out of LGB.

Andy,

You should change your name to Bulldog. Anyway, the slots were created because of noise not demand. I understand your point, but as my teenager would say....just sayin'.

 

[Smarta$$]

I'm gonna guess you didn't bother reading my 'Current Position', which is on the left hand side of every post. I haven't changed it in a year or so.

Granted, DCA slots are more valuable than LGB slots. But hypocrisy is hypocrisy.
I didn't even bother mentioning the under the table deal that JetBlue worked at JFK. Personally, I applaud Neeleman's genius in pulling that one off.



For those on the southern side of LA, SNA may be more convenient than LGB but it's also slot limited. And the drive to LAX can take forever. I've averaged less than 10 MPH at times on the 405.

Yes, DCA slots are far more valuable. They are also far more important to its respective market.

It is a bad argument to say that just because 2 airports are slot controlled, that both are equally important, valuable, and have the same impact on the same type of service or market niche.

Either way, the opinion of you or me have no influence on the outcome of what will happen. Personally, I hope divestitures are required, but I work for JB. I also think it would be better for competition regarding travel to downtown D.C. My opinion only.

 

[pilotpayne]

What is your argument for this statement?

He does not have any.
We continue to grow and we continue to make money.
But I guess JetBlue is finished and we should all just pack it in.

 

[pilotpayne]

We were great as a young start-up airline, but have yet to prove we can do anything except Northeast-FL/Caribbean markets. Beyond that we still aren't playing in the big boys sandbox when it comes to large industry issues like this slot stuff. Parker will get his way and keep the slots while we are pushed aside.

Our management team is a revolving door, the stock has been underperforming the industry, our labor costs are rising(but still well below market value) and revenue can't keep up.

We were given a fortunate opportunity to grow at a time when the legacies were too weak to do anything about it. Now they have put on some muscle, upgraded their onboard products to outshine ours, and will have no problems keeping us from growing any further into their territories.

So if you knew all this why did you even apply here?

 

[Andy]

Andy,

You should change your name to Bulldog. Anyway, the slots were created because of noise not demand. I understand your point, but as my teenager would say....just sayin'.

LOL! Guilty as charged.

I was debating from a weak position, but let's be honest about Barger's objections - he's only arguing for divestiture so that Jetblue can snag a few more DCA slots.

Either way, the opinion of you or me have no influence on the outcome of what will happen. Personally, I hope divestitures are required, but I work for JB. I also think it would be better for competition regarding travel to downtown D.C. My opinion only.

True, our opinions mean nothing. I found Parker's defense of maintaining all slots to be a reasonable argument - they currently serve secondary cities from DCA. If they divest and Jetblue acquires slots, they will merely be used to fly to markets (ie NYC, BOS) that are already well served out of DCA.

I understand your perspective on this, but put the shoe on the other foot. Let's say that another airline complains about how Jetblue has too many slots in the NYC area and should have to give some of them up. What will your response be?


Edit: I just read that the only route overlap between AMR and LCC out of DCA are to BNA and RDU. I haven't verified it but if that's the case, this is shaping up to be much ado about nothing. I could see them being forced to divest slots from those two routes and have someone else fly the exact same routes. But we all know that's not what Barger wants.

 

[Dan Roman]

As far as DCA goes, I hadn't been there for years, just went there on a family vacation and got the impression that it had morphed into a primarily RJ airport.