Airtran Union V.P. Abstains from Picket Vote

[dicko]

Interesting. The Vice president of Airtrans pilot union ABSTAINED from a vote on: a motion to support and reactivate the SPC ( basically a strike etc. committee) and obtain Picketing Permits and pursue Family Awareness events.

I guess voting against the motion would have infuriated his fellow pilots. Voting for it would have infuriated management. Curious

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Reactivate the strike committee? What do you mean RE-activate? Was it ever active? (honest question...)

Airtran cannot strike. They do not have the money to do it. management will easily win a strike by know how long to hold out on the NPA... they problem have it down to the hour of the day that an NPA strike would fall apart...

You can't negotiate that way... there is no leverage...



You guys need national resources!!


Here is an example....


The reason why Lorenzo was so effective at Texas Air was something called mutual aid. All the airline managements had agreed that if one carrier went on strike the other airlines would subsidize the loses.

Until the 1970s real airline men ran airlines. Patterson, Six, Rickenbacker, Cord, etc.. They didn't want a strike... But Lorenzo was the new guard and used mutual aid to break the unions...


The point... Lorenzo had "national' resources. A collective pool he could draw from. (shameless ALPA plug: ALPA lobbied for and had mutual aid removed from law)


Regional Airlines like Pinnacle received 2 million from national in support of the pilots in contract negotiations.


Unless you guys want heavy assessments. I mean heavy assessments... there is no way you guys are going to strike. No improvements. It is the status quo at airtran for the rest of your employment there...


Maybe the VP made a statement by abstention because reactivating the strike committee is a waste of time. Only after national resources are obtained is the idea of a strike committee worth discussing or voting...

 

[PCL_128]

Before we get all worked about something that we don't know much about (only one sentence from some rather thin meeting minutes), maybe we should actually talk to the NPA VP to see what his reasoning was. We shouldn't crucify the man before we hear his side of the story. I suggest posting it in the "Ask the VP" section of the NPA Forum. Maybe he'll respond there for everyone to see.

 

[zman]

Before we get all worked about something that we don't know much about (only one sentence from some rather thin meeting minutes), maybe we should actually talk to the NPA VP to see what his reasoning was. We shouldn't crucify the man before we hear his side of the story. I suggest posting it in the "Ask the VP" section of the NPA Forum. Maybe he'll respond there for everyone to see.

Yes I agree but where do we as a pilot group draw the line and say hey maybe its time for a strong national union?? I mean NPA is to small and weak to handle the management at Airtran. Many others including I feel that its time for NPA to merge with someone like ALPA to finally get the backing we need to fight management. I mean our pilot group is strong and united, its the union that lacks the resources. I personally think if Mike Best had the resources of ALPA we would be in a different position, I think he knows it as well. But wont come out to support ALPA unless there is a movement from within the BOD as well as the pilot group.

 

[PCL_128]

Agree completely. Rez is absolutely right. We need national resources in order to have a real threat of a strike. It's going to take a large grass roots movement in order to make it happen, though.

 

[CFIT]

Hey Rez,

Do you think Airtran should go ALPA?

Really?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Hey Rez,

Do you think Airtran should go ALPA?

Really?

Let the FL pilots decide..... it is their airline..

 

[labbats]

ALPA would have the ability to strike, but never the guts. Different story, same ending.

 

[zman]

ALPA would have the ability to strike, but never the guts. Different story, same ending.

Airtran Airways pilots will have the guts!!! Alpa would be there to provide logistics thats it

 

[PCL_128]

ALPA would have the ability to strike, but never the guts. Different story, same ending.

Really? Tell that to the CAL, CMR, EAL, NWA, UAL, etc... ALPA pilots that have all struck.

 

[labbats]

That was a different era. I'm convinced we've seen the last of it, and I'm not happy about it.

Sorry to derail this from the Airtran issue. I hope the best for all of you over there.

 

[PCL_128]

That was a different era. I'm convinced we've seen the last of it, and I'm not happy about it.

Yes, we've seen the last of it if certain people remain in power in DC. That's what has caused the change in "eras" that you've noticed.

 

[BigMeat]

ALPA would have the ability to strike, but never the guts. Different story, same ending.

What!!! ALPA doesnt decide wether you strike or not its the pilots. When they do I wonder what resources NPA will have to offer in the way of bargaining and defending its pilots during the process. Look at how much ALPA gave CAL and Spirit. Millions! and at CAL our contract is not even up yet. I dont care if you hate ALPA or not. You cannot argue that ALPA would "help" Airtran pilots provide more leverage and offer services to it members that are night and day diffrences compared to NPA. All for the same price that you are paying out in union dues. Thats like saying for the same price Ill take the crappier car that breaks down all the time.


Look at whats happened at Airtran thus far and you have people in your union that think that an SPC is not necessary right now? Strike vote? I will fall off of my chair if I saw that at Airtran. Management knows NPA is weak and will play accordingly. Get rid on NPA now. Not only are you guys going to screw yourselves but you will end up screwing your peers around you when you help keep the averages low. NPA=Management wet dream!

 

[j41driver]

We shouldn't crucify the man before we hear his side of the story. I suggest posting it in the "Ask the VP" section of the NPA Forum. Maybe he'll respond there for everyone to see.

Good idea. Done. Hopefully we'll get the answer.

 

[j41driver]

Did you guys see this from the Sept 2nd meeting minutes? I'm sure support for a national union is at an all time high right about now. What's up with this? Question has been asked on NPA forum.

"Discussion on having ALPA and Teamsters make presentations regarding the benefits of having a national union. National Union issue is tabled."

 

[Freight Dog]

What!!! ALPA doesnt decide wether you strike or not its the pilots.

Actually, ALPA has a big say in it, both directly and indirectly. You can huff, puff and have 100% strike vote. Along comes ALPA National with their lawyers who will "convince" you that striking is not in your best interests.

As labbats said... 'different story, same ending' is right.

 

[zman]

Actually, ALPA has a big say in it, both directly and indirectly. You can huff, puff and have 100% strike vote. Along comes ALPA National with their lawyers who will "convince" you that striking is not in your best interests.

As labbats said... 'different story, same ending' is right.

Umm NO, they cannot stop you for striking its up to the pilot group.

 

[Freight Dog]

They can "convince" you to not strike... of course, the ultimate decision is up to the pilot group.

Show me a pilot group that told an ALPA lawyer to f**k off and go against his "convincing." Hell, I'm embarrassed to say instead of going out with some dignity when my airline shut down, thanks to ALPA, we had pilots showing up to fly cargo for free. Hell, ALPA even took out an ad praising those pilots. All that was despite the pilot group decision to strike cargo.

Thank you ALPA National!

 

[Lear70]

They can "convince" you to not strike...

They can try.

of course, the ultimate decision is up to the pilot group.

Show me a pilot group that told an ALPA lawyer to f**k off and go against his "convincing."

The AirTran pilots.

Our chief negotiating legal counsel in D.C. last year was Seth Rosen, who was ALPA for many, many years, came recommended by them, and suggested that we accept T.A.'s 1 and 2 last year.

The pilot group soundly rejected his opinion, and rejected the T.A.'s.

Any more questions...?

 

[Freight Dog]

Outstanding!! But then again - Airtran isn't ALPA either. Let's hope the Airtran pilots don't blink because the stakes just got bigger with this whole strike threat.

I really want to be proven wrong on this... Stay strong NPA!