AirTran pilot arrested?

[habubuaza]

From the Communist News Network: "The captain neither took command of the aircraft nor was the aircraft operated in any manner," the airline said.

If he neither took command of the aircraft nor was the aircraft operated in any manner, what's the guy guilty of? Is it illegal to be hammered in an aircraft terminal while wearing a pilot uniform? Because up until you take "command" you're not a pilot...just a guy walking around with a piece of DOT cardboard in your wallet.

As far as the TSA is concerned...when did they become the self appointed guardians of virtuous flight? Sounds like just another case of someone who can't possibly keep his mouth shut.

Sorry but, I am NOT my brother's keeper!


Aviation would be a much better place if we'd all just mind our own business.

From what I understand, and please correct me if I am wrong, is that if you are suspected of having alcohol in your system then local authorities can intervene by applying their "Operating a Motor Vehicle while under the Influence" law. With that being said I can understand how one can be arrested with "intent" Guys it has been going on all over the place people have been getting arrested and charged with DUI's simply for sleeping in their cars after a few drinks because they had "access" it is a reckless and inappropriate application of DUI law in my view. I can understand how they are trying to make a stretch to apply this logic to air crews. I believe that the case against the America West pilots in Florida was thrown out because Florida doesn't have jurisdiction to enforce an FAR. Anyway I hate TSA. What a waste of tax payers money. Can you imagine? One day flipping burgers, the next day you have enforcement authority over a professional pilot.

 

[TWA Dude]

Everyone makes mistakes, including pilots...

Yes, we all screw up, however, going to work with a measurable blood alcohol level is far beyond a mere screw-up because it's intentional. As pilots were taught to recognize and fix our screw-ups. He didn't have some temporary lack of good judgement; every step he took that evening from putting on his uniform until entering the cockpit was a screw-up. Not to mention, we are trusted by the FAA and our employers to self-certify that we're fit to fly. In conclusion, I don't "feel" for this guy. No doubt what he's going through is unpleasant but that's the price to be paid. If he's lucky maybe some day he'll earn his way back into the cockpit like that Northwest guy did.

 

[RVR300]

If he neither took command of the aircraft nor was the aircraft operated in any manner, what's the guy guilty of? Is it illegal to be hammered in an aircraft terminal while wearing a pilot uniform? Because up until you take "command" you're not a pilot...just a guy walking around with a piece of DOT cardboard in your wallet.

Sorry but, I am NOT my brother's keeper!

No, you are not permitted to be hammered in a pilot uniform, whether at the airport or not. No airline I've ever worked for allows crewmembers to drink in uniform.

The 'not taking command' nonsense is just that. That's code for they didn't push back from the gate yet.

As for you NOT being your brothers keeper... nice. Great crew concept there.

 

[Tripower455]

Well, IF he blew a .04, then the gloves are off. We should know better. He made a mistake. If there is any doubt, call in sick. What's the worst that would happen? I'll bet he wished he did that.

If it's true, then score one for the tsA. It will be the first time they're right about a pilot being under the influence. Now if they could just find a few more of the weapons......

 

[Flying Freddie]

Like my daddy used to say, The day he couldn't do his job drunk was the day he would hang up his badge and gun!

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

From the Communist News Network: "The captain neither took command of the aircraft nor was the aircraft operated in any manner," the airline said.

If he neither took command of the aircraft nor was the aircraft operated in any manner, what's the guy guilty of? Is it illegal to be hammered in an aircraft terminal while wearing a pilot uniform? Because up until you take "command" you're not a pilot...just a guy walking around with a piece of DOT cardboard in your wallet.

As far as the TSA is concerned...when did they become the self appointed guardians of virtuous flight? Sounds like just another case of someone who can't possibly keep his mouth shut.

Sorry but, I am NOT my brother's keeper!

Aviation would be a much better place if we'd all just mind our own business.

This is the scariest post here.

First when you show up to the airport in uniform you are ready for duty. If your company policy says 45 mins, but you show 50 mins, are you going to argue you are not on duty? After all, why are you there. Are you going to say talk to hand cause I an't working for 4 more minutes? Also, if the ticket counter asks you a question about the flight, you are a acting as a crew member, whether its 90 mins or 9 mins before departure.


The fact that you made the effort to bold and underline your statement confirms how you really feel.

We are our brothers keeper. We take of our own. We police our own, so the company and gov't doesn't think they have to be over our shoulders everyday. You look out for your fellow pilots. When you see them in the bar at the wrong time, you get them out. You make them call in sick and you get them in the HIMS program. WHOA! you say...that's not my job! Well it takes more guts to protect your brothers then say....

Screw him, stupid jerk. Which translates to.. I'm perfect and that would never happen to me. I am a lion in the Law of the Jungle.

What's better? Making sure the guy calls in sick and protecting him AND your company from bad press AND getting him the proper medical care... or saying...

I'm not my bothers keeper and let a problem fester. Ignoring or shunning it is the same as allowing it to happen.

You guys are weak and soft.....disapointing..... Why don't you get off flightinfo and google 'alcoholism'.

Do us all a favor and get educated, so we don't have to weed thru your self gratifying mantra.....

 

[ivauir]

PurpleInMEM you are compltely out of line.

Sorry but, I am NOT my brother's keeper!
Sorry but, you ARE a jerk!

Aviation would be a much better place if we'd all just mind our own business.
No it wouldn't.
Imagine how much better this guys life would be RIGHT NOW if just one person on that crew van had said "I think you need to call in sick". Or even better said something at the bar. And BTW this clearly was his crew's business: if I were his FO I know that I am not flying with this guy today - I'd rather handle this "in house" and give this guy the option of saving his career ... Ooops I guess I am not "minding my own business".

This has become a TSA issue because too many of us have taken your attitude. It is time to grow up and take our resonsibility to the traveling public, our companies and each other seriously.

 

[8vATE]

On the record: You sir, are a fool. Apparently it is not obvious to you, which is even more distressing. You are telling everyone on this board (and the FAA) that you have witnessed crew members violate the 8 hour no alcohol FAA regulation (FAR) and you failed to notify the appropriate authorities. I would love to hear your explanation at an FAA and company enforcement/disciplinary hearing, especially a post-incident inquiry investigation.

Off the record: do not ever put yourself in a position in which you knowingly observe any crew member violate the 8 hour no alcohol FAR. Approaching the 8 hour point, EXCUSE yourself from your colleagues and get the hell out of there if there is even the remotest chance some jerk will violate his window. Failing the above action, you have placed your ticket in jeopardy for failing to notify the FAA over a willful FAR violation (according to an FAA aviation inspector acquaintance).\+++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++++++

Oh Beer Belly..
Don't call me a fool...

I did NOT tell everyone and the FAA anything..
Reread my post...

I have never operated an aircraft with someone intoxicated or under the influence...

I have seen people drink right up to the 8 hour mark..

That to me is pusher your luck..

And its more than an "8 hour no alcohol FAA regulation" as you so eloquently state.
It is a minimum... and you can not be under the detrimental influence of ANY drug ...

I believe the BAC is .02 for the FAA.

Nice username by the way...
Are you a little defensive about something?

 

[Lequip]

GUILTY!!


Oliver Paul Reason Jr., 37



Shame on you,
Your a disgrace to the profession Oliver Paul Reason Jr., 37

 

[Tripower455]

GUILTY!!


Oliver Paul Reason Jr., 37



Shame on you,
Your a disgrace to the profession Oliver Paul Reason Jr., 37

Wow, that was a quick trial! Gotta love the Patriot act!

 

[FN FAL]

GUILTY!!


Oliver Paul Reason Jr., 37



Shame on you,
Your a disgrace to the profession Oliver Paul Reason Jr., 37

He's guilty of nothing until due process is served.

Untill then, he can only fantasize about the hot beef injections he'll be getting in federal prison from his cell mate the "Bronco Buster"!

 

[Dave Siegel]

Shame on you,
Your a disgrace to the profession

YOUR versus YOU'RE

Hey Little Johnny Lequip, did you learn your grammar from FLB717? Do you have your Mommy's permission to be here? Shouldn't you be in english class now?

 

[Dave Siegel]

Gentlemen,

Lets not pound on the guy too much. I know him, and have never disliked him nor felt he was a bad seed in any fasion. He has gone from a Six figure a year income to 0. He is paying the price for the over sight or lack of it.He has lost any chance at a 121 career and faces large hurdles in his Proffesional and Peresonal life that will affect him very deeply. I feel for him and hope that anyone who has a problem or feels that they might enroll in the HIMS program. It could save your future before it is out of control.

Lets--Let's
Fasion--What's that mean? Oh, did you mean fashion?
it.He --2 spaces after the period

You and Lequip need remedial training, and maybe access to spelling and grammar checking software. Yikes, I thought you needed at least a High School diploma to be an Airline Pilot.

 

[Tripower455]

Lets--Let's
Fasion--What's that mean? Oh, did you mean fashion?
it.He --2 spaces after the period

You and Lequip need remedial training, and maybe access to spelling and grammar checking software. Yikes, I thought you needed at least a High School diploma to be an Airline Pilot.

its an messeje bord teech hoo kares abut gramer end speelin end tipin.........

 

[Steeler Fan]

Lets--Let's
Fasion--What's that mean? Oh, did you mean fashion?
it.He --2 spaces after the period

You and Lequip need remedial training, and maybe access to spelling and grammar checking software. Yikes, I thought you needed at least a High School diploma to be an Airline Pilot.

I just saw the Fat Albert movie with my kids. Do you know what summer school and Dave Seigel have in common?



NO CLASS!

Dude, you're not nice. Sounds like these 2 guys make some valid points. Why don't you try understanding them a little instead of blasting them because they aren't perfect, like you.

 

[CatYaaak]

As far as the TSA is concerned...when did they become the self appointed guardians of virtuous flight? Sounds like just another case of someone who can't possibly keep his mouth shut.

Sorry but, I am NOT my brother's keeper!

Aviation would be a much better place if we'd all just mind our own business.

You sure as he11 ARE your brothers keeper if piloting is your profession, and I don't mean your peer "brother" sitting next to you, but the brothers (and sisters and mothers and fathers and sons and daughters) sitting in the cabin or on the ground.

Your "business" on duty...the thing you wrote you should be minding...is the safety of the people in back and on the ground you could squash. Ignoring a drunk peer is doing the opposite of "minding your business". If you really think it's an issue of "virtue" or "not keeping one's mouth shut", you need to leave this profession, like yesterday.

 

[FLB717]

Lets give Dave Segul, a brake here. He sits' at home at night typing away trying to feel more than he is. We all have anger issues, he no different. Me, I know i shouldz use spell check, but then what would people like Dave have to complain about. It gives everyone purpuse.

 

[stillflyn]

I've seen a lot of guys play fast and loose with the 8 hour rule......

It is just stupid in my opinion.....
And this guy is an FFDO....
Great... a black eye to your fellow FFDO's and the program.


And now the TSA guys are further bolstered in their role as Alcohol Inspectors..
You ever notice how some of them will saddle up to you fairly close and want to carry on a conversation?

Well.... you're being evaluated...

Wake up guys.....
if you have a drinking problem get help..
If not.. you're jeopardizing you, your crew, your passengers and your career.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Do these TSA evaluators have any training on how to determin weather or not a pilot has been drinking. To specifically target a pilot for an alcohol test a LEO must have probable cause. Will a TSA agent (with no training) saying "I thought I smelled alcohol on his breath" stand up in court as probable court? I'm not sure....

Has any alcohol charge against a pilot stemming from a TSA agent saying "I smelled alcohol on his/her breath" resulted in a conviction?

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Seriously though. Let the facts come out first on this event. I spoke with a Captain that was falsely accused by the TSA in GEG.

Did you hear that one of the screeners in GEG was arrested for stealing painkillers out of pax luggage?

 

[Lequip]

Hey David Siegel,

I had sex with YOUR woman and YOUR Mama polished my shoes last night with her nasty tongue.

Get a life man. You have nothing to add to anything. Nobody that posts here is totally free of spelling/grammar mistakes ect. ect. If you have nothing better to do than point out the misuse of your vs you're then I have a suggestion for you >>> GO GET LAID !!

 

[kg4mvp]

GUILTY!!


Oliver Paul Reason Jr., 37



Shame on you,
Your a disgrace to the profession Oliver Paul Reason Jr., 37

I'd have to agree...serves the co*k sucker right. Too bad we don't have a different rule for this sob. Toss him in the streets of Baghdad!!!

 

[MJG]

The saddest part of this whole thing is how I found out about it. I was catching a few minutes of the Weather Channel before leaving the hotel room. The "travel correspondant", one of the cute chicks, starts talking about what's delayed, yada, yada, yada. Then out of nowhere she starts going off about some Airtran pilot in Vegas, blah, blah, blah......


That's where I heard about this, on the frickin Weather Channel !! Man I hope this all turns out to be false because if not, we've all been given a huge black eye by all the media including the damm Weather Channel. What's this profession coming to??

By the way....No one has mentioned whether or not the FO was around when this all went down and if he/she was dragged off on suspicion as well. If the FO was present then that person may be in deep sh!t as well.

 

[enigma]

Has any alcohol charge against a pilot stemming from a TSA agent saying "I smelled alcohol on his/her breath" resulted in a conviction?

I doubt it, from what I know, the TSA can not detain. They call a LEO and the LEO's go after the potential perp. If the LEO believes the TSA agent to be correct, then he will administer some kind of field sobriety test and arrest accordingly.

Actually, I wish that they did have the power to detain. As it stands, they get to make wild accusations without taking the steps necessary to validate thier conclusions; leaving it to the local police/deputies to do their dirty work.

enigma

 

[Steeler Fan]

Lets give Dave Segul, a brake here. He sits' at home at night typing away trying to feel more than he is. We all have anger issues, he no different. Me, I know i shouldz use spell check, but then what would people like Dave have to complain about. It gives everyone purpuse.

That's HILL-AIR-EE-UHSS

 

[Atlanta Vicks]

To all of the TSA haters:

I know we have heard all of the TSA monikers. Taking Sissors Away, To Stripsearch All, etc..... I used to be the same way before my wife went to work for them. Trust me though, after hearing what they go through during training and hearing some of the stories, Im glad they are there. Ive read a few posts suggesting that the TSA are out to get crewmembers and they only engage in conversation in order to "sniff out" the whinos. I asked my wife if there was a policy or unwritten rule to make small talk in order to smell if a pilot has been drinking. She told me no, that if they make "small talk" with a crewmember, its only to be nice and that they don't go looking for people drinking. Remember, they are there so that you guys don't have to "pop a cap" into anyone who decides that taking over an airplane with box cutters is a good idea.

 

[slowto250]

Kinder, Gentler TSA

Actually, in an effort to ease tensions between TSA and flight crews, they are adopting an old FAA motto : " We're here to help ".

How many airliners have struck tall buildings lately ? See, it's working pretty good, huh ?

 

[Frontier1]

I must say, what a load of arrogant pricks you are. Most of you are in the same profession. Why must you insist on treating everyone like poor bastards.

I guess the pilot profession will never have that Camaraderie that most professions have for each other. Clean up the act.

Go visit a Police of Firefighter Forum and see what respect means.

 

[slowto250]

Yeah, just ask Rodney King what a bunch of righteous cats they are. " To protect and serve "

Puleeeeez.

 

[Frontier1]

Yeah, just ask Rodney King what a bunch of righteous cats they are. " To protect and serve "

Puleeeeez.

He did fight back. Anyway, that was a couple of cops. Most of this forum is lacking respect for one another.

Seems like most on here bash each other. Even when a crash has happend most of you start digging into the deceased and their flying skillz.

I do not need to explain myself. Just about every thread has bashing in it.

 

[CatfishVT9]

Wow, what emotions over wild speculation. I can probably add some perspective on a few things though.


On this flight, the "crew van" has only 2 in it (I've done this trip a bunch). One CA, one FO. The FAs fly the flight from ATL and back as continuous duty. Unless there's lively conversation, I can see how the FO probably didn't notice.

I've only flown with one FFDO, but the procedure I saw is to go to the first TSA agent and tell them in a low voice them your FFDO status. Since this shouldn't be announced to the world, you have to get close so they can hear you. Where they go from there, I don't know, but that first contact is probably where it was noticed.

Doesn't everyone realize that everyone in the airport is looking for the next "drunk pilot"? During football seson, I like to go to the Budweiser Brewhouse in ATL to watch a game and have a meal if I have a while to wait. About every other visit, some passenger makes the "I hope that's water" comment. They're joking to make small talk, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that we're being watched.

So why even drink on the road? Do we need it that badly? Technically you could drink at lunch and be legal to fly on this flight. But why risk it? To blow a .04 at midnight west coast time, that would mean A LOT of drinking at lunchtime. If this is all true, Randy has a serious problem and I hope he gets help.

Let's be careful out there....

Catfish