Airtran hiring updates

[Fly4$]

Does anybody have any insight what the 737/717 mix will be? Just wondering how long I can expect to be on reserve in the 737.

 

[scarlet]

reserve right now is going to go over 3 years but we didn't hire for a year and half.

 

[27 driver]

Does anybody have any insight what the 737/717 mix will be? Just wondering how long I can expect to be on reserve in the 737.

With the new scope TA you can expect reserve for a long time. We are supposed to take 7 airplanes next year but they always seem to find a way to defer orders. I will believe it when I am flying them. I would be willing to bet the next 15% of our growth will go the regionals. Just a guess though.

 

[Murphy]

With the new scope TA you can expect reserve for a long time. We are supposed to take 7 airplanes next year but they always seem to find a way to defer orders. I will believe it when I am flying them. I would be willing to bet the next 15% of our growth will go the regionals. Just a guess though.

Copy dat.

If you were a high powered exec with the shiny degree from Harvard, would you fly a 717 with say a combined pilot hourly rate of $249 (Hawaiian rates, 10yr CAPT, 5yr FO) or would you farm out some flying to a tiny little 76 seater with a combined pilot hourly rate of $123 (Skywest, 10yr CAPT, 5 YR FO)?

 

[damnflyboy]

Copy dat.

If you were a high powered exec with the shiny degree from Harvard, would you fly a 717 with say a combined pilot hourly rate of $249 (Hawaiian rates, 10yr CAPT, 5yr FO) or would you farm out some flying to a tiny little 76 seater with a combined pilot hourly rate of $123 (Skywest, 10yr CAPT, 5 YR FO)?

Amen.

 

[Boxer]

Copy dat.

would you fly a 717 with say a combined pilot hourly rate of $249 (Hawaiian rates, 10yr CAPT, 5yr FO) or would you farm out some flying to a tiny little 76 seater with a combined pilot hourly rate of $123 (Skywest, 10yr CAPT, 5 YR FO)?

Bingo. We have a winner.

 

[filejw]

Copy dat.

If you were a high powered exec with the shiny degree from Harvard, would you fly a 717 with say a combined pilot hourly rate of $249 (Hawaiian rates, 10yr CAPT, 5yr FO) or would you farm out some flying to a tiny little 76 seater with a combined pilot hourly rate of $123 (Skywest, 10yr CAPT, 5 YR FO)?

One color one list...every property....

 

[Smarta$$]

And who is giving up the scope again? Not regional pilots!!! When will major pilots learn to say NO.

However, the fact that it takes 1.5+ 76 seaters to generate the revenue of a 717 will offset the pilot cost difference somewhat.

 

[flyin4jsus]

I don't know much about the TA in regarding the scope, just what I've read here of course. But is it saying that AT can fly 42 airframes up to 76 seats?

Is this something that they want to do or have the option? I know in 2002-2004 when Air Wisconsin was flying as Air Tran Jet Connect. They wanted us to fly 10 70 seater's I believe. It wasn't really profitable on either side and the numbers worked better with the 717!

I know our former CEO and Owner has joined the Board of Directors at Air Tran recently. Curious what the benefit is for that!

 

[Murphy]

I don't know much about the TA in regarding the scope, just what I've read here of course. But is it saying that AT can fly 42 airframes up to 76 seats?

Is this something that they want to do or have the option? I know in 2002-2004 when Air Wisconsin was flying as Air Tran Jet Connect. They wanted us to fly 10 70 seater's I believe. It wasn't really profitable on either side and the numbers worked better with the 717!

I know our former CEO and Owner has joined the Board of Directors at Air Tran recently. Curious what the benefit is for that!

Max of 20 86 seaters permitted. 15 now and then 5 additional with mainline aircraft increasing at a 3:1 ratio. 20% of ASMs can be farmed out to the RJ world. 86 seaters capped at a certain % of that 20%.

One of Prater's elves said this was an insignificant amount and the ignorant masses shouldn't concern themselves with this little bit of trivia.

I'm amazed that Southwest could grow to 6000 pilots, 500+ aircraft, make money, have what appears on the surface to have a management team that values their employees, and accomplish all this without RJs. Truly mindboggling. Of course, their next growth might occur with the service of our comrades north and south of the border.

 

[Lear70]

Does anybody have any insight what the 737/717 mix will be? Just wondering how long I can expect to be on reserve in the 737.

That depends on a LOT of factors...

Next class is 09/20 or 09/30, depending on who you talk to. ATL isn't going to be growing, it's going to actually be LOSING block hours from what I've been told, at least through the Fall, which is normal for this time of year anyway. More hours will be ramping up in MCO and MKE, which is why the vacancies for those cities (especially MCO) are coming out.

One factor is how many people bid those vacancies. If the ATL pilots decide to stay put until they know what the flying will look like in MCO, then new-hires will be going to MCO which seems to be equally split between the 737 and 717.

However, we're seeing at least a few pilots bid over to the 737 in the same seat, so there *may* be more of a 60/40 split of 717/737 (more 717 slots than 737's).

Honestly, it's so dynamic, that until you're sitting in class and the equipment drop is handed down, it's impossible to know.

As far as Scope goes, we've been hearing for a while that MKE doesn't support the 717 on many routes. Yes, 86 seaters are part of the new agreement. I don't like that part of it, but we bound the holding company; it is what it is.

Depending on fleet plans, it might not slow AirTran's deliveries at all. If we get an Agreement ratified and the lenders start liking us a bit better, our delivery schedule should stay intact. It *appears* as if we're shifting towards more near-international ops (Mexico, Caribbean, etc) which will require 737's.

As long as we keep growing "mainline" at the already-announced rate or faster and career tracks aren't impacted, then no harm no foul. Whether that happens or not remains to be seen... My crystal ball is a bit cloudy these days.

 

[Max Powers]

And who is giving up the scope again? Not regional pilots!!! When will major pilots learn to say NO.

However, the fact that it takes 1.5+ 76 seaters to generate the revenue of a 717 will offset the pilot cost difference somewhat.

To simplistic in your thinking guys....The 76 seaters are like crack to Airline CEOs because they push up the seats costs when they go from 117 to 76 - its a supply and demand thing. They can also offer service into places a bigger airplane can't effectively serve.

 

[General Lee]

So can someone please explain what the Airtran guys are giving up again? What is this about 86 or 76 seaters? How many? Who will fly them? Thank you.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Crash Pad]

86 seaters not flown by Airtran pilots. Way to think it through. General how many jobs did Delta cough up on that one?

 

[Lear70]

So can someone please explain what the Airtran guys are giving up again? What is this about 86 or 76 seaters? How many? Who will fly them? Thank you.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Right now, under existing Scope, AirTran can fly just about as many 50 seaters as they want, and around 40 70-seaters, based on current ASM's. The proposed Scope allows that same number of 50- and 70- seaters, and ALSO allows the company to farm out up to 15 86-seaters initially, with 5 more potentially, based on growth and ASM's for a max of 20. If AirTran isn't growing, they can't add more RJ's.

So, new Scope = 20 86-seaters, 40 70-seaters, total of 60 outsourced hulls (assuming we don't use any 50-seaters which, for the most part, are money-losers). We don't know WHO will fly them or even IF there's a CONCRETE plan for them; all we know is that they can outsource them, but haven't as of yet beyond the CURRENT SkyWest deal.

What we got back for that was Merger and Fragmentation language, Successorship language, and we bound the holding company (no alter-ego Pinnacle-Mesaba-Colgan-esque whipsawing).

The $60 Million Dollar question is: which aircraft are they going to use for growth? 737? 717? or RJ?

It will be a while before the fallout from this is fully known... As long as we keep "mainline" growing, thing will be fine. But if mainline growth stops and suddenly 15-20 86-seat RJ's start popping up around the system... You're going to have a lot of very angry AAI pilots whose upgrade gets put on long-term hold or who sit on reserve an extra year or two or three...?

For the time being, with a new contract likely requiring more staffing for better trip and duty rigs plus the new flight & duty rest provisions coming into effect next year plus our forecast growth, I don't see anything slowing down for a while. In the future? Well, my crystal ball has been a little glitchy for a while now.