AirTran DRC - judgement !

[Benjamin Dover]

Might want to "think twice" - or maybe read twice a post before responding PCL. Where exactly did I say Gary Kelly had anything to do with your contract? It was Fornano and AAI management that finally decided to pay you right? And after 6 years, the AIP coming just a few days after the announcement was probably just coincidence?

I love the "about to happen" theory. After we voted down our first TA in early 2009 I was on an AirTran flight with a few AAI ALPA guys. They were telling a couple line guys that now "for sure" AirTran will get a new contract before SWA. And then our TA 2 comes along, gets voted in September 2009 and time marched one with the "about to happen" AAI contract. I did get to see some nice "safe" taxi speeds during that illegal job action during this time. That was pretty funny, even funnier now is no AAI pilot admits they took part in that.

Anyway, you can't re-write history PCL even though many AAI pilots try to. Your AIP did not take place until after the acquisition was announced. That is a fact. But you say it would have happened anyway right? Actually I think you suggest you would have gotten a better contract had SWA not come along. I don't think there is a single Southwest pilot that does not wish AAI had been allowed to linger for a month or two to test your theory.

 

[OldManPilot]

Somebody please tell me how soon can we get rid of ALPA and bring in SWAPA now that the BS DRC thing is history?

 

[HowardBorden]

Howie, your welcome to pontificate on Hawaiian all you want. To be honest I like to hear from different perspectives about our airline.

What would be the point? What could I possibly tell you that you don't already know? I don't work there and have no real knowledge of the inner workings of an airline I have never even flown on as a passenger. My only observations would be the rehashing of tidbits of information I have picked up while reading what others say about an airline I don't work for. It would be much like your observations about SWA.

 

[737tanker]

Sorry, but we have the data from actual AirTran pilots who have transitioned, and it is a pay cut for AirTran captains. Up to $30k, depending on longevity, whether they commute, and how willing they are to pick up extra time to make up for the loss.

I recently flew with a former AirTran Capt who told me that he is taking a $30K cut but that was due to only flying 1/2 of his line, for personal reasons, at SWA. So if he flew his whole line he would have had a pay raise.

 

[Ty Webb]

Your AIP did not take place until after the acquisition was announced. That is a fact. But you say it would have happened anyway right? Actually I think you suggest you would have gotten a better contract had SWA not come along. I don't think there is a single Southwest pilot that does not wish AAI had been allowed to linger for a month or two to test your theory.

I'll tell you how many SWA pilots don't wish AAI had had a few months to finish our negotiations . . . . most of them. It's only the sore winners and poor losers that want to keep rehashing this stuff.

 

[OldManPilot]

OK... this horse has been beat to death!!!!!

WHEN CAN WE GET RID OF ALPA AND HAVE SWAPA ???????

 

[slaquer5]

OK... this horse has been beat to death!!!!!

WHEN CAN WE GET RID OF ALPA AND HAVE SWAPA ???????

Amen brother

No one on here is going to change the others mind .


Why not debate something more worth while .


Like what is the best conceal carry ?

 

[Britpilot]

amen brother




like what is the best conceal carry ?

xds 45

 

[slaquer5]

xds 45

I am going to say Glock 26 or G27. Then for summer when not wearing much is Bodyguard 380


Its alway nice to try/buy something else .

 

[redflyer65]

I second the G27.

 

[27 driver]

I third the G27 gen 4

 

[Britpilot]

I am going to say Glock 26 or G27. Then for summer when not wearing much is Bodyguard 380


Its alway nice to try/buy something else .

I tried the Glock, didn't get along with it so replaced it with the XDS 45.
For summer I rely on my Beretta Tomcat 32.

 

[OldManPilot]

I go with the S&W M&P 40C

 

[slaquer5]

I have been looking at getting the H&K sk

Some good reviews .

 

[Britpilot]

I go with the S&W M&P 40C

I like that one too. Nice piece.

 

[Britpilot]

I have been looking at getting the H&K sk

Some good reviews .

Top quality. I have a USP 40. Over 6000 rounds through it, never failed once.

 

[MINIME]

I own the HK P2000SK and love it for carry. Also own Glocks, but I feel more comfortable carrying the HK chambered due to its heavy (first) trigger pull. Plus, it's never ever had any kind of malfunction with any ammo.

 

[HowardBorden]

Amen brother

No one on here is going to change the others mind .


Why not debate something more worth while .


Like what is the best conceal carry ?

xds 45

I am going to say Glock 26 or G27. Then for summer when not wearing much is Bodyguard 380


Its alway nice to try/buy something else .

I second the G27.

I third the G27 gen 4

I tried the Glock, didn't get along with it so replaced it with the XDS 45.
For summer I rely on my Beretta Tomcat 32.

I go with the S&W M&P 40C

I have been looking at getting the H&K sk

Some good reviews .

I like that one too. Nice piece.

Wow, there is something we can all agree on! Maybe we can schedule a FAT vs. RSW target shoot.

Wait a minute, on second thought, maybe that is not such a good idea.

 

[Britpilot]

Wow, there is something we can all agree on! Maybe we can schedule a FAT vs. RSW target shoot.

Wait a minute, on second thought, maybe that is not such a good idea.

I'll be up for it if we can include some semi auto shotgun stuff.
:beer:

 

[canyonblue]

Someone who elects to bid a seat isn't the same as someone who is displaced, displaced is against someone's will right?

I really do not understand your thought process, the SLI approved by the AAI pilots did not have any AAI pilots holding Captain seats at SWA, how can you be displaced from a seat that you cant even hold? Drink the wine and have the Dog explain the intricate nomenclature of a contract.

 

[HowardBorden]

I'll be up for it if we can include some semi auto shotgun stuff.
:beer:

Me too, as long as we can all agree to aim down range!

 

[Dan Roman]

I really do not understand your thought process, the SLI approved by the AAI pilots did not have any AAI pilots holding Captain seats at SWA, how can you be displaced from a seat that you cant even hold? Drink the wine and have the Dog explain the intricate nomenclature of a contract.

The dog said you are looking at it from your perspective that the agreement was fair, but ignores any other perspective but your own. He said you are missing the fact that the flying the AirTran pilots brought to the merger was their flying and any flying a SWA pilot does that was previously flown by an AirTran pilot is displacing the AirTran pilot from HIS flying.
Smart dog!

 

[slaquer5]

I'll be up for it if we can include some semi auto shotgun stuff.
:beer:

Now your talking . It would beat any golf scramble that SWA seems to always have .

You could count me in.

 

[slaquer5]

I own the HK P2000SK and love it for carry. Also own Glocks, but I feel more comfortable carrying the HK chambered due to its heavy (first) trigger pull. Plus, it's never ever had any kind of malfunction with any ammo.

Did you get it with the LEM trigger ?

 

[SWA Bubba]

Love the Glocks, but the 26/27 are too small. Try the 19/23; they're the exact same width, but hold more rounds and are easier to handle (esp. in the .40). For summer carry with shorts & a t-shirt, there are any number of single-stack 9mm models that'll do the trick.

Bubba

 

[MINIME]

Did you get it with the LEM trigger ?

Did not do the LEM trigger. My goal with SA/DA is the heaviness of that first pull. I believe you lose that with the LEM. I consider the heavy first pull a good alternative to an actual safety. Probably like most of you, I'm not a big fan of safeties on handguns.

 

[j41driver]

Used to carry a Glock 30...XDs coming soon. Me likey.

 

[slaquer5]

Love the Glocks, but the 26/27 are too small. Try the 19/23; they're the exact same width, but hold more rounds and are easier to handle (esp. in the .40). For summer carry with shorts & a t-shirt, there are any number of single-stack 9mm models that'll do the trick.

Bubba

Thanks Bubbba

I have both the 19 and 23
I. Use them for shooting IDPA. I just like something small for everyday carry .
The 19 and 23 would show to much if I used for everyday carry .

 

[dicko]

Amen brother

Like what is the best conceal carry ?

Rectum ? They'll never find it there. Maybe I misunderstood the question.

 

[Jim]

The sentiment of the statement is centered on the fact that neither you nor Dan have the slightest idea about the culture at SWA or what it means to an actual employee of the airline you both seem so happy to denigrate at every opportunity. I would never attempt to pontificate about what is what at your beloved Hawaiian because I'm smart enough to realize I don't have the slightest clue about what is or is or is not happening at an airline I don't actually work for.

The outsiders looking in only have the opportunity to make judgements about the wholly unique situation facing these two pilot groups from the perspective of the endless banal musings of the usual suspects (me included) pushing their agenda through bits and pieces of the entire puzzle. Outsiders are not privy to internal union communications or internal company info. Outsiders aren't listening to daily communications from Gary Kelly or Bob Jordan. Outsiders are not getting more than a tiny fraction of the entire picture. So please forgive me when I choose to wholly disregard the opinions of those that I know to be not entirely informed on the issues at hand.

Take everything you just posted and apply it to SWA pilots telling Air Tran pilots what a better place SWA is and how happy they should be to now be SWA pilots. You (SWA pilots) did not work at Air Tran and have no clue to what it was like to work there (just like I am supposedly making a judgment about SWA).

I am not knocking SWA, I am knocking SWA pilots with such narrow vision they can not conceive some pilots would rather stay at their own airline than be SWA pilots. I also realize that this only applies to a few SWA pilots and not the vast majority. But those few are the vocal ones.