AirTran Airways announces new service to Bermuda

[texman]

Some of you need to pop a few relaxers with a stiff beverage. Chill out homies. Not every post requires you to launch an offensive/defensive salvo at your future co-workers. Play nice, it's the holidays.

You know diss playa!

 

[texman]

I never said our contract was better Nancy. I simply stated a fact. Sorry if that hurts your feelings. It took SWAPA about 30 years to climb to the top of the pay scales and that only occurred with concessionary contracts at the Legacies. Besides, you don't have any more say than I do about this deal. Your boss and the shareholders thought this was a good deal so it is happening. Thump your chest all you want, in the end you have very little say in how this goes down.

Not just our boss, but yours too.




The back story

The deal began when, during his first quarter conference call, Fornaro signaled his interest in consolidation. Next came a call from Kelly.

“I called Bob in the Spring and asked him ‘are you interested in exploring an acquisition?’,” said Kelly. “I outlined the way I was thinking about it so I didn’t set expectations he wasn’t open to. He was open to at least hearing what I had to say. He made clear that AirTran was not for sale but open to discussions which took place over a number of months.”

Fornaro continued. “When Gary called I wasn’t sure what the subject would be because two or three years ago we talked about codesharing in Chicago,” he said. “I didn’t know whether it would be an acquisition or some other type of partnership. I was really unsure. After the conversation I thought about Southwest relative to AirTran having vast resources. Then I thought you put yourself in a position to win and with that, I realized that we’d be in a much better position and our 8,000 people would be better off for it.

“There was a sense of sadness,” he continued. “When I started we had a 20-year-old fleet and now it is 6.5 years old. We didn’t run a very good airline and now we do. A lot of people didn’t think we could do it but we did and grew to be the second largest carrier in the world’s busiest airport. But still, Southwest has huge financial resources that we don’t have. If we want to be a success; if we want to win, we have to create opportunities where our people are better off and have brighter futures. We have struggled as a company but we are flexible and innovative and, with what Southwest’s resources brings our people, I ended up being very excited. By joining forces we could do more together than what we would be able to accomplish on our own.

“This was also an easy win for our shareholders,” he said. “If your share price is USD4.50 and the potential offer is between USD7.25 and USD7.75, it’s a great deal for shareholders. AirTran could probably get back there on its own but the industry is fraught with risk. So you look at a sure thing with a strong premium, you feel the shareholders will favor it.”

 

[texman]

source. www.centreforaviation.com

 

[ivauir]

There is no debate SWA's contract is better. What does that have to do with the price of tea in china......or in this case what does that have to do with the SLI.....

Max,

This isn't the price of tea in China, it is the labor agreement that you might get to work under.

 

[PapaWoody]

There is no debate SWA's contract is better. What does that have to do with the price of tea in china......or in this case what does that have to do with the SLI.....

I'm pretty sure that the 40-90% pay increases and all the rest of the vast improvements in our contract vs. yours are going to have a lot to do with the SLI. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. We'll just have to wait and see, I guess.

PapaWoody

 

[Ty Webb]

Some of these responses are so October.

 

[redflyer65]

I never said our contract was better Nancy.

That's exactly what you insinuated Sally.

I think Papa is right, the massive differences will be factored in...

Whether it's an agreement or arbitration. The AAI contract brings us nothing, can you say the same?

 

[roughneck]

......................

 

[aa73]

Anything more than 120 mins single engine from land would be ETOPS. The East Coast to BDA is all within that time range.

 

[SKC]

Anything more than 120 mins single engine from land would be ETOPS. The East Coast to BDA is all within that time range.

Actually, according to Advisory Circular 120-42B, any operations beyond 60 mins from a suitable alternate (not "land") for a twin engined airplane is ETOPS. If it was a 120 min rule, nearly the entire North Atlantic would be able to be flown without ETOPS, which we know to not be the case. The most common types of ETOPS certification are 120 min and 180 min, but everything beyond 60 mins requires ETOPS.

Now, if JB and AT are able to operate to/from BDA without following ETOPS requirements, that's different.

 

[atldc9]

We are operating under the 60 minute limit.

 

[SKC]

We are operating under the 60 minute limit.

Nevermind, just realized the gaping hole in my thinking.

 

[Kharma Police]

More importantly, will there be an overnight there?

 

[dicko]

More importantly, will there be an overnight there?

This is Da Tranny we work for. What do you think ?

If they can push it to a turn, they'll try. If they can fly it seasonally, in the wrong season. They will.

If they are forced to have an overnight; It will be constantly needed to conduct IOE by some near octogenarian with a sack full of Viagra and bad intentions :nuts:

 

[jball2]

D- That was Awesome!:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

 

[Kharma Police]

This is Da Tranny we work for. What do you think ?

If they can push it to a turn, they'll try. If they can fly it seasonally, in the wrong season. They will.

If they are forced to have an overnight; It will be constantly needed to conduct IOE by some near octogenarian with a sack full of Viagra and bad intentions :nuts:

The funny (or sad) thing is that you are spot on!

 

[ATLplt]

*wiping tomato soup and snot off my screen*

Thanks for the laugh, dicko.

 

[27 driver]

That's exactly what you insinuated Sally.

I think Papa is right, the massive differences will be factored in...

Whether it's an agreement or arbitration. The AAI contract brings us nothing, can you say the same?

It doesn't really matter. If AAI didn't bring anything then SWA would not have made an offer. I am willing to accept whatever the arbitrator offers. That is how it works. If he does what you think he will do than fine. We will live with it. I just don't think the arbitrators use pay scales or current contract as the sole source of integration criteria. I could be wrong, who knows. Pay scales go up and down. Seniority is for the life of your career. You will vote, we will vote, then the arbitrator will have the final say.

 

[GuppyWN]

Oh come on ya'll. Airtran, the company, brings ATL and a few orders. That's really what this is all about.

That's about it.

SWA brings the rest of the country, a GIGANTIC pay raise, great work rules, expansion, cheap(ish) medical, good benies, stability, etc, etc, etc.

Let's quit bull********************ting each other about our version of the facts. We need Airtran to own ATL. Airtran guys need SWA for everything else.

Quit being babies about it and let's get 'er done. Or not.

Gup

 

[ATLplt]

The rest of the country? Gup, come on now...

 

[GuppyWN]

OK. I'll give you credit for Moline.

Gup

 

[27 driver]

OK. I'll give you credit for Moline.

Gup

I will trade you LBB for MLI.

 

[27 driver]

Oh come on ya'll. Airtran, the company, brings ATL and a few orders. That's really what this is all about.

That's about it.

SWA brings the rest of the country, a GIGANTIC pay raise, great work rules, expansion, cheap(ish) medical, good benies, stability, etc, etc, etc.

Let's quit bull********************ting each other about our version of the facts. We need Airtran to own ATL. Airtran guys need SWA for everything else.

Quit being babies about it and let's get 'er done. Or not.

Gup

We don't need SWA for anything. Our pay rates have slowly gone up just like yours. AAI is half as old as SWA. It took SWAPA 30 + years to get where you are at. AAI is barely 15 years old. Your contract is better, we all know that. If you expect us to kiss you ass because of that well it ain't gonna happen.

 

[PapaWoody]

We don't need SWA for anything. Our pay rates have slowly gone up just like yours. AAI is half as old as SWA. It took SWAPA 30 + years to get where you are at. AAI is barely 15 years old. Your contract is better, we all know that. If you expect us to kiss you ass because of that well it ain't gonna happen.

True, but if you expect guys that were hired here at the SAME TIME as at AAI to be junior to you....WELL, IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN. Had you been offered a SWA job at the same time as your AAI job, let's face it, the SWA job you would'a took. But that didn't happen, so let's just you quit actin' like you'se guys are in the same stratosphere and let's get're done with a little realism and move on. Seriously, let's interject a little common sense into this process. ANY AAI guy that coulda woulda got hired at SWA b4 he/she got hired at AAI would have taken the SWA job. Economics101. Keep tellin' yourself different...but the facts are what they be (ie our superior contract/workrules/benefit package/retirement/etc. etc. and so on and so on)....seriously guys....it is what is, you WIN B...I...G...so let's move on and make the promised growth to the system happen. Quit being upset about the massive gains that you get/deserve and move on.

Fraternally,
PapaWoody

 

[GuppyWN]

We don't need SWA for anything. Our pay rates have slowly gone up just like yours. AAI is half as old as SWA. It took SWAPA 30 + years to get where you are at. AAI is barely 15 years old. Your contract is better, we all know that. If you expect us to kiss you ass because of that well it ain't gonna happen.

Son you seem to forget that Airtran furloughed 10% of the pilots to keep from filing bankruptcy.

We're all going to be just fine. I'm ready to get past this and into the next phase.

Gup

 

[OldManPilot]

True, but if you expect guys that were hired here at the SAME TIME as at AAI to be junior to you....WELL, IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN. Had you been offered a SWA job at the same time as your AAI job, let's face it, the SWA job you would'a took. But that didn't happen, so let's just you quit actin' like you'se guys are in the same stratosphere and let's get're done with a little realism and move on. Seriously, let's interject a little common sense into this process. ANY AAI guy that coulda woulda got hired at SWA b4 he/she got hired at AAI would have taken the SWA job. Economics101. Keep tellin' yourself different...but the facts are what they be (ie our superior contract/workrules/benefit package/retirement/etc. etc. and so on and so on)....seriously guys....it is what is, you WIN B...I...G...so let's move on and make the promised growth to the system happen. Quit being upset about the massive gains that you get/deserve and move on.

Fraternally,
PapaWoody

I understand why you think this way. Economics are not necessarily the driving force behind every ones thinking. Here were my thoughts when going to AirTran.
1. Southwest was NEVER a consideration simply because I refuse to buy a type rating. Paid training is a disgrace at this level of flying in my opinion.
2. Atlanta is a very easy commute.
3. Airtran pilots had a great attitude and reputation.
4. Owned all their own flying.
5. They flew into my city.
6. Their upgrade time was reasonable.

These are what I can easily remember at this time. My thoughts were not wrong because they did not included "The Highest Paid Airline", they were about what was important to me and my family. Please stop trying to convince everyone that financial gain is all that is important. Please spend a little time thinking about #1.
Just my thoughts.

 

[Luv2BFlyin]

I agree with old man. I never applied to WN either mainly for reason number one and to a lesser extent the others. Not all of us are that excited about this deal either. The majority of us will make the best of the situation though and I'm confident we'll assimilate well.

 

[Cometman]

Not all of us are that excited about this deal either. The majority of us will make the best of the situation though and I'm confident we'll assimilate well.

Really. I would think you are alone on this one. Not even Ty dicko or lear70 would agree with you. However, I am sure you will make the best of the situation. It will be hard but please really try to be happy.

 

[GuppyWN]

I agree with Old Man as well with a caveat. I didn't buy the type until after I was hired. I figured I wasn't going to let $8K stand between my ego and a great job. Now I can buy a type rating a month with the difference in pay I earn.

Doesn't matter if we are happy or not about this deal. It isn't going to change, for now, the fact that It's On!

Gup

 

[OldManPilot]

I agree with Old Man as well with a caveat. I didn't buy the type until after I was hired. I figured I wasn't going to let $8K stand between my ego and a great job. Now I can buy a type rating a month with the difference in pay I earn.

Doesn't matter if we are happy or not about this deal. It isn't going to change, for now, the fact that It's On!

Gup

Please listen to yourself It's not ego my friend, it's principle. Just as you think we (AAI PILOTS) bring nothing to the table and should be treated thusly. Many believe that Paying for a job is just as wrong. You were a professional pilot before you got hired at Southwest yet you sold out your professional principles for $$$ and the job. That is your decision, but please don't try to shove your (grand financial southwest windfall)l down others throats as the greatest thing since sliced bread. There is still a thing called integrity.