Age 65

[Fubijaakr]

My beef is that these guys/babyboomers (121 airline) knew all too well over the past 30 years when their time would be up....BS they knew the rules going in.

Rules change all the time. Whether in the NFL or the FAA. You play by the rules in force at the time.

 

[WolfManPack]

Me Me Me Me

Rules change all the time. Whether in the NFL or the FAA. You play by the rules in force at the time.

Great, if the rules change to require only one pilot in the cockpit altogether I'm sure you'll be happy to accept it and move on right? What about if they change to eliminate pilots in the cockpit altogether?

What about if someone like Hitler took over the country tomorrow and required all Jewish people to be exterminated, would you play by those rules?

How about if the US government decided on day that couples are only allowed on baby per decade per family and all other children are to be killed upon birth would you play by those rules?

Yes rules change, but that doesn't make it right does it?

Me Me Me!!!!!!!!!

 

[waveflyer]

Now that's just crazy there... Not exactly helping the argument man

 

[Flopgut]

deleted.

 

[spacecadet1]

Don't mind the old farts, although they do fart more than us younger folk. Also, would youz guys please turn down the speaker volume in the cockpit; it's like visiting gramps in the nursing home.

 

[Captain Morgan]

Don't mind the old farts, although they do fart more than us younger folk. Also, would youz guys please turn down the speaker volume in the cockpit; it's like visiting gramps in the nursing home.

"Huh,... What did you say?!..."

 

[gutshotdraw]

I airlined back to the United States yesterday in the back of a Continental 777. The aircraft was Captained by a gentleman making his last flight after 3 decades with the carrier and a distinguished Navy career (including retirement from the Reserves). Judging by the biography in the seat back pocket, I calculated his age at 59 or 60 meaning he willingly gave up 5 more years at the absolute TOP of the Continental heap. I can't say why he chose to retire except for his stated desire on the PA to spend more time with his family. But I can say: Good on ya Captain S. Your service to your country and your company are appreciated and enjoy your well-earned retirement.

 

[Nindiri]

BS,
Yes, it is about safety.

Nah, safety has nothing to do with it. It's all about economics and career progression. Some guys are honest about it, others try to hide behind "safety" arguments and make up all kinds of crazy stories about those "senile" 60 year old guys who just happen to be senior to them.

 

[Flopgut]

I airlined back to the United States yesterday in the back of a Continental 777. The aircraft was Captained by a gentleman making his last flight after 3 decades with the carrier and a distinguished Navy career (including retirement from the Reserves). Judging by the biography in the seat back pocket, I calculated his age at 59 or 60 meaning he willingly gave up 5 more years at the absolute TOP of the Continental heap. I can't say why he chose to retire except for his stated desire on the PA to spend more time with his family. But I can say: Good on ya Captain S. Your service to your country and your company are appreciated and enjoy your well-earned retirement.

Part of the story that is not being told. CAL has a significant number retiring right now and they all seem to be cut from the same cloth. I don't know exactly how to characterize them, but it's a lot less about luck and timing than some of their contemporaries would like us to believe. This is especially true of this sort of CAL pilot.

The tipping point for the membership's "Yes" vote on CAL's concessionary contract was protecting the 100% lump sum retirement option. Captain S. gets a check for around $900k. Yeah, it probably should be more but it's a whole lot more than many will get and the very best we could have preserved.

 

[Mr.B]

We need to be vigilant of Age 70. These same guys who pushed Age 65 will reload and push for Age 70 when the time is right. Same agenda, same arguments will be used in my opinion. Granted, it will be a much harder "sell" this time but they must be stopped.

Greedy bastages.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Part of the story that is not being told. CAL has a significant number retiring right now and they all seem to be cut from the same cloth. I don't know exactly how to characterize them, but it's a lot less about luck and timing than some of their contemporaries would like us to believe. This is especially true of this sort of CAL pilot.

The tipping point for the membership's "Yes" vote on CAL's concessionary contract was protecting the 100% lump sum retirement option. Captain S. gets a check for around $900k. Yeah, it probably should be more but it's a whole lot more than many will get and the very best we could have preserved.

Wasn't sure if that was the case or not. No way to know how this particular pilot voted on that contract but either way I can't blame him for taking the lump sum by leaving now if staying means he would lose it.

 

[Flopgut]

Wasn't sure if that was the case or not. No way to know how this particular pilot voted on that contract but either way I can't blame him for taking the lump sum by leaving now if staying means he would lose it.

The GATT rate moving to match the Federal Funds rate has a bearing as well. This pilot's lump sum amount will be about $90K less after November. And yes, we wish more could retire like Captain S.

 

[C-150ETOPS]

Nah, safety has nothing to do with it. It's all about economics and career progression. Some guys are honest about it, others try to hide behind "safety" arguments and make up all kinds of crazy stories about those "senile" 60 year old guys who just happen to be senior to them.

I guess you were stupid or senile to read the rest of my post instead of selectively cutting one small quote.

My stories weren't some made up "crazy stories", they were real life experiences with old guys. My own personal view is that I'd just keep my mouth shut if it was just the economic issue. It would be a s-hit sandwich, but that's life.

As I said, I had enough experiences with 60+ year old guys trying to fly NDB's in Lears with fuel in the tip tanks to have a vaild statistical sample that there is a problem. I don't need old goats telling me there isn't a problem when their entire reference point is other old goats telling themselves there isn't a problem as well as lame sim checks done by other old goats. The mental slide is there bud, it's difficult to ,and sad to see happen to my own family members, but it's real.

I've also seem some of the late 50's group slide backwards too. The "crazy story" marathon runner was a real case. Body in top shape, better than me at 20. The brain was in a real slide. 188 people in back didn't have a clue to his FU's. That is why I will check ages before the wife and chitlin's ride in back. Keep in mind, if it is a sharp 60+ guy I've flown with, I won't have a problem with it.

The truth hurts sometimes, especially when the retirement is destroyed and the market sucks.

 

[Skywest Pylot]

Judging by the biography in the seat back pocket, I calculated his age at 59 or 60 meaning he willingly gave up 5 more years at the absolute TOP of the Continental heap. I can't say why he chose to retire except for his stated desire on the PA to spend more time with his family.

Naw, It's much better to die alone at the controls of a "heavy". Why retire when you can selfishly keep younger furloughed guys out on the street who are struggling to support a family? I am started to believe the 60-65ers are sticking around because there isn't anything to go home to. Selfishness is a cancer that eventually destroys its host.

 

[Fubijaakr]

What about if someone like Hitler took over the country tomorrow and required all Jewish people to be exterminated, would you play by those rules?

Man, Godwin's Law kicked in EARLY on this one.

Godwin's Rule of Nazi Analogies, sometimes also known as Godwin's Law, is a theory put forward by Mike Godwin in 1990. Godwin noticed that long-threaded discussions on the Internet tended to turn into mud slinging competitions by the end. The longer a thread got, the more likely it was that a Nazi comparison would be dragged into the discussion. Godwin's Rule states that: “As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one.”

But, back to the topic at hand...

It appears to me that virtually all of you who are virulantly opposed to the rule use the "safety flag" as a cover for your own frustration at having your upgrade delayed 5 years.

Yes rules change, but that doesn't make it right does it?

Me Me Me!!!!!!!!!

So, who's really screaming "me, Me, ME!"?

P.S. Often, an example of Godwin's Rule accompanies hyperbole. The idea is to invalidate the opposition by comparing it to the Nazi Party. However, this can backfire, and usually does. Unless the comparison is valid, the person who brought up Nazis or Hitler is considered to be the loser. In a rational discussion or debate on or off the Internet, resorting to a Nazi comparison is generally a strong indicator that you have run out of material to discuss or support your claims.