Age 65 Revolution devours it's own.....

[Full of LUV]

Well it looks like the Age 65 revolution has devoured its own......

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2008-11-18-stevens-gop_N.htm

Old guy corruption takes many forms. It's called "rationalization" when you make a bad decision and then spend your brain cells trying to defend it rather than thinking strategically.

 

[iflyhigh]

Crap I wish they would of gotten rid of this guy a year earlier.

Maybe than I would not be furloughed. (Dobut it though)

 

[SpauldingSmails]

It used to be "eat the rich", I think the way things are going nowadays, with the greedy old farts everywhere, it'll be "eat the old".

 

[Ratherbsurfing]

While i'm not a big fan of Mr. Stevens he did get it right with respect to age 65 in my opinion. If you want to retire at 60 do it. Those of us who are healthy and want to continue flying shouldn't arbitrarily be told we have to quit at a certain point for no good reason. I'm a younger guy by the way so i'm not really all that affected by the change.

 

[mynameisjim]

Oh Boy

 

[Poahi]

want to continue flying shouldn't arbitrarily be told we have to quit at a certain point for no good reason.

The law arbitrarily requires that you retire at the certain point of age 65.

 

[Joey Bagodonutz]

Convicted on felony charges and only narrowly loses. After this and Palin I'm convinced Alaska is full of dumb people.

 

[Freight Dog]

I had the privilege of flying with a super nice gentleman who was retired at 60 and was fortunate to get hired at this little supplemental a couple years later as a captain.

He was in phenomenal physical shape. But in the cockpit, you could clearly see the signs of aging/slowing down. The man should have been a poster boy for maintaining age 60 rule. Frankly, flying with this captain, while fun enroute, required excessive amount of babysitting from the right seat.

I'm sorry, but we're not captains in the right seat, and doubling or tripling our work load because your marbles aren't spinning fast enough anymore is not exactly contributing to safety - quite the opposite, it's dangerous.

I stand by what I've been saying all along - for every one pilot over 60 that is truly good to go, there are at least 4 or so that should hang up their headsets.

 

[retired guy]

I had the privilege of flying with a super nice gentleman who was retired at 60 and was fortunate to get hired at this little supplemental a couple years later as a captain.

He was in phenomenal physical shape. But in the cockpit, you could clearly see the signs of aging/slowing down. The man should have been a poster boy for maintaining age 60 rule. Frankly, flying with this captain, while fun enroute, required excessive amount of babysitting from the right seat.

I'm sorry, but we're not captains in the right seat, and doubling or tripling our work load because your marbles aren't spinning fast enough anymore is not exactly contributing to safety - quite the opposite, it's dangerous.

I stand by what I've been saying all along - for every one pilot over 60 that is truly good to go, there are at least 4 or so that should hang up their headsets.

I buy most of this post, but will disagree with the 4 to 1 statement. My observation makes it about 1 to 1. I flew copilot across the pond (on the L 1011) with the "old guys'. I found that about half of them were really losing their edge. You, as a copilot, had to be real sharp to make them believe that what you wanted to do was their idea. BTW, I quit at 57, and glad I did. I realized that was getting a bit of extra "help".

 

[ifly90]

While i'm not a big fan of Mr. Stevens he did get it right with respect to age 65 in my opinion. If you want to retire at 60 do it. Those of us who are healthy and want to continue flying shouldn't arbitrarily be told we have to quit at a certain point for no good reason. I'm a younger guy by the way so i'm not really all that affected by the change.

Yes you are. All of us under every 60 and older guy on a seniority list is affected no matter what age you are.

 

[Stiffler]

Convicted on felony charges and only narrowly loses. After this and Palin I'm convinced Alaska is full of dumb people.

Mayor Marion Barry snorts cocaine off a hooker's jumblies and is caught by the FBI on tape, gets convicted, and spends 6 moths in jail....result....re-elected.
Rep. William Jefferson caught on tape by the FBI accepting a bribe, has $90,000 in his freezer (cause that's where everybody keeps $90,000), and is federally indicted...result....re-elected.
Sen. Barney Frank runs a male prostitution ring out of his apartment and plays dumb about it....result...no charges...still in office.
Gov. Elliott Spitzer visits a hooker (at least she was hot) using State money to pay her. Result...no charges.
Sen. John Edwards preaches about marriage and claims to be a family man, meanwhile he is having at least one affair. He denies it until it is finally proven. Then he wants to be left alone to be with his family and claims the media is out to get him.
The Rev. Jesse Jackson preaches morality yet has an affair that results in a "love child". Then uses donations to the "Rainbow/Push Coalition" (a non-profit organization) to pay the woman off and pay her child support....result....more media coverage and donations.
Gov. Jim McGreevey has an affair with a man who he appointed as his homeland security advisor (who wasn't an American citizen, with little to no experience or qualifications). When the truth comes out, he denies any favors to his lover. Result...no charges.

Yeah, you're right. It's Alaska that is full of dumb people.

 

[instructordude]

While i'm not a big fan of Mr. Stevens he did get it right with respect to age 65 in my opinion. If you want to retire at 60 do it. Those of us who are healthy and want to continue flying shouldn't arbitrarily be told we have to quit at a certain point for no good reason. I'm a younger guy by the way so i'm not really all that affected by the change.

Great post! Those who want to stay can and those who want to leave can. Age 60 was blatant discrimination and if it wasn't for the great Prater and Sen Stevens recognizing this injustice we would still be stuck in the stone ages.

I tip my hat to these brave gentleman!

 

[mynameisjim]

... Age 60 was blatant discrimination...

So what is Age 65?

 

[Bringupthebird]

A start.

Seriously, if someone has a problem with a pilot of any age and stays silent, they are an accomplice to whatever tragedy occurs (and that's what you're solely concerned with- safety, right?).

 

[Soulfly]

Professional FO Instructordude.
Maybe you need to go back to school.

Age 65 is just as arbitrary as Age 60.



ar·bi·trar·y (är'bĭ-trěr'ē) Pronunciation Key
adj.

1. Determined by chance, whim, or impulse, and not by necessity, reason, or principle: stopped at the first motel we passed, an arbitrary choice.
2. Based on or subject to individual judgment or preference: The diet imposes overall calorie limits, but daily menus are arbitrary.
3. Established by a court or judge rather than by a specific law or statute: an arbitrary penalty.
4. Not limited by law; despotic: the arbitrary rule of a dictator.

 

[Joey Bagodonutz]

Mayor Marion Barry snorts cocaine off a hooker's jumblies and is caught by the FBI on tape, gets convicted, and spends 6 moths in jail....result....re-elected.
Rep. William Jefferson caught on tape by the FBI accepting a bribe, has $90,000 in his freezer (cause that's where everybody keeps $90,000), and is federally indicted...result....re-elected.
Sen. Barney Frank runs a male prostitution ring out of his apartment and plays dumb about it....result...no charges...still in office.
Gov. Elliott Spitzer visits a hooker (at least she was hot) using State money to pay her. Result...no charges.
Sen. John Edwards preaches about marriage and claims to be a family man, meanwhile he is having at least one affair. He denies it until it is finally proven. Then he wants to be left alone to be with his family and claims the media is out to get him.
The Rev. Jesse Jackson preaches morality yet has an affair that results in a "love child". Then uses donations to the "Rainbow/Push Coalition" (a non-profit organization) to pay the woman off and pay her child support....result....more media coverage and donations.
Gov. Jim McGreevey has an affair with a man who he appointed as his homeland security advisor (who wasn't an American citizen, with little to no experience or qualifications). When the truth comes out, he denies any favors to his lover. Result...no charges.

Yeah, you're right. It's Alaska that is full of dumb people.

Sure I could have mentioned those and a few more but was staying on topic.

Bottom line - this world is overloaded with stupid people.

 

[JudgeSmails218]

Many guys and gals that are furloughed right now wouldn't have been had the Age 60 rule had stayed in place!

 

[UndauntedFlyer]

So what is Age 65?

Age 65 is also discrimination. We need to get rid of any mandatory age: If you can pass the physical and the check-rides you should be able to keep flying. Why not? Isn't age 65 just as arbitrary as age 60? Yes,, of course. So there you are, let’s be fair and get rid of age-65 in favor of no age.

 

[Freight Dog]

A start.

Seriously, if someone has a problem with a pilot of any age and stays silent, they are an accomplice to whatever tragedy occurs (and that's what you're solely concerned with- safety, right?).

Very true.

 

[Paul R. Smith]

Very true.

You might say it has some truthiness to it.

 

[C-150ETOPS]

Great post! Those who want to stay can and those who want to leave can. Age 60 was blatant discrimination and if it wasn't for the great Prater and Sen Stevens recognizing this injustice we would still be stuck in the stone ages.

I tip my hat to these brave gentleman!

Well "Skippy",

I wish you well. I hope you survive and avoid any violations like I did after flying with age 60+ guys in Part 91 bizjets, and those nearing age 60 at a major.
Watching "Gramps" instantly snap a LR-25D into a 45 degree bank/-15 Kt Vref at 300 AFL tends to give one clarity on the issue.

 

[C-150ETOPS]

A start.

Seriously, if someone has a problem with a pilot of any age and stays silent, they are an accomplice to whatever tragedy occurs (and that's what you're solely concerned with- safety, right?).

Good plan, but in the real world, it can work a little differently.

With all the discrimination issues, the old days of the cigar chomping "super" chief pilot righting a dangerous pilot are long gone. Especially with the subjective criterea of performance issues (no data trail) of a pilot if there is no damage involved.

In many other cases such as a chitty Flt Department, the "Skippy" junior FO might get hung out to dry if he questions an elderly Captains performance.

20 years ago, I was "Skippy", and was hung out to dry for bringing the performance of a 63 year old to light. Age was a factor with him, no question.

 

[Jetjockey]

Stand-by for age 70 advocates.

 

[HOUMAN]

I got a little laugh out of this:

This is just a simple cut and paste from your average everyday riding lawn mower users manual. Just skip down to the end and read the last "Safety Warning"

SAFETY RULES​

Safe Operation Practices for Ride​

−on Mowers
WARNING: This cutting machine is capable of amputating hands and feet and throwing objects. Failure to observe the
following safety instructions could result in serious injury or death.​

I. General operation​

1. Read, understand and follow all instructions in the Instruction Book, on the machine, the engine and with any attachments before
starting.
2. Only allow responsible adults, who are familiar with the instructions, to operate the machine.
3. Clear the area of objects such as rocks, toys, wire, etc., which could be picked up and thrown by the blade.
4. Be sure the area is clear of other people before mowing. Stop the machine if anyone enters the area.
5. Never carry passengers.
6. Turn off power to the blades or any attachments before backing up. Do not mow in reverse unless absolutely necessary. Always look
down and behind before and while backing.
7. Be aware of the mower discharge direction and do not point it at anyone. Do not operate the mower without either the entire grass bagger
or the mower guard in place.
8. Slow down before turning.
9. Never leave a machine unattended with the engine running. Always turn off the blade(s), set the parking brake, stop the engine and
remove the key before dismounting.
10. Turn off power to attachment(s) when transporting or not in use. Turn off the blade(s) when not mowing.
11. Stop the engine before removing the grass bagger or unclogging the chute.
12. Mow only in daylight or good artificial light.
13. Do not operate the machine while under the influence of alcohol or drugs or when very tired.
14. Watch for traffic when operating near or crossing roadways.
15. Use extra caution when loading or unloading the machine into a trailer or truck.​

OWNER’S INFORMATION​

4 ​

F−0506014L​

16. Always wear goggles, safety glasses, or an eye shield when you operate the unit to protect your eyes from foreign objects that can be
thrown from the unit. Always wear eye protection when you make an adjustment or repair to the machine.
17. Use care when pulling loads or using heavy equipment.
a. Use only approved drawbar hitch points.
b. Limit loads to those you can safely control.
c. Do not turn sharply. Use care when backing.
d. Use counterweights or wheel weights when suggested in the Instruction Book.
18. Do not operate this machine if you are taking drugs or other medication which can cause drowsiness or affect your ability to operate
this machine.
19. Do not use this machine if you are mentally or physically unable to operate this machine safely.
20. Data indicates that operators, age 60 years and above, are involved in a large percentage of riding mower related injuries. These operators
should evaluate their ability to operate a riding mower safely enough to protect themselves and others from serious injury.​

 

[ivauir]

... If you want to retire at 60 do it.... .

The 5 year delay in my upgrade means I can no longer save enough to retire at 60. Thanks Baby Boomers - you screwed us AGAIN.

 

[Wino]

I guess we should make TBO's (Time between Overhauls) illegal too.

After all, there is nothing wrong with the engine, its still running, and it probably will for a while longer, its just that the risks start to go up.

And the same thing happens to the human body. As Pilots we should be thinking SAFETY. Medical risks increase with age, and reflexes slow with age. No amount of new age thinking or singing Koom-bye-ya will change that fact.

But don't let greed get in your way. The same greed that is wrecking the economy now (carried out by the the same age group) just threw safety to the wind, and wrecked our careers and our economy.

We have come a LONG LONG LONG way from the greatest generation that fought WWII and gave us a good career. The group that lost vietnam and gave us the 70s and 80s should never have been let out of the play pen.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[fullsail]

Just flew with an over 60 guy who was very realistic for a change. He even apologized and suggested my impending furlough was NOT being helped by him. Paid for dinner and drinks on the road and explained his financial situation was the ONLY reason he is still on the property. Never once did he B.S. me with the "I just love flying so much I can't stop..." or the "oh, in twenty years you're going to hit the jackpot at the top of the payscale..." argument. I actually thought he was pretty classy about it.