Add 'pilot' to list of jobs that aren't so great now

[414Flyer]

http://www.usatoday.com/travel/flights/2010-02-18-pilots18_CV_N.htm

Kit Darby - STFU!

"Think of it as an apprenticeship to live through and get to the next level,"

 

[General Lee]

I like Kit Darby's line "Depending on Seniority, you can go to Lubbock or London." Well, I'll take London.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Quack]

Darby can kiss my white a$$!

 

[CapnVegetto]

LOL i know the guy in the article!! He's a damn good friend of mine! Known him since our regional days. I bet the little Italian bastard is getting all kinds of poon showin himself off in the newspaper!

I just called him and gave him crap LOL!!

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Add 'pilot' to list of jobs that aren't so great now

Added it years ago.

 

[General Lee]

LOL i know the guy in the article!! He's a damn good friend of mine! Known him since our regional days. I bet the little Italian bastard is getting all kinds of poon showin himself off in the newspaper!

I just called him and gave him crap LOL!!

Tell him thanks for giving management another insight on how he might do this job for FREE, since he can watch the sunset and do a "coupled" approach holding his Captain's hand.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Rickindfw]

As soon as I read the article, I knew the general would have a comment.
By the way, I'm enjoying my MAF overnight. I don't care where they send me. Just show me the money. 

 

[DH106]

"Think of [the regional airlines] as an apprenticeship to live through and get to the next level," says [Kit] Darby.

Kit, here's what I think of your willingness to downgrade flying at a regional as an "apprenticeship."

To be clear, let's define "apprenticeship": the state in which a person is gaining instruction in a trade or art, under legal agreement.

Last I checked, that Beech 1900 crew flying in the Great Lakes ice and thunderstorms wasn't receiving any such "instruction." I believe they're the real thing, doing the real thing, but for unrealistically-low wages. Let's be clear.

The best thing Kit Darby could do is avoid the media. He's a contributing factor to the downgrade of our profession.

 

[crxpilot]

Isnt that guy on the list?

 

[Mikes Apartment]

"Think of [the regional airlines] as an apprenticeship to live through and get to the next level," says [Kit] Darby.

Kit, here's what I think of your willingness to downgrade flying at a regional as an "apprenticeship."

To be clear, let's define "apprenticeship": the state in which a person is gaining instruction in a trade or art, under legal agreement.

Last I checked, that Beech 1900 crew flying in the Great Lakes ice and thunderstorms wasn't receiving any such "instruction." I believe they're the real thing, doing the real thing, but for unrealistically-low wages. Let's be clear.

The best thing Kit Darby could do is avoid the media. He's a contributing factor to the downgrade of our profession.

Can I get a F&%kin AMEN!!!!

 

[DrunkIrishman]

Isnt that guy on the list?

You read my mind.

 

[StaySeated]

Pathetic.

Sunrises? Magical takeoffs?

When are we going to get a clue? How can we expect management to respect us when we don't even have respect for ourselves and this profession.

Every interview of a professional pilot should be filled with outrage. 30-40% paycuts! Pensions terminated! Downgrades and age 65. Thousands on the street, with the number increasing.

All of this and we still have the likes of Scarcella waxing poetic about the pretty clouds.

Ugh.

 

[General Lee]

As soon as I read the article, I knew the general would have a comment.
By the way, I'm enjoying my MAF overnight. I don't care where they send me. Just show me the money. 

That is the KEY, to get into your head. Everytime you corndogs go to MAF, LBB, AMA, or ELP, you will think of me, flying to Europe or Rio. And, your pay is higher now, but eventually it will even out again (hey, we were higher than you for decades), and you will still be left with LBB and MAF. So, enjoy that MAF layover, and don't order the quesadilla at the hotel bar......oh wait, that was LBB.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[CapnVegetto]

I swear I hate a$$holes like some of you people. I have known him for over 7 years and he is a good dude. Then all of a sudden 3 or 4 little internet tough guy $hits get on here and badmouth someone they've never even met just because he happens to work for JetBlue and likes his job. I guess we should all be miserable $hits like you and constantly bitch and moan about our jobs in order to get your approval.

Fu-ck off.

I've got better things to do with my time then bitch and whine 24/7.

 

[General Lee]

I swear I hate a$$holes like some of you people. I have known him for over 7 years and he is a good dude. Then all of a sudden 3 or 4 little internet tough guy $hits get on here and badmouth someone they've never even met just because he happens to work for JetBlue and likes his job. I guess we should all be miserable $hits like you and constantly bitch and moan about our jobs in order to get your approval.

Fu-ck off.

I've got better things to do with my time then bitch and whine 24/7.

I am sure he is a good guy, but he made a mistake. He really painted a glorius picture for EVERY airline management out there. That's not good. Sully Sullenberger testified to Congress that things were getting WORSE in this industry. Pay is down, pensions are gone, and this guy loves pretty sunsets. Sure, he is a great guy, but he didn't handle this one well.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[CapnVegetto]

Well, the only real problem I have with some of you people is the fact that if any pilot anywhere ever utters the words "I like my job," then they are absolutely CRUCIFIED on here. That is exactly where the 'f*ck off' comes in from me. Badmouthing a good friend of mine in that regard, were it done in person, would probably earn you an a$$ kicking. Of course, its much easier to do over the internet, where people can hide from the consequences behind a screen name.

Guess what? I like my job. Well, I liked my job. I'm laid off as well, due to a piece of crap economy damn near putting the company I worked for out of business. 3rd airplane parked or sold this year, I was the 5th layoff.

Colgan, the crappiest of the crappy is hiring, and I'd bet my left nut they have a stack of resumes to the ceiling. Guess what? That's called supply and demand. There's 20 gazillion damn pilots out there looking for a job right now. I know, because for every little thing that has popped up I'm having to fight against 5000 other people applying for 1 damn position. Hell, I'd go to Colgan if it were a financially viable option. But for me, it's not. I have mortgage insurance on my house and collect unemployment. I can pay my bills and feed my family for now. I'm OK. I pick up contract work when I can and spend as much time with my little girl as possible. But I'm damn sure not going to come on here and badmouth anybody for going to work at Colgan, or Mesa, or whatever. I don't know them. I don't know their situation. But I do know one thing: some money is better than no money.

Preach all you want about pilots not doing the job for free. Guess what? I've been hearing the same $hit for 15 years. Well kiss my a$$. If someone asks me if I like my job, I'm going to tell them hell yeah. I get to fly rich a$$holes to tropical destinations, and get to sit on a damn beach and get drunk off gay little umbrella drinks that I don't have to pay for. I get to fly some moron in a suit to some business meeting in some city, and while he's sitting in a damn board room, I'm either drinking, playing golf, or some combination of the two. I can think of a hell of a lot worse way to make a living. I LIKE MY JOB. Would I do it for free or cheap? Hell no. I have more important things to worry about.....like food, mortgage, family, etc. The second that flying becomes a problem, it's gone. But I'm never going to badmouth someone that says they love what they do for a living. Hell, I envy them.

I've met God knows how many pilots since I've been doing this, and I have never met a group of more whiny, bitchy, pi$$y, moany little tit-ty babies in my entire f*cking life. It almost makes me a shame to say it. When I hear someone bitching and whining about making $200,000 a year while working 10 days a month I want to punch them in the f*cking mouth. I've got news for you: If you can't live a damn good life on $200,000 a year, head to the nearest pawn shop, buy yourself a gun, and just f*cking shoot yourself because you are a blight on humanity and need to die. I grew up in a family making an average of about 35% of that and couldn't have been happier. Of course, my parents weren't complete f*cking morons that didn't know how to live within their means. I always had a roof over my head, food on the table, and clothes on my back. I didn't have a vacation home in St. Maartin, or a yacht, or some of the other stupid crap toys that most pilots blow their money on, but frankly, I didn't really care. I don't care now. Sure, it'd be nice, but I'm not losing sleep over it. And I'm certainly not going to spend every dime I have and overexert myself in the blind hope that NOTHING will ever go wrong at my job, I'll never take a paycut, never lose my job, and will always be making as much as or more than I make now. If anyone ever lives like that, they are f*cking stupid. Times go through good spells and bad spells. The reason I'm OK now is because I'm not a moron and know how to financially plan. I don't have a job, but right now it's great because I don't have to go to work. I know I'm good for at least a year. If, in about 7 or 8 months, I still don't have a job (God I hope not), then I'll reassess the situation and form a new plan, maybe even get out of flying for good. But I didn't buy a boat, 2nd house, Porchse, and end up going ape$hit when the economy went bad and problems occurred.

Times WILL get better. Salaries WILL go back up. Jobs WILL reappear. It's GOING to happen. Just a matter of time. Economics have been cyclical for the last 2000 years back when a bad economy meant the cows weren't screwing enough and the corn wasn't growing enough, to the complex economies of today. But nothing has really changes. Bad times, good times, bad times, good times. The trick, like 99% of most of life, is to find the right thing to do in the middle. When the good times are here, make sure you stock up enough corn and cows for the bad times. Because they WILL come.

Anyway, I digress. Don't talk $hit about my friend.

 

[ableone]

Times WILL get better. Salaries WILL go back up. Jobs WILL reappear. It's GOING to happen. Just a matter of time.

Anyway, I digress. Don't talk $hit about my friend.

The General is absolutely correct.

Salaries are definitely not going to go back up on their own. The law of supply and demand that you so giddily cite dictates that salaries will go down. There are more pilots willing to do the same job for less. If you think the free market is the mechanism that will drive salaries up you are very confused, you're probably a member of CRAP. (Confused Republican Airline Pilots)

The only thing that will cause wages ( The only salaried pilots I know are corporate pilots ) to rise is union pressure and bargaining. If the free market is fully unleashed on pilot wages the top earner will be below six figures.

The General was correct about your friend. He did the profession a disservice with his happy talk.

 

[QCappy]

CapnVegetto,

Tell us how you really feel!:laugh:

 

[ableone]

Well kiss my a$$. If someone asks me if I like my job, I'm going to tell them hell yeah. I get to fly rich a$$holes to tropical destinations, and get to sit on a damn beach and get drunk off gay little umbrella drinks that I don't have to pay for. I get to fly some moron in a suit to some business meeting in some city, and while he's sitting in a damn board room, I'm either drinking, playing golf, or some combination of the two. I can think of a hell of a lot worse way to make a living. I LIKE MY JOB. Would I do it for free or cheap? Hell no.

With these negotiating skills you are NEVER going to be well compensated.

I've met God knows how many pilots since I've been doing this, and I have never met a group of more whiny, bitchy, pi$$y, moany little tit-ty babies in my entire f*cking life. It almost makes me a shame to say it. When I hear someone bitching and whining about making $200,000 a year while working 10 days a month I want to punch them in the f*cking mouth.

Clearly you are part of the problem as you don't value your skills. You have just told the world that you are not worth $200,000. Guess what? The world is going to oblige you and never offer you anywhere near that much money.

Considering that, according to you, consuming umbrella drinks and playing golf are the most challenging aspects to your employment I too would have endeavored to cut your salary or eliminate your employment.

I've got news for you: If you can't live a damn good life on $200,000 a year, head to the nearest pawn shop, buy yourself a gun, and just f*cking shoot yourself because you are a blight on humanity and need to die.

Aside from your anger issues I must point out that the pilot who earns $200,000 is not only rare but he or she may have only started to earn that figure late in their career progression. Unlike public employees who enjoy a gold plated pension and health plan the man in his late fifties who just got to $200,000 is self funding his retirement income and healthcare. FYI the Wall Street Journal recommends that those who retire with a decent healthcare plan should have $2 Million set aside to cover gaps in their health care. Since you apparently think that $200,000/year is an outrageous salary I must point out that unless you start earning this amount around your 30th year it's going to be hard to finance your own retirement.

I grew up in a family making an average of about 35% of that and couldn't have been happier. Of course, my parents weren't complete f*cking morons that didn't know how to live within their means. I always had a roof over my head, food on the table, and clothes on my back. I didn't have a vacation home in St. Maartin, or a yacht, or some of the other stupid crap toys that most pilots blow their money on, but frankly, I didn't really care. I don't care now. Sure, it'd be nice, but I'm not losing sleep over it. And I'm certainly not going to spend every dime I have and overexert myself in the blind hope that NOTHING will ever go wrong at my job, I'll never take a paycut, never lose my job, and will always be making as much as or more than I make now. If anyone ever lives like that, they are f*cking stupid. Times go through good spells and bad spells. The reason I'm OK now is because I'm not a moron and know how to financially plan. I don't have a job, but right now it's great because I don't have to go to work. I know I'm good for at least a year. If, in about 7 or 8 months, I still don't have a job (God I hope not), then I'll reassess the situation and form a new plan, maybe even get out of flying for good. But I didn't buy a boat, 2nd house, Porchse, and end up going ape$hit when the economy went bad and problems occurred.

You just might be a tool.

Anyway, I digress. Don't talk $hit about my friend.

No-one was talking $hit about your friend. They just happened to mention that his statements were at best unsophisticated and not well thought out.

I find this criticism to be accurate.

 

[HAL]

Yes, I'll get flamed. But what I've seen on this board for years has been way too black-and-white.

I love my job too. That doesn't mean I'll 'give in' to management just to keep it. I'll negotiate as hard as possible to gain ground in my contract, because I have spent too many years and too many dollars to earn the position I now have. I think that is the only smart way to go. Yet here's where so many others seem to have a disconnect: Why is it required to either be mad at management, or love the job, but not both?

The reality of today's economic world is that everyone has taken a hit over the past few years compared to where pay rates were a decade ago. But the economy as a whole is hurting too. Were $300/hour pay rates in 1999 realistic? Given the fares passengers pay today, probably not. We fight in the real world, not in the 'perfect world'. Yes, we need to improve conditions for all pilots, especially those at the regionals. We use all the resources available to us to negotiate, because that is the only way to make improvements. Sometimes we gain, sometimes we hold still, sometimes we lose ground. That article in the original post has pilots complaining about the hours, pay, and the difficulties of the job. Yet it has always been that way, and always will. It's a tough job, and you sure as heck should have known that going in. But the anger vented against pilots who say they love the job baffles me. If you don't love flying, why did you get into the job in the first place? The history of aviation is packed full of highs and lows. If you didn't study that history before you chose this career, shame on you. And if you've been in the industry for less than a decade, you haven't had a chance to experience the full cycle of ups and down - just the downs for now. But as CapnVegetto said, it will get better eventually. It's up to us to negotiate as strongly as possible, and hang on to whatever gains we can get. If you end up with a career of 20 or 30 years, probably half will be good, half will be bad. But if you enjoy the job itself, that is what makes it worth having.

So again I ask, why is it impossible to carry on the good fight to improve our job, yet still love it at the same time? Why is admitting that a sign of weakness instead of an acknowledgement of reality?

HAL