AA to furlough 178 more

[shroomwell]

160K a year at Eagle?

 

[pipejockey]

Ace , for 2 reasons.......

1. Its better for AMR to have the 2 groups fighting against each other than being united.........which , BTW , is going quite successful....

2. AE pilots would never accept a complete staple to the bottom. There
would have to be some type of integration, such as the top half for it to be agreed upon.

I believe in 2002 APA and ALPA were in discussions to merge the lists back then.....but ALPA would not accept a full staple to the bottom, while allowing new hire pilots STRAIGHT into mainline.

So, there ya have it.

You apparently haven't spoken to any Eagle pilots as I have. the vast majority would take a staple! Obviously every FO would take a staple as that is a no brainer. The Eagle CA's with AA numbers, especially the 244 affected by Nics ruling would require placement somewhat higher on the list than a staple would provide. And as far as the Eagle CA's that chose Eagle Rights, meaning they did not take an AA number upon upgrading to the jet prior to AA furloughing in 2001 could just be seat locked in anything with 70 seats or less for the remainder of their careers at the new Eagle/AA. After all, by choosing Eagle Rights, they had no reasonable expectation of going to AA anyway. They should have nothing to say about it.

The only other thing would be to protect the current Eagle FO's from being furlough fodder by seat locking them where they are until all AA furloughs are back and AA begins hiring again, of course they would have to hire to the ATR or RJ. That is probably the sticking point with the AA guys. How horrible it would be to actually require an AA new hire to have to start out on the RJ.

 

[EdAtTheAirport]

Hope & Change!

 

[Flyby1206]

You apparently haven't spoken to any Eagle pilots as I have. the vast majority would take a staple! Obviously every FO would take a staple as that is a no brainer. The Eagle CA's with AA numbers, especially the 244 affected by Nics ruling would require placement somewhat higher on the list than a staple would provide. And as far as the Eagle CA's that chose Eagle Rights, meaning they did not take an AA number upon upgrading to the jet prior to AA furloughing in 2001 could just be seat locked in anything with 70 seats or less for the remainder of their careers at the new Eagle/AA. After all, by choosing Eagle Rights, they had no reasonable expectation of going to AA anyway. They should have nothing to say about it.

The only other thing would be to protect the current Eagle FO's from being furlough fodder by seat locking them where they are until all AA furloughs are back and AA begins hiring again, of course they would have to hire to the ATR or RJ. That is probably the sticking point with the AA guys. How horrible it would be to actually require an AA new hire to have to start out on the RJ.

Or God forbid, the ATR!

Would AE pilots be subject to losing their CA seats from future AA furloughs? That would be a non-starter for the mid/junior AE CAs and senior AE FOs. The majority of FOs would be in favor of a staple (since we were hired after AA stopped hiring). I would bet the Eagle rights CAs wouldnt mind being stapled as long as they wont lose their seats. Senior AE CAs have AA #s, so they already have a spot on the AA list.

160K a year at Eagle?

That does seem a bit lofty... definitely from my $40k/yr seat

 

[lionflyer]

Or God forbid, the ATR!

In San Juan!

 

[jetjam619]

You apparently haven't spoken to any Eagle pilots as I have. the vast majority would take a staple! Obviously every FO would take a staple as that is a no brainer. The Eagle CA's with AA numbers, especially the 244 affected by Nics ruling would require placement somewhat higher on the list than a staple would provide. And as far as the Eagle CA's that chose Eagle Rights, meaning they did not take an AA number upon upgrading to the jet prior to AA furloughing in 2001 could just be seat locked in anything with 70 seats or less for the remainder of their careers at the new Eagle/AA. After all, by choosing Eagle Rights, they had no reasonable expectation of going to AA anyway. They should have nothing to say about it.

The only other thing would be to protect the current Eagle FO's from being furlough fodder by seat locking them where they are until all AA furloughs are back and AA begins hiring again, of course they would have to hire to the ATR or RJ. That is probably the sticking point with the AA guys. How horrible it would be to actually require an AA new hire to have to start out on the RJ.

Haven't spoken to AE pilots? I AM an an AE captain.

Your comment about how "HORRIBLE" it would be to have an AA new hire in an RJ.....Why not????? Back in 2002, APA and ALPA were trying to merge the lists, APA wanted newbies straight into mainline. Meaning newbies would bypass all AA(AE) pilots already on the list.
So, I ask you....do you think it would be fair for a newbie to go to mainline instead of starting at the bottom ,just like everyone else????

 

[Whine Lover]

" I know a lot of guys at Eagle that are happy making 160K a year '

I think you meant 60k a year?

Even if you were an 18year maxed out Captain at $103.00 / hr you aren't coming anywhere close to that.

 

[AceOnTheRiver]

" I know a lot of guys at Eagle that are happy making 160K a year '

I think you meant 60k a year?

Even if you were an 18year maxed out Captain at $103.00 / hr you aren't coming anywhere close to that.

Why do you think AE wants the senior FT's to go to AA? AE is not like AA. The monthly max is 100 hours flight hours. But from what I understand you can easily get paid over 120 hours a month.
I saw the guys paysub. This is an estimate of how it would look from what I saw.
103 X 80 = $8240 line pay
103 X 10 = $1030 transition pay
25 X 123 = $3075 OT pay
300 hours of PD at $525

This guy was just a regular line holder. If he was an IOE guy then he would be bringing in another 1-2K a month. The most he got paid in a month last year was 160 hours.

 

[jetjam619]

160K a year at Eagle?

Ace is CORRECT on his calculations. Im a 12yr capatin at 105k with minimal OT with a wife that is working, so I dont have to be there as much. In fact, I'm sitting at home ,on reserve ,not flying at all and only coming in for OT.

 

[shroomwell]

And he has absolutely no life.

 

[AceOnTheRiver]

And he has absolutely no life.

That's not me. He said he average's around 14 days off a month.

 

[pipejockey]

Haven't spoken to AE pilots? I AM an an AE captain.

Your comment about how "HORRIBLE" it would be to have an AA new hire in an RJ.....Why not????? Back in 2002, APA and ALPA were trying to merge the lists, APA wanted newbies straight into mainline. Meaning newbies would bypass all AA(AE) pilots already on the list.
So, I ask you....do you think it would be fair for a newbie to go to mainline instead of starting at the bottom ,just like everyone else????

Well if you are an AE pilot then you should know the majority would accept a staple! You are probably one of the many 20+ year pilots AE has that thinks that they are entitled to a DOH merge on APA's list. Why these folks think that, is beyond me, especially since they had ample opportunity to move on to a major in the late 90's but instead chose to stay at Eagle.

And it appears you don't understand my sense of humor, perhaps I should have used a smiley face. I totally agree that any new hire at a merged AA/AE should have to fly the equipment that their new-hire seniority can hold which would be the RJ. As far as the ATR....no one should have to endure that insult!!!

You said in 2002 APA wanted new hires at a merged AA/AE to be put straight at mainline? Then who would go to the RJ's and that ATR thing? Obviously currently furloughed AA pilots should be entitled to be recalled to nothing less than the MD80, but after there are no more furloughs, I feel it is quite reasonable to make all new hires go to the rj. I would even find it reasonable to negotiate something wherein a new hire from the military could go directly to what would be considered mainline equipment, but then only be able to move to larger equipment based on seniority number. Sometimes you have to eat some crow for the betterment of the majority.

 

[jetjam619]

Well if you are an AE pilot then you should know the majority would accept a staple! You are probably one of the many 20+ year pilots AE has that thinks that they are entitled to a DOH merge on APA's list. Why these folks think that, is beyond me, especially since they had ample opportunity to move on to a major in the late 90's but instead chose to stay at Eagle.

And it appears you don't understand my sense of humor, perhaps I should have used a smiley face. I totally agree that any new hire at a merged AA/AE should have to fly the equipment that their new-hire seniority can hold which would be the RJ. As far as the ATR....no one should have to endure that insult!!!

You said in 2002 APA wanted new hires at a merged AA/AE to be put straight at mainline? Then who would go to the RJ's and that ATR thing? Obviously currently furloughed AA pilots should be entitled to be recalled to nothing less than the MD80, but after there are no more furloughs, I feel it is quite reasonable to make all new hires go to the rj. I would even find it reasonable to negotiate something wherein a new hire from the military could go directly to what would be considered mainline equipment, but then only be able to move to larger equipment based on seniority number. Sometimes you have to eat some crow for the betterment of the majority.

PJ, I am a 12y captain.........and regarding the what I said about 2002 AA hiring into mainline instead of bottom, I forgot to mention that APA wanted a loop hole where MILITARY BUDDIES would go to mainline , bypassing the Rj route. Newbies to rj's....also senior AE captains would NEVER or expect DOH at AA, rather some type of integration.

 

[AceOnTheRiver]

The rumor I heard recently was to create a master list by putting AE on the bottom of AA and then AA on the bottom of AE. That way everybody is protected when flying on the other side of the house.

 

[rider850]

Aa

Your point?