Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

*************************

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web
SkywayFO said:
I say take the interview for practice purposes. Then when they offer you the job tell them to go to hell. Use the practice interview to help you get a better job. Especially if it is your first time around.

I agree with SkywayFO. Go for the interview but please, please, please do not ruin your career (I am serious when I say that) by accepting a job with Hojet. You can fly a CR7 somewhere else and still have a career in the future. Don't make a huge mistake you will most certainly REGRET...
 
purdue_pilot said:
Well, that didn't take too much convincing...I just got done talking to a sim instructor friend of mine and he summed it all up by saying this "Its all about integrity..." Even though GJ looks on paper that it is a great gig...I can't see myself there....guess i'll be sticking it out as a flight instructor a bit longer :(

Wise choice man, you're doing the right thing even though you know you want outta that piper ASAP. It'll happen man, don't get down and send your stuff out to ASA and XJT. I start training in Dec. down there in IAH and I absolutely loved it. Just stick it out a bit longer man, it'll happen and when it does you can go to a much better place than you know where.
 
J32driver said:
Ever want to ride a jumpseat on an ALPA carrier? I'd look elsewhere for employment.

I'm not condoning alter-ego outfits,

but give me a break.

Trust me when I say that most mainline guys don't have the faintest clue who GJ's is.

Didn't that become perfectly clear with the recent US Airways MEC code-a-phone?

h25b is right, that so called list is a farce. It is meaningless.
 
h25b

Why do you feel the need for ad hominum attacks? You spend your entire post blasting me and only a few lines expanding upon my argument. Conveniently enough, you got so wrapped up in beating up on me you didn't even address the threat Go Jet poses to Trans States pilots.

I've never claimed to know everything, or to be some mighty Beechjet pilot, or anything like the BS you just spewed. I've got lots of friends at TSA that are affected by Go Jet. I declined a job offer at TSA for that among other reasons. He asked for advice and I gave him mine, and its worth what he paid for it - NOTHING. I'm the first to admit I know less than many, but I probably know more than you'd ever give me credit for. You don't know anything about my industry experience, where I've been or what I've done other than what I have in my profile or said on this board. You've got more experience than me because you've been around longer than me, and that's great! You've been a wonderful contributor to this board, with both 91 and 121 experience, but you've admittedly been out of the 121 world for a while yet you post like you have authority on this issue. You never challenged my assertion on another thread that corporate pilots wail when they get lowballed but then they turn around and tell airline pilots to suck it up when the same thing happens to them. Why is that?

Bernie was my ME instructor, he's given many of my students checkrides, and he's helped me get interviews for both internships and jobs by giving stellar recommendations. I've got nothing against Bernie, in fact I like him quite a bit and talked to him on the phone last week. BW's job to get students and grads opportunities within aviation (he started the program with TSA last year), and thats exactly what Go Jet is - an opportunity. He's told me personally (along with many of the other alums that have complained) that its not his responsibility to make the final decision about accepting employment, its that of the applicant. That is very true! However, its my job to help educate my friends and fellow alums about the hard truth of the industry, which the professors generally don't explore and is difficult to learn in the academic environment.

So yeah, I'll admit, I have less real-world industry experience than you. I'll even acquiesce to your superior intellect, experience and knowlege. But it doesn't take real-world industry experience to have some integrity and a sense of right and wrong, now does it?
 
BoilerUP said:
Bernie was my ME instructor,

Mine too..

BoilerUP said:
However, its my job to help educate my friends and fellow alums about the hard truth of the industry, which the professors generally don't explore and is difficult to learn in the academic environment.

Let me tell you about the cold, hard truth of the industry because, I assure you, you don't have a clue... Pilots will eat each other AND their young if it means either of these things: more airplanes, quicker upgrade, or more money... The TSA pilots are in the same mess that we were in at CHQ. It's clear that their current CBA doesn't prohibit GJ operations so their only choice is to scope them out in their next contract.

BoilerUP said:
But it doesn't take real-world industry experience to have some integrity and a sense of right and wrong, now does it?

Once you get out in to the real world you'll soon adjust your opinion about what is right and wrong. Especially when you have a wife and kids to take care of. I don't condone crossing any picket lines, but that isn't what is going on here... Not even close. Please don't assert that I have a double standard when chiming in on corporate and airline pilot career development. These are two completely different animals and a pilot treading down either road should have completely different expectations. A pilot looking to start at a Fortune 500 Hawker for example should expect about 50-60K while if you choose to be an airline pilot you should expect to be paid about 20-25 bucks/hr. to start in the right seat of an RJ. The devil in the details is that the prospective corporate pilot paid his dues elsewhere before even being considered, while the "regionals" are bringing in you guys with little more than a Commercial ticket with instrument and multi-engine ratings. There's no double standard there, that's just reality.

This fact remains that the arguement that you love to make that going to work at GJ is some career ending/ruining act is disingenuous at best. You admittedly have no experience that would tell you this... I challenge you to find anywhere that I claim that GJ and its kind are good for the industry. Yep, you're right, GJ is a threat to the TSA chances of a somewhat better contract. But ignoring the fact that it's a LEGAL manuever on the part of Trans States' management won't win any points. Running around in circles whining about it doesn't cut it either. If this is the worst thing you see happen in this business you've had a great career, believe me... I've seen a person lose their job for things completely out of their control and commit suicide as a result. So excuse me if I could give a squat about whether a guy wants to work at GJ...:rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
Redmeat said:
Didn't that become perfectly clear with the recent US Airways MEC code-a-phone?

That code-a-phone may have been a good thing for ALPA. The MEC that put that out looks squarely like an idiot now. Maybe these clowns will try and educate themselves on the industry around them now.
 
h25b said:
So excuse me if I could give a squat about whether a guy wants to work at GJ...:rolleyes:

I wouldn't expect you to...its not your sandbox.

As a Fortune 500 Hawker pilot, you expect $50-60K. You've paid your dues flying Barons at night, KAs and Lears and Citations on call 135, and finally moved up to that dream job (or at least a few rungs up). You know your worth is $50-60K, and you aren't willing to fly for less. Now lets say somebody you know flew a clapped out 501 for a cruddy owner-operator and essentialy had the same qualifications as you, but was making $38K with no benefits. If he accepted $40K plus good benefits at the same Fortune 500 job as you, doesn't that affect everybody's negotiating power when it comes time for a raise? Anybody who would do that is a fool, but we both know there are people out there that intentionally low-ball their pay to get experience or time, and it happens at every level, 91, 121 and 135.

Go Jet really isn't different than that. As a 5th year 50 seat captain, one expects their worth to be, say 65K when they make 58, but thats the CBA so thats what they get. To fly a 70 seat jet, that same captain will accept nothing less than what he or she feels their worth is, in this case 65K minimum. Somebody else (a FO making 32K who feels their upgrade is past due) is will take that 70 seat job for 59K.

Go Jet is being grown through a loophole in the TSA CBA. Yes, it is techinally legal but its not ethical, and yes I know that the world is ruthless and people look out for themselves and all that other stuff my father told me when I left for college. TSA could have scoped Go Jet flying, but turned it down recently by declining an industry-worst contract extenstion. Those planes weren't worth that contract. Some may say TSA pilots made their decision then, but I say they simply knew their worth, and weren't willing to accept anything less. The Single Carrier Petition will decide this finally and for all soon.

Will GJ ruin somebody's career? Nah, probably not. Never stopped the Freedom A people, now did it? But unless a group takes a hard stand and fights a hard fight, the regional industry will continue to become an even worse joke than it currently is. TSA is in that hard fight right now, and for the sake of my career, my school's alumni, and everybody else, I certainly hope they win.
 
h25b is a waste of air. If your not in the industry (121) then you have no room to talk about us at TSA. Sorry you think you have real world experience and you THINK you are qualified to discuss this issue, but bottom line is your not. Go hangout on the corporate forum and talk about FBO's or something you might know about. Sorry for the bashing, but I am tired of you bashing my fellow AIRLINE pilots. And yes the list going around does work, road to hotels with several crews who have the list and bragged about denying GJ jumpseaters. All different airlines, trust me it works...
 
BoilerUP said:
As a Fortune 500 Hawker pilot, you expect $50-60K. You've paid your dues flying Barons at night, KAs and Lears and Citations on call 135, and finally moved up to that dream job (or at least a few rungs up). You know your worth is $50-60K, and you aren't willing to fly for less.
If he's a Fortune 500 Hawker Captain, I certainly hope that he knows he's worth a hell of a lot more than 50-60k. If thats all a job like that is paying now a days, I'm glad I got the hell out of corporate. :)
 
purdue_pilot said:
Well, that didn't take too much convincing...I just got done talking to a sim instructor friend of mine and he summed it all up by saying this "Its all about integrity..." Even though GJ looks on paper that it is a great gig...I can't see myself there....guess i'll be sticking it out as a flight instructor a bit longer :(

You have a wise sim instructor. While it's easy for many of us to say to wait, I know that's about one of the hardest things to ask someone making minimum wage as a flight instructor. But while some people go way overboard on this *************************s thing, make no mistake about it... it's a bad scene. You're a better person for avoiding a lousy operator, whether it's part 121 or 135.
 

Latest resources

Back
Top