2300 signatures and counting!

[Crzipilot]

I don't know, I read alot about no sympathy for the East guys making 200/hr at one time, while the west was no where near there. Is this jealousy of the fact that the west side for years has toiled at bottom wage levels (only recently being higher than other places since the concessionairy contracts..) Now the west has a chance to climb higher (if they could get a combined contract) and they are being blocked by such as the results of the merger award. If your so positive that the award was fair, and done correctly, why hasn't alpa signed off on it and forwarded it to management???? Why should ALPA care if US decertifies ALPA??? If the award still stands etc. then it shouldn't matter what the east guys do. As they feel they have been wronged, or something is right with the award, they are exploring all avenues available to them.
Someone mentioned the company being hurt now operationally, because they can't combine the carriers. What happened to chug a lug's comments that he could run the operations seperate forever??? The hemingway letter, stating theycould force the east contract on the west??? Why is the company so rushed to combine the operations now? I remember dougie, saying the synergies of doing such, really wouldn't amount to much of anything.

Either way, I hear enough of your comments that the award doesn't go away with alpa off property. If that's the case, then let the game play out. You'll be able to cash in your lottery ticket and reap the rewards.....eventually......or are you afraid that the ticket will be found to be a fraud?

 

[PCL_128]

PCL: Your career has been nothing but paying for your job and a wild ride up the ladder.....

Ah, playing the PFT card as usual. No logical arguments or facts? Just throw out the PFT card.

to say the USAir East guys are morons when you have had to endure nothing that they have had to removes all doubt who the moron is.

What you've had to "endure" has nothing to do with anything. What matters is the rule of law. The law will not allow you to void the seniority arbitration award, no matter how much you've had to "endure," and no matter whether you decertify or not. This is an exercise in futility that will only harm your own pilot group and the entire profession in the end.

Further proof is the fact that you would follow ALPA into outer space without even a thought of the consequences.

I don't even know what this means.

 

[A350]

PCL: Does the truth sting a little? Was anything in my post about your career inaccurate?

Enduring hardships has everything to do with the topic at hand. The USAir pilots, under the rule of ALPA, have endured more BS than any pilot group in history. Was some of it self induced? You bet. Was some of it heaped upon them when they needed the help the most by a decrepit, out of touch, and outdated association that has failed to adapt to the changing needs of the very constituents it represents.......ABSOLUTELY.

So while you have your opinion, it is framed from your perspective.....which might differ from the average airline pilot who was hired when you were in grade school. That somehow you have thus far in your career stumbled into success, many others have not fared so well. Further, the fact that you landed with a company that has its own in house union, who has enjoyed success while ALPA carriers have floundered speaks volumes.

Since you are such an pro-ALPA zealot, I suspect that you will be supporting an ALPA card drive at AirTran.

Good luck with that!

BTW, the USAirways east pilots are not interested in decertifying ALPA to have the Nicolau award thrown out, although if it can be that would be great. They are interested in calling ALPA out so that they answer for the inadequacies of the very group that should have protected them. Further, time is on their side. If they can delay the implementation of the award for a few years, the attrition that should have been theirs will be theirs. The AWA pilots can enjoy their great contract and the East guys can go on with their lives as well. Decertifying ALPA will not destroy the profession.

A350

 

[PCL_128]

PCL: Does the truth sting a little? Was anything in my post about your career inaccurate?

Sting? Not at all. In case you haven't noticed, I never try to hide my career path. I just don't find it relevant to the conversation at hand. If you want to have a PFT discussion, then by all means, go start the 10,000th thread that deals with that dead horse topic.

Enduring hardships has everything to do with the topic at hand. The USAir pilots, under the rule of ALPA, have endured more BS than any pilot group in history. Was some of it self induced? You bet. Was some of it heaped upon them when they needed the help the most by a decrepit, out of touch, and outdated association that has failed to adapt to the changing needs of the very constituents it represents.......ABSOLUTELY.

You're blaming the Association for things that it had no control over. Your blame should be directed at the RLA, the bankruptcy laws, President Bush and his lapdog NMB, the various scumbag managers that USAir has had over the years, etc... ALPA is not responsible for the hardships of the AAA pilots. I know you guys would like to find an easy scapegoat to make yourselves feel better, but ALPA isn't the evil force that you pretend it to be.

Further, the fact that you landed with a company that has its own in house union, who has enjoyed success while ALPA carriers have floundered speaks volumes.

This airline has had success, but this union has not. If you want to see just how effective an in-house union is, then by all means, stop by the AirTran TA threads and see just how wonderful life without ALPA can be. Pay particular attention to all of the pilots calling for ALPA representation because our own union is so incompetent. Gee, don't you want to join the non-ALPA club? [/sarcasm]

Since you are such an pro-ALPA zealot, I suspect that you will be supporting an ALPA card drive at AirTran.

I'll support ALPA at AirTran if the majority of the pilots at this airline decide that that's what they want. I certainly hope that they come to that conclusion, since I definitely feel that having ALPA representation is in our best interests, but it's up to the majority. I hope the majority of the pilots at AAA and AWA make the right decision and stay with ALPA.

They are interested in calling ALPA out so that they answer for the inadequacies of the very group that should have protected them.

If you want to "call someone out," then I suggest you look at your own MEC. This issue never should have gone to arbitration in the first place, and after it did go to arbitration, it was horribly mismanaged. ALPA National does not get involved in the seniority integration debate at individual carriers. The C & BLs prohibits it. The direction that your MEC took was based entirely on their own strategy, not that of ALPA National. Place the blame where it belongs.

 

[Hpilot]

I don't get it. The arbitration will still stand. All the East will have done is nail their shoes to the train tracks. Apparently they can't see whats a comin'.

 

[sgmick]

You are sueing us and you want empathy???! Don't forget the fact that many east pilots have stated they will never vote in a joint contract; thus holding all our wages down at industry bottom levels. Lets not forget that the east MEC did not want to give west pilots access to your jumpseats.....and you want empathy....lol. Every step of the merger process was followed and agreed to by both parties. You guys epitomize poor sportsmanship.

The west voted NOT to let the east have pay parity during negotiations. Last I checked YOU are making more than the EAST guys.

Who is holding whom down? What goes around comes around my friend. Lifes a Bi*ch isnt it?

 

[Hpilot]

We voted that down after the East refused to play by the rules. Do you really think that being a weasel with no integrity will payoff in the end? Don't bet on it.

 

[PositiveRate]

Mick - you are a hypocrite.

You sue us, you attempt to throw out binding arbitration because you don't like the results, you violate the TA by pulling out of joint negotiations, you delay like children in an attempt to hoard any and all good from the merger as your and yours only, you threaten to throw out ALPA and start anew with a union whose stated goal is DOH seniority and nothing else......BUT, you want our support as you withdraw from negotiations and demand pay parity.

F%ck you buddy. Damn right we don't support your BS ploy for pay parity. You want a f&cking raise, then fight with us for a change. You guys are off your rockers and the hanging will commence shortly - you've finally let out enough rope.

 

[atrdriver]

I believe that the main reason that they are being call whiners is because they welcomed the arbitration, and then got pissed off when Nic ruled the way that he did. IOW, they said "we'll play by the rules", until they realized that they didn't like them.

 

[Lampshade]

The west voted NOT to let the east have pay parity during negotiations. Last I checked YOU are making more than the EAST guys.

Who is holding whom down? What goes around comes around my friend. Lifes a Bi*ch isnt it?

US East A330, 767, 757 Capts and FO's make more than AWA guys. AWA make more on the A320/737.