200 KIAS below class "B"

[LJ45]

If you are bored like I am right now...take a look at the class B chart and imagine taking off out of PDK and be vectored to the west as often happens. There is no way using a radial and DME that you can tell if you are in are out between the 60 and 80 foot levels.

As long as we don't get letters from the FAA I could care less, but if they try to bust people on this we need to get this fixed ASAP.

 

[ksu_aviator]

Why not just do the easy thing and fly at 200 KIAS until clear of all Class B?

If you start at the center, the time difference for 200 and 250 KIAS is a 1.5 minutes. PDX is probably 30 seconds, if that.

Why knowingly violate an FAR for a savings of 30 seconds? That's just lazy.

 

[LJ45]

Why not just do the easy thing and fly at 200 KIAS until clear of all Class B?

If you start at the center, the time difference for 200 and 250 KIAS is a 1.5 minutes. PDX is probably 30 seconds, if that.

Why knowingly violate an FAR for a savings of 30 seconds? That's just lazy.

Why don't you try that for a while and get back to us on how that worked out for you. Do it out of New York, Atlanta, and Los Angles...etc

In a high performance jet of course.

LOL

 

[ksu_aviator]

Been there, done that in a Lear 35, 45 and Citation I(ok not high performance by any standard). Never heard a peep.

Why not answer the question? Why would you knowingly violate and FAR for a minute time savings.

 

[LJ45]

Been there, done that in a Lear 35, 45 and Citation I(ok not high performance by any standard). Never heard a peep.

Why not answer the question? Why would you knowingly violate and FAR for a minute time savings.

Next time you don't see a speed limit sign on the interstate for a few miles, why don't you slow down to 45 mph?

The answer is a jet is made to go fast! ;-)

 

[skydan5]

Otherwise, they can expect me to ask: "Does this take me under Class B" at the busiest time of their day. I am more than willing to demonstrate to the feds that this is unworkable.

I've had NY Center/Approach tell me "you can go as fast as you want....I don't think anyone will say anything." Well, that's his opinion. It will be the next frequency's controller or the FAA guy drinking beer at home while surfing on FlightAware that will nail you.

 

[Mahi]

We only have Nos (or Naco? Government issue anyway) approach plates and IFR low/ high charts. No VFR charts or AFDs. How am I supposed to know when I'm under a shelf? Seriously, I could use some advise here.

 

[ksu_aviator]

We only have Nos (or Naco? Government issue anyway) approach plates and IFR low/ high charts. No VFR charts or AFDs. How am I supposed to know when I'm under a shelf? Seriously, I could use some advise here.

Terminal Area Charts.

 

[Mahi]

Terminal Area Charts.

I don't think you understand. We only carry IFR charts and plates.

If there are guys flying into ATL, TEB, LAX and others under IFR and getting violated for flying +200 under B... I'm concerned. I haven't heard of this till now. But if ATC is starting to enforce this BS, I think it may be time to invest in a handheld GPS.

 

[Frap]

I don't think you understand. We only carry IFR charts and plates.

Pretty sure that applies to most professional aviators.

I believe that KSU does indeed understand and offered some advice you said you needed.

Unless you wanna go the Jepp route, the terminal charts are most likely your best bet. If your company doesn't want to do that, then buy the ones you need for yourself and turn in an expense report. If they won't reimburse you, then it's time to find another gig.

 

[EdAtTheAirport]

No KSU does not understand!

How does one determine the border of Class B airspace when it's a road? IMC?

What about class B boundaries that are defined by distance from an airport, rather than a VOR?

What about lines that are undefined (the "connector" between EWR and LGA Class B's, the line southeast of CLT Class B)?

Further, how do you do this, and remain ready/tuned/identified for your approach?

Impress me with your wisdom guys.

 

[Mahi]

then it's time to find another gig.

Yeah, working on it.

But I got to agree with many others here that determining where that evasive little blue line is would contribute greatly to the workload. Near impossible in most situations. Flying bare bones and outdated avionics in an old Lear with a low time copilot only compounds the problem. It would be nice if they would just apply that rule to VFR aircraft only or delete it all together.

 

[EdAtTheAirport]

It would be nice if they would just apply that rule to VFR aircraft only or delete it all together.

I'm working on it, Mahi. Stay tuned.

 

[illinipilot]

We use Jepps so we do have a rough idea about what's going on. We just use the highest altittude in the area and keep slowed down when operating below that area. I've never had a controller complain when we have slowed to 200kts. I have had complaints when we haven't slowed. Specifically LAX, LGB, SNA area.

 

[THE Flying Ace]

We have flown into PWK and Chicago has told us on several occasions to pick the speed back up to 250kts when below Class B.

We have a Garmin 530 in our Citation which allows us to see the boundaries but I agree with most of the guys on here, there needs to be a change to this rule. As said before, how can a person determine where the boundary is at when it is a river or road and you are in the clouds.