1500 hr bill passes senate!!!

[surplus1]

Lot's of belittling went on during the course of my 6-7 hour long oral only to be failed at the end. Needless to say my confidence is very low right now.

If you had a 6+ hour oral for any rating in any type of equipment don't ever get near the jack*ss that did that ever again. That's an absurdity in the extreme, and I mean that!

No oral should be longer that a couple of hours and that's a lot. If he can't figure out what you know or don't know in that amount of time, then HE/SHE doesn't know what h/she's doing and is unfit to be an examiner. Seriously.

Check around and find a decent examiner. I understand your feelings but don't let that idiot intimidate you and cause you to lose confidence in yourself. If you know the material and get a fair examiner you'll get your rating.

Best wishes.

 

[erjip]

If you had a 6+ hour oral for any rating in any type of equipment don't ever get near the jack*ss that did that ever again. That's an absurdity in the extreme, and I mean that!

No oral should be longer that a couple of hours and that's a lot. If he can't figure out what you know or don't know in that amount of time, then HE/SHE doesn't know what h/she's doing and is unfit to be an examiner. Seriously.

Check around and find a decent examiner. I understand your feelings but don't let that idiot intimidate you and cause you to lose confidence in yourself. If you know the material and get a fair examiner you'll get your rating.

Best wishes.

When you do your CFI initial check ride, 98% of the rides are done by the FSDO and you don't get to pick and choose the examiner. And yes, the initial rides are pretty long anywhere from 4-8 hours.

 

[surplus1]

When you do your CFI initial check ride, 98% of the rides are done by the FSDO and you don't get to pick and choose the examiner. And yes, the initial rides are pretty long anywhere from 4-8 hours.

Little wonder its screwed up. FSDOs are full of people who couldn't get a real job. Bunch of feathermerchants.

I didn't mean to infer that you should just pick an examiner that you think will give you a free pass, but they do get reputations even when they work in the FAA and with some homework and the help of your instructor, you should get an idea of the reputations and maybe find out who you're scheduled with. If you draw a dud, cancel the ride.

If the whole deal, including the flying. takes 4-5 hours that's not bad but I still maintain that a 4-hour oral or a 6-hour oral is an absurdity. That just shouldn't happen.

It's been a long time since I've done any instruction at those levels but if I were doing that and an examiner, FSDO or otherwise, subjected one of my students to that length of oral you can bet he'd be hearing my opinion in no uncertain terms, especially if he worked for the FAA.

I'm not talking about hanging out with the examiner for 5 hours during which you get 1 hour of questions. I'm talking about a real oral. This stuff isn't rocket science. There's just not that much to ask that makes any sense and could take that amount of time.

 

[COOPERVANE]

My CFI was a FSDO guy..... 5-6 hour oral. To this day, I thought that was just standard. Looking back, it WAS ridiculous.

 

[surplus1]

My CFI was a FSDO guy..... 5-6 hour oral. To this day, I thought that was just standard. Looking back, it WAS ridiculous.

I'm curious so I have to ask. Did you really fly the L-1049H? It was a beautiful bird.

 

[COOPERVANE]

I'm curious so I have to ask. Did you really fly the L-1049H? It was a beautiful bird.

No, unfortunately I didn't. My favorite airliner though.

Those were the days when airplanes were made of metal and pilots were steely eyed professionals. Can you imagine one of them complaining about having to wear a hat? In the cockpit under a headset no less.

 

[surplus1]

No, unfortunately I didn't. My favorite airliner though.

Not my absolute favorite but certainly nice to look at. Engines were just too cantankerous. Spent a lot of time in both the "G" and the "H".

Those were the days when airplanes were made of metal and pilots were steely eyed professionals. Can you imagine one of them complaining about having to wear a hat? In the cockpit under a headset no less.

LOL, that's really funny. Don't know about the steely eyed part but yes, we were professionals.

No, I don't recall anybody complaining about wearing a hat. Tell you a secret though .... the only place I ever saw anyone wear his hat in the cockpit and/or under a headset was in one of those B movies from the fifties and sixties.

 

[Lynxman]

Little wonder its screwed up. FSDOs are full of people who couldn't get a real job. Bunch of feathermerchants.

I didn't mean to infer that you should just pick an examiner that you think will give you a free pass, but they do get reputations even when they work in the FAA and with some homework and the help of your instructor, you should get an idea of the reputations and maybe find out who you're scheduled with. If you draw a dud, cancel the ride.

If the whole deal, including the flying. takes 4-5 hours that's not bad but I still maintain that a 4-hour oral or a 6-hour oral is an absurdity. That just shouldn't happen.

It's been a long time since I've done any instruction at those levels but if I were doing that and an examiner, FSDO or otherwise, subjected one of my students to that length of oral you can bet he'd be hearing my opinion in no uncertain terms, especially if he worked for the FAA.

I'm not talking about hanging out with the examiner for 5 hours during which you get 1 hour of questions. I'm talking about a real oral. This stuff isn't rocket science. There's just not that much to ask that makes any sense and could take that amount of time.

I wish I knew what I knew now because I would have just asked to stop the ride. I'm fairly certain now I will never get hired with any airline because of this.

 

[n757st]

Bullsh!t, You can still get hired. Airlines are looking for trends, multiple checkride failures or a couple 121 busts. They want to make sure you are not a training liability in the long term. 1 bust will not affect your long term career. Now a failed CFI, and Instrument, and MEI or so and then they will start scratching their heads hard.

 

[buscap]

While I'm not a fan of the big schools, I will admit their CFI training programs are not subject to this kind of DE abuse. The schools wouldn't tolerate it and they better prepare their students for the rides.

This kind of thing has been going on in the mom & pop world since day one and was always viewed as paying dues or just a cost of doing business. Some of the FSDO guys are jerks, some of the DE guys are jerks or just out for the money.

But if one is going to get emotional about it and tank the career as a result, perhaps another career is in order. I've been flying professionally 22 years and have only busted two rides, (one for bad attitude and one because the guy giving me the ride busted the ride he was getting simultaneously) both in the military. The work ethic those busts instilled in me have allowed me to go 13 years in the civilian world with no busts...yet.

Checkrides and failed checkrides are a part of this profession. I know some 121 guys who get absolutely tore up about checkrides. Great pilots, but they throw a stroke at the thought of an oral.

This legislation may be a game changer in many ways. Anyone looking toward a flying career will have to be a lot more careful about where they get their training and who signed them off before a checkride. Better to spend more coin on training than build a record of busts.

 

[Lynxman]

Let me ask you this. Would you hire me if I had a good attitutde and explained 3 failures for the same ride? I'd have to seriously ask myself if I was in the other person's shoes would I seriously take the chance on this guy? When there is thousands of applicants with 0-1 failures. It suck's, but I think my app will automatically be overlooked by some computer sorting program.

 

[Lynxman]

This legislation may be a game changer in many ways. Anyone looking toward a flying career will have to be a lot more careful about where they get their training and who signed them off before a checkride. Better to spend more coin on training than build a record of busts.

Exactly couldn't have said it better myself. Which is where I'm standing right now. I'm sure I'm ready to go for another few ratings, but whats the rush I'll spend the time and drop the coin to make sure I'm beyond ready.

 

[superrav]

We should be happy this bill passed!! We want a pilot shortage!!!

 

[relief tube]

If you can't make money as a CFI its because you're not doing it right.

sure about that? maybee 10 years ago but not now.

no, it's more about not having enough students because learning to fly is expensive and we're going through a recession

 

[Lynxman]

Hopefully this impending "shortage" will allow people like myself to be hired.

 

[surplus1]

Let me ask you this. Would you hire me if I had a good attitutde and explained 3 failures for the same ride? I'd have to seriously ask myself if I was in the other person's shoes would I seriously take the chance on this guy? When there is thousands of applicants with 0-1 failures. It suck's, but I think my app will automatically be overlooked by some computer sorting program.

I think you may be worrying more than you should. Is this one rating that you've failed 3 times or is it a pattern with all your ratings? I think that makes a difference.

There may be some truth to computer screening programs causing a problem. You won't know until you try. But, if you get an interview those check rides won't be the only thing that matters. If there are pilots on the panel and you have reasonable explanations, chances are they will listen.

The problem every young pilot faces today is that pilots don't hire pilots; you have to deal with the HR people and they seldom know much about flying. Those people just put pegs in holes. Give them what they want and its very possible that you'll get by the glitch.

Just take your time and get well prepared. Don't make these busts a habit pattern.

Most important thing: Don't give up. If you really want something bad enough there's always a way to make it happen.

If flying is really what you want to do for a living, keep in my that the airlines are not the end-all of everything. There are many excellent opportunities in other types of flying that can produce a very successful career.

Keep the faith. Learn something new - everytime you fly. You'll be all right.

 

[buscap]

Hopefully this impending "shortage" will allow people like myself to be hired.

Only if you get your poop together my friend, whether the poop be preparation, checkride management, knowledge, maturity, intestinal fortitude, or skill.

 

[kmox29]

Little wonder its screwed up. FSDOs are full of people who couldn't get a real job. Bunch of feathermerchants.

Awesome quote. It's just like saying the Regionals are full of pilots who couldn't get hired at a Major. You and General Lee think so much alike...

 

[CX880]

Let me ask you this. Would you hire me if I had a good attitutde and explained 3 failures for the same ride? I'd have to seriously ask myself if I was in the other person's shoes would I seriously take the chance on this guy? When there is thousands of applicants with 0-1 failures. It suck's, but I think my app will automatically be overlooked by some computer sorting program.

It all depends on the policy of that airline. You can wish all you want but HR at airlines are all about procedures, not about common sense. YOu can have 4000 hours as a space shuttle commander but if you do not meet a requirement like say only 2 failures in the last 5 years, you will not be looked at. Don't worry about anything though no use in it, I know plenty of people that not only have busted check rides but complete company training event failures, those are the guys that are actually screwed by this bill and will probably have to wait for the next hiring bus where all the airlines will go into warm body mode.

 

[surplus1]

Awesome quote. It's just like saying the Regionals are full of pilots who couldn't get hired at a Major. You and General Lee think so much alike...

Nope, not the same at all. It's true about FSDO; it's not true about the regionals. The "regionals" are chock full of airline pilots most of whom are every bit as capable as those in the majors and some moreso.

Telling me I think like General Lee is a low blow. Our thinking is as different as night and day. You really know how to hurt a guy. :0 Remind me to do YOU a favor sometime. :smash: