Southwest slam clicks- c'mon captains....

[fr8doggie]

Howard: What happens at the end of the PEB?

 

[PCL_128]

fr8doggie, don't confuse him. He thinks he knows something. Let him be.

 

[Beechdriver32]

Funny PCL, I was thinking the same about you!

'Let him be'

Might be the new "Bless your heart", but just for you--

 

[Luv2BFlyin]

We had a one year extension because we got something, don't remember what. I am pretty sure we are only 1 plus a few months past the extension date, although two plus something since first opportunity to amend.

Thanks for that, and what date was the last CBA ratified?

 

[HowardBorden]

If either labor or management decline voluntary arbitration, and if in the opinion of the NMB the continuance of the controversy threatens substantially to interrupt interstate commerce in any section of the nation, the NMB is required to notify the President of the United States, who may, at his discretion, create a fact-finding Presidential Emergency Board.

The parties must maintain the status quo (no strikes or lockouts) for 30 days. If the president chooses not to appoint an emergency board, strikes or lockouts may occur after the 30-day cooling-off period.

Emergency boards are comprised of neutral members whose job is to make an investigation and submit to the president, within 30 days of its creation, a fact-finding report with non-binding recommendations for procedures or terms on which a dispute might be settled. During this period, the parties must maintain the status quo (a second 30-day cooling-off period).

Upon submission of the PEB report, the parties are required to maintain the status quo for an additional, or third 30-day cooling-off period (they may mutually agree to extend the period of status quo). The non-binding recommendations of the PEB are expected to carry the weight of public opinion and induce a voluntary agreement among the parties.

At this point, the RLA has run its course. If no agreement has been reached, either side becomes free to act in its own economic interests -- a work stoppage (or strike) by labor, a lockout by management, or unilateral implementation of management proposals (that generally would force a work stoppage).

However, Congress frequently imposes its own settlement. Such congressional action is not part of the RLA. The constitutional authority for Congress to impose its own settlements is found in Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution's commerce clause.

 

[fr8doggie]

Howard: my point was the PEB does not have to lead to an imposed contract. Also, self-help does not mean only a strike. There are many ways to exert force or "bring the pain".

I would like to see you guys get a new, improved contract with handshakes and smiles all around. However, I think you are operating under a new (old) paradigm now. You are going to have to convince your management that meeting your goals is cheaper than opposing you.

SWAPA has quite a bit of leverage. I don't think you guys are ready to use it yet. You may be a long way away. Too many guys willing to take a bullet for Herb. I've seen all the same stuff at FDX.

My best wishes to all of you.

 

[PCL_128]

Howard: my point was the PEB does not lead to an imposed contract.

Bingo.

 

[HowardBorden]

Howard: my point was the PEB does not lead to an imposed contract. Also, self-help does not mean only a strike.

In the 90 plus years since the RLA's enactment, most labor negotiations have resulted in voluntary settlements. However, Congress has stepped in to terminate strikes following exhaustion of RLA procedures. Congressional measures have included additional cooling off periods to continue negotiations, implementation of PEB recommendations, and compulsory arbitration.

 

[PCL_128]

Congress generally doesn't intervene in airline cases, but does have a history of intervening in railroad cases. However, the railroad unions have not objected to this, because it's worked well for them over time.

 

[HowardBorden]

Congress generally doesn't intervene in airline cases, but does have a history of intervening in railroad cases. However, the railroad unions have not objected to this, because it's worked well for them over time.

The fact is, they certainly can, and I suspect they would in order to keep the largest carrier of US domestic passengers flying.

In the end it is so extremely rare that we ever see an airline strike. We had Spirit strike briefly in 2010. The Northwest mechanics walked off in 2005 but were quickly replaced with scabs and barely caused a ripple in operations. Before that there was Comair in 2000 if I remember correctly. They struck for around 90 days if I remember it right. Clinton stepped in quickly to stop the American Airlines pilot strike of 1997.

Strikes are rare and PEB's are much rarer, especially in the airline industry. My question is this, suspend your disbelief for a moment and speculate that the NMB has released SWA to a 30 day cooling off period. Do you agree that the NMB would be required to notify the president of a situation that "threatens substantially to interrupt interstate commerce in any section of the nation" and that he or she would convene a PEB after that recommendation? If so, what do you think the odds of a strike actually taking place?

 

[fr8doggie]

Howard: You guys have leverage that you can exert outside of striking. And I don't mean working for a successful, profitable company.

You're going to have to bring the pain. Bring it man! Bring it![emoji123]

 

[ron burgundy]

Well said Howard.

But I'll illuminate the getting laid crowd as well. "Trying" to get laid is what gets guys in trouble. You're not a frat boy. Work on yourself outside the bar. Physically. Socially. Get on an internet dating site and go on lots of dates (the world is full of women who just want a decent guy with a job who's not a leech). If you don't spend enough time with women, it will make you weird around them. Make yourself more interesting. Live in ways that make you more confident.
You get far more women, and much better quality of interactions when you stop TRYING so hard and just be a human being.
I always let the woman drive the getting laid train. You still got to be a man- know the signs and make your move- but learn to feel it out. Guys get into trouble when they pressure a situation to close the deal. (Dumb too, bc usually, if it's going to happen at all, a little more patience and better timing and it will happen. If not, let it go)
You never want either of you to wake up regretting. That's when it's really not cool anytime, but especially mixing it with work. This idea though, that you have to avoid the bar bc you might do something... C'mon. Grow up and live a little.
If you fear that, you need to get to work on yourself and stop pretending the problem isn't in the mirror.

Who knew? I could have saved thousands on therapy AND dating sites, if only I had access to your amazing insight! Thanks Dad.

 

[HowardBorden]

Howard: You guys have leverage that you can exert outside of striking. And I don't mean working for a successful, profitable company.

You're going to have to bring the pain. Bring it man! Bring it![emoji123]

Fr8, I don't disagree with you. We have the ability to make waves, most definitely! My diatribe on this subject was mostly aimed at PCL's assertion that no one but he understands how the RLA works, and how indeed we need to convince management that we are ready, willing and able to strike in order to reach our goals in negotiations. I still firmly believe that MGT lawyers as well as SWAPA lawyers know how unrealistic an actual strike is and how unlikely that action would be allowed by the president without convening a PEB. We haven't even petitioned for mediation yet, so we really need to take this one step at a time.

 

[waveflyer]

Who knew? I could have saved thousands on therapy AND dating sites, if only I had access to your amazing insight! Thanks Dad.

You can search this very site for the best hotel room floor workout in the world-
That'll help too


Ever notice that PCL has turned a thread about going down and having a beer into HIS favorite (maybe only) hobby-> airline negotiations


Note to all: don't talk about THIS stuff at the bar

 

[freightdogfred]

how indeed we need to convince management that we are ready, willing and able to strike in order to reach our goals in negotiations.

Stop....you're giving me gas

 

[PCL_128]

The fact is, they certainly can, and I suspect they would in order to keep the largest carrier of US domestic passengers flying.

You're still missing the point. The goal isn't to strike, the goal is to get a good deal. A PEB can be a way to achieve that. The deal struck after the PEB in '97 at American is a perfect example.

Strikes are rare and PEB's are much rarer, especially in the airline industry. My question is this, suspend your disbelief for a moment and speculate that the NMB has released SWA to a 30 day cooling off period. Do you agree that the NMB would be required to notify the president of a situation that "threatens substantially to interrupt interstate commerce in any section of the nation" and that he or she would convene a PEB after that recommendation? If so, what do you think the odds of a strike actually taking place?

You still don't understand the process. Before the NMB even issues a release they undergo an impact study to ascertain what the impact would be to the economy and the transportation system. That's just part of their due diligence. The NMB is also in constant contact with the White House, so it's not something that they just suddenly call the President about during a cooling off period. The President's chief counsel or Chief of Staff would have alerted him to a cooling off period long before it was actually issued. But the White House's goal is the same as the NMB's: get a deal reached without a strike. And this is the part you need to remember: sometimes a release is the only way to reach a consensual deal. That is the NMB's calculation. The NMB will release you into a cooling off period when they believe that the release is likely to lead to a deal so that the labor unrest can be cleared off the government's table. A release is never issued if the NMB (or the White House) believes that a strike is the likely result of the release. The release is there to apply pressure to both sides to reach a deal.

 

[Double Shot]

So when is your last day Pcl? Why do you come on the forums when your quitting the profession? All hat no cattle is what you are.

 

[PCL_128]

Sorry, but I don't speak Texas hick.

 

[orangebellyav8r]

No...but you speak dick

 

[twepilot]

You have something against Texas Hicks.. I guess you're more West Vagina toofless..

RV