UAL to Furlough?!

[Green]

They exist in a near monopoly with only 3 major airlines, the economy is relatively 'strong,' and we are not in the midst of any disruptors like 150/oil or bird flu. Yet UAL is going to furlough 685 FA's. Quite shocking.

I imagine if UAL was the only airline in the world they would be complaining about competition from corporate jets and the need to cut wages, etc. What's going to happen when the economy takes a nose dive due to rising interest rates?

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/01/16/us-unitedcontinental-furloughs-idUSBREA0F08020140116

 

[redflyer65]

Wow. And they just hired those people within the last year. I hope management can get it's act together.

Sad for those involved.

 

[EL10]

They are furloughing on the L-UAL side, the hiring has been done on the L-CAL side. The L-UAL side is shrinking as 757s get parked and the CAL side is growing as 787s arrive. The FAs are still not integrated.

Just more BS to put pressure on AFA to get a JCBA done.

 

[Dan Roman]

Wow. And they just hired those people within the last year. I hope management can get it's act together.

Sad for those involved.

As you can see it's an issue over merging their list. Just curious, you say you hope their management can get their act together......they seem to be following through with a similar scenario to what your "Gary" threatened to do. Do you also think your management should get their act together?

Not picking on you dude, we all live in glass houses.

 

[waveflyer]

Nice thread creep dan
Like east west, maybe all threads should be SWA-AT whenever any SWA guy says anything

 

[redflyer65]

As you can see it's an issue over merging their list. Just curious, you say you hope their management can get their act together......they seem to be following through with a similar scenario to what your "Gary" threatened to do. Do you also think your management should get their act together?

Not picking on you dude, we all live in glass houses.

That was a pretty crazy thread creep Dan, but to answer your question...

Yes, I think SW management should get our acquisition complete. I meant no disrespect with what I said regarding UAL. I honestly hope they can get the synergies they keep talking about. And not furloughing.

 

[Green]

Maybe UAL is just making room to hire some of these girls.

http://www.headlineasia.com/photos-qingdao-universitys-flight-attendant-pageant/

 

[Flopgut]

UAL AFA had a chance to formalize an agreement allowing UAL FA crossovers to CAL and they shot it down. The specific problem is these two contracts are light years apart. CAL FAs have a productivity type contract, and UAL FAs are the opposite. Even though a large number of junior UAL want the CAL work rules, there are still more senior mamas that are not interested. The UAL side wants a lot of money to not work.

 

[WSurf]

The UAL side wants a lot of money to not work.

Don't we all when it comes to Aviation?? I'm sure with all that FA money they are making it rain.....

 

[chppr5]

UAL AFA had a chance to formalize an agreement allowing UAL FA crossovers to CAL and they shot it down. The specific problem is these two contracts are light years apart. CAL FAs have a productivity type contract, and UAL FAs are the opposite. Even though a large number of junior UAL want the CAL work rules, there are still more senior mamas that are not interested. The UAL side wants a lot of money to not work.

The COMPANY shot down the AFA proposal for a crossover deal not the other way around. The CAL girls are being fed BS from the IAM supporters to discredit AFA. The company likes to wipsaw the 2 groups, where did we see that before......Same management, same MO!

 

[Flopgut]

You want to defend the AFA, go ahead Chppr. Probably more than a third of their members want the CAL work rules. I fly with actual UAL FA crossovers and all if them blame the AFA. The AFA can't work with anyone.

 

[chppr5]

You want to defend the AFA, go ahead Chppr. Probably more than a third of their members want the CAL work rules. I fly with actual UAL FA crossovers and all if them blame the AFA. The AFA can't work with anyone.

I'm not defending the AFA just correcting rumors. The name on the Union hall door doesn't matter, the same people step up to serve. The membership is AFA as is ALPA...The entity isn't the boogie man some folks make them out to be. As to you flying with a lot of UAL f/a's, I'm married to one, hang out with a lot of them and fly with ALL LUAL f/a's.

 

[chppr5]

You want to defend the AFA, go ahead Chppr. Probably more than a third of their members want the CAL work rules. I fly with actual UAL FA crossovers and all if them blame the AFA. The AFA can't work with anyone.

The more I read this the more I chuckle. You mean lack of LCAL work rules?? AFA moved towards the LCAL f/a's so called work rules on their last contract, got rid of the cap like LCAL, gave relief on flight time restrictions like LCAL and now they are furloughing because they gave relief on work rules and are overstaffed. I guess that "work, work, work till you die" culture over at LCAL bleeds thru all employee groups. And YES, we are at a major airline now, work the least for the most!!

 

[Flopgut]

Chppr I'm done talking about this with you. This has to be the least of our concerns. I get that you're trying to project this onto a cal v UAL pilot or culture thing. Have fun with that.

 

[chppr5]

Chppr I'm done talking about this with you. This has to be the least of our concerns. I get that you're trying to project this onto a cal v UAL pilot or culture thing. Have fun with that.

That's NOT what I'm trying to do. I corrected the false assumption that the AFA is at fault. YOU brought up the fact that LUAL want LCAL work rules, which may be true with a small minority. The vote is complete, AFA won, good or bad. The fact is MANAGEMENT turned down the crossover......

 

[Flopgut]

The fact that it [FA crossover] ever existed, and that it is what our union was able to do for pilots, means the two sides should have been able to iron it out. The failure was APA. Big picture: (and now I'll project this onto the pilot side) Not one single CAL pilot believes, that if UAL was hiring and CAL had furloughed [pilots], would UAL have given us jobs. In fact, there isn't anybody anywhere that believes that. AFA is sorta doing the same thing, but their hurting their own members and trying to blame someone else.

 

[Flopgut]

And btw: this has zero to do with the principle of max pay for least work. This has much more to do with a group of employees who can't physically perform an amount of work the job requires, clinging to outdated work rules.

 

[densoo]

Not one single CAL pilot believes, that if UAL was hiring and CAL had furloughed [pilots], would UAL have given us jobs. In fact, there isn't anybody anywhere that believes that.

You mean if LCAL had had 1500 furloughs and LUAL had had none? No doubt about that one. I think we'd still have 1500 LCAL pilots on the street. Instead they're all guppy captains now.

 

[Flopgut]

Yep. That's what I mean. And SLI? Ask a frontier pilot...

 

[chppr5]

The fact that it [FA crossover] ever existed, and that it is what our union was able to do for pilots, means the two sides should have been able to iron it out. The failure was APA. Big picture: (and now I'll project this onto the pilot side) Not one single CAL pilot believes, that if UAL was hiring and CAL had furloughed [pilots], would UAL have given us jobs. In fact, there isn't anybody anywhere that believes that. AFA is sorta doing the same thing, but their hurting their own members and trying to blame someone else.

For someone who didn't want to drift to a UAL vs CAL thread you sure jumped in head first. You ALWAYS paint with a broad stroke. You were wrong about the crossover, I called you on it...get over it. Now you think you and ALL the CAL pilots know what UAL would have done if roles were reversed, going back 25 years to the Frontier debacle. What were the CAL pilots doing then??? Oh yea, scabbing and waiting to accept the EAL flying Lorenzo eventually stole....... Glass houses!!!!

 

[Flopgut]

Yeah, it's true. UAL alpa was just as bad as Lorenzo. Glad we agree. And you didn't call me on a thing. While it's technically correct that AFA can point the finger at mgt, the larger truth is they are throwing most of their membership under the bus. The AFA has got wake up and do the right thing. FAs need to be able to work the same sort of schedules that are worked elsewhere. You and I do that as pilots, right? If anything we're working more than most pilots who fly for companies we compete with.

 

[chppr5]

Yeah, it's true. UAL alpa was just as bad as Lorenzo. Glad we agree. And you didn't call me on a thing. While it's technically correct that AFA can point the finger at mgt, the larger truth is they are throwing most of their membership under the bus. The AFA has got wake up and do the right thing. FAs need to be able to work the same sort of schedules that are worked elsewhere. You and I do that as pilots, right? If anything we're working more than most pilots who fly for companies we compete with.

So "doing the right thing" to you is giving concessions for nothing in return in a non concessionary environment. God help us!!! Totally dfifferent culture...

 

[EL10]

Yeah, it's true. UAL alpa was just as bad as Lorenzo. Glad we agree. And you didn't call me on a thing. While it's technically correct that AFA can point the finger at mgt, the larger truth is they are throwing most of their membership under the bus. The AFA has got wake up and do the right thing. FAs need to be able to work the same sort of schedules that are worked elsewhere. You and I do that as pilots, right? If anything we're working more than most pilots who fly for companies we compete with.

So which work rules do you think they should give up?

 

[Flopgut]

So "doing the right thing" to you is giving concessions for nothing in return in a non concessionary environment. God help us!!! Totally dfifferent culture...

From the guy who's group votes 80+% in favor of pay cuts. AND who's group throws a fit when cal trades a single aisle grievance for profit sharing. (You wanted us to do something for you because you couldn't win your own grievances)

 

[Crucianpilot]

I think you two should meet in person and hash out your differences. I'll just pull up a chair, some popcorn and enjoy it.

 

[chppr5]

From the guy who's group votes 80+% in favor of pay cuts. AND who's group throws a fit when cal trades a single aisle grievance for profit sharing. (You wanted us to do something for you because you couldn't win your own grievances)

There you go with that broad brush again. 80%??? I was on the Strike Com and WE didn't know the break down of the vote but you do.....I don't think anyone took a pay cut but if you consider Hr caps, yea, you may have took a W2 hit because you couldn't whore youself out anymore for 130hrs a month. If you had any clue as to what grievances are worth you would realize the $38M was record setting x20. Also that $38m diluted the LUAL profit sharing, a grievance we won, and is in the arbs hands now for damages. You must still be getting your info from JP. I guess the more you repeat it the more it becomes fact. You're pathetic!

 

[AirMike]

From the guy who's group votes 80+% in favor of pay cuts. AND who's group throws a fit when cal trades a single aisle grievance for profit sharing. (You wanted us to do something for you because you couldn't win your own grievances)

First of all, we voted 75% in the affirmative for our bankruptcy era contract, not 80+ you simpleton. Secondly, after I'm done teaching you the United way of preflight briefing, get your ass out there and do a proper walk around. I'll take the steak. Hope you're enjoying the current vacancy bid snapshot, lol!

 

[Flopgut]

....... Funny

 

[Flopgut]

There you go with that broad brush again. 80%??? I was on the Strike Com and WE didn't know the break down of the vote but you do.....I don't think anyone took a pay cut but if you consider Hr caps, yea, you may have took a W2 hit because you couldn't whore youself out anymore for 130hrs a month. If you had any clue as to what grievances are worth you would realize the $38M was record setting x20. Also that $38m diluted the LUAL profit sharing, a grievance we won, and is in the arbs hands now for damages. You must still be getting your info from JP. I guess the more you repeat it the more it becomes fact. You're pathetic!

I would rather have not done the deal for profit sharing. But I was even more adverse to the UAL side telling us what to do after our scope clause got wrecked the way it did. But you did win that grievance and I hope you get something.

To the point of the thread, and to answer the earlier question: they shouldn't forfeit any work rules freely, they should get something for sure. But I don't think we've got much of an airline in the future if the FA group doesn't elevate their game from a LUAL standpoint. Service is suspect and safety/security has never really been in the equation. I'm all for them getting a great big contract, seriously. But some core changes have got to take place.

 

[Jetjockey]

First of all, we voted 75% in the affirmative for our bankruptcy era contract, not 80+ you simpleton. Secondly, after I'm done teaching you the United way of preflight briefing, get your ass out there and do a proper walk around. I'll take the steak. Hope you're enjoying the current vacancy bid snapshot, lol!

Pipe down junior....stop pretending to be a United pilot.


Look up this clown's past posts and you'll find out what a fraud he is.