Delta Air Lines Orders Up to 70 Bombardier CRJ900 NextGen Jetliners

[TEXAN AVIATOR]

Combining SkyWest and ASA may happen, but legacy Expressjet may be left swinging in the breeze. Supposedly their contract expectations are unreasonable, and the pilot group's militancy makes it a difficult cultural fit with the other two groups.

I hate to ruin this with a fact but.....It isn't possible with our transition and process agreement. It would take all three of us to accept the change in direction of a ASA/SKY merger and not XJET. XJT alpa would never approve. Nice wet dream the LASA guys have but not gonna happen. Sorry.

 

[JustaNumber]

I hate to ruin this with a fact but.....It isn't possible with our transition and process agreement. It would take all three of us to accept the change in direction of a ASA/SKY merger and not XJET. XJT alpa would never approve. Nice wet dream the LASA guys have but not gonna happen. Sorry.

Hey, don't shoot the messenger. For what it's worth, there are quite a few LXJT guys saying things like:

The sentiment that I see is that if it means having a concessionary contract, then keep us separate.

 

[TEXAN AVIATOR]

Not shooting anyone. Just stating the facts.... I'm guessing the first part of your rumor could be true but the merging ASA/skywest ain't gonna happen without us ERJ pilots.

The simple fact is if it's a concessionary contract, the ERJ side will vote no way Jose. But, until it comes out for a vote I'll let my negotiation committee do the talking for me.

 

[Nevets]

Hey, don't shoot the messenger. For what it's worth, there are quite a few LXJT guys saying things like:

Well the messenger is pretty naive to be the messenger on this one. Or more likely, they are posting flame bait. For the record, personally, I rather stay separate if merging us with ASA means taking a concessionary contract. That has nothing to do with your nonsense rumor. Are you willing to take a concession on a new contract?

 

[SLUF4]

I hope santa clause brings the general some protein powder and creatine this christmas..you need some bulk!

 

[www.]

Well the messenger is pretty naive to be the messenger on this one. Or more likely, they are posting flame bait. For the record, personally, I rather stay separate if merging us with ASA means taking a concessionary contract. That has nothing to do with your nonsense rumor. Are you willing to take a concession on a new contract?

Is your MEC willing to agree to cancel the TPA agreement?

 

[TEXAN AVIATOR]

Is your MEC willing to agree to cancel the TPA agreement?

No. Is yours willing to quit being whiny bitches?

 

[xjhawk]

Very few pinnacle pilots understand this.

Some even still think we might only lose 15-30 crj's and those will be replaced with 900's. I laugh in a sad way. they quote a contract written on toilet paper that the crj's will be around for X amount of years. They will not listen to any mesaba pilot who has been through a bankruptcy who knows contracts mean nothing when you are in bankruptcy. People! look into the past to see the future!

Delta has contractual obligations with their pilots to get down to 125 crj 200 (50 seaters).

Delta has already made deals with sky west to rid themselves of 66 crj's and if I see that correctly, they will still operate about 90 50 seaters for Delta. How many more does that leave Pinnacle and anyone else? That my friends is how many 200's we will lose.

 

[Speedtape]

It's concessions and a joint contract, or PLAN B. PLAN B = You become the incredible shrinking airline. Just look at the lease retirement schedule starting early next year.

A new CPA can be negotiated, and there will be no replacement airplanes. Then what?

 

[Gr82Aviate]

General Lee is female. Duh.

That would make more sense, 6' 5" and 140 lbs in 6 inch heels?

 

[pilotkppsg]

It's concessions and a joint contract, or PLAN B. PLAN B = You become the incredible shrinking airline. Just look at the lease retirement schedule starting early next year.

A new CPA can be negotiated, and there will be no replacement airplanes. Then what?

Why must we vote in concessions in a contract merger again? I'm having a really hard time understanding why I must accept less money when the company keeps touting "cost benefit savings through combined synergies." All this while blowing cash on "Surejet" name selection, mini indy, aceypalooza, Acey days, aerodata transition for us, paying 200% almost 7 entire months last year, running higher line divisors increasing sick call usage, the list goes on.

Please help me fathom this concept. I'm an ignorant L-Xjt pilot who needs to be "cost competitive and get on board."

 

[www.]

No. Is yours willing to quit being whiny bitches?

Is that the best you can do? Grow up and learn how to play with the big boys.

 

[777forever]

The way I understand it is that nobody will be taking any concessions with the JCBA. Unless L-XJT considers PBS a concession. Anyways, the final system hasn't been decided yet, and lots of rumors about which one the company favors and who's side they are on.



Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

 

[centralpilot]

Anyways, the final system hasn't been decided yet, and lots of rumors about which one the company favors and who's side they are on.

It is a crying shame that some are worried about whose side the company is on. There should only be 2 sides: pilots vs. management.

 

[JustaNumber]

Why must we vote in concessions in a contract merger again? I'm having a really hard time understanding why I must accept less money when the company keeps touting "cost benefit savings through combined synergies." All this while blowing cash on "Surejet" name selection, mini indy, aceypalooza, Acey days, aerodata transition for us, paying 200% almost 7 entire months last year, running higher line divisors increasing sick call usage, the list goes on.

Please help me fathom this concept. I'm an ignorant L-Xjt pilot who needs to be "cost competitive and get on board."

The aerodata transition is a huge revenue enhancer, as it allows much quicker calculations (and recalculations when they inevitably add three more bags right at departure time), increasing the odds of making D-0 and A-14, which means more money from DL/UA.

The 200% last year was because at the time they were not expecting the additional Comair or Pinnacle flying, and they were expecting the airline to downsize. It is more cost-effective to pay overtime than to hire, train, and then furlough guys for just a few months.

The employee appreciation events are designed to increase morale and productivity. (Whether they were implemented persuasively enough may be debateable, but the concept has been proven successful in general).

Management isn't perfect (Surejet? seriously?), but I do think they are trying to run the best airline they can. We're not being run by some masochistic Ornstein type that intentionally abuses employees as part of the business model. If the company was returning 25% profit margins, then we could argue for our fair share, but when we're just struggling to remain profitable at all, and keep from becoming the next failed regional to wither and die, we do have to start accepting reality.

If we were facing draconian concessions (like the Pinnacle guys), then holding firm with dignity would be warranted. But being asked to accept the wrong brand of PBS vendors (for the XJT guys), or something like losing vacation low (for the ASA guys), and you're ready to burn the place down? I'm just saying we all need to put the reality of the industry into perspective.

 

[JustaNumber]

It is a crying shame that some are worried about whose side the company is on. There should only be 2 sides: pilots vs. management.

If you want to talk about the ideal situation, it should be the pilots and management jointly working together vs. our competition. That's who the real "enemy" is. Or you could possibly make the case that Delta is our real adversary.

Being able to say "we sure showed you" to management as the company goes out of business is kind of silly. Unfortunately, regional airline survival is a very real concern in today's age of bankruptcy court abuse.

 

[Cpt Oveur]

If you want to talk about the ideal situation, it should be the pilots and management jointly working together vs. our competition. That's who the real "enemy" is. Or you could possibly make the case that Delta is our real adversary.

Being able to say "we sure showed you" to management as the company goes out of business is kind of silly. Unfortunately, regional airline survival is a very real concern in today's age of bankruptcy court abuse.

Well said.

 

[777forever]

If you want to talk about the ideal situation, it should be the pilots and management jointly working together vs. our competition. That's who the real "enemy" is. Or you could possibly make the case that Delta is our real adversary.

Being able to say "we sure showed you" to management as the company goes out of business is kind of silly. Unfortunately, regional airline survival is a very real concern in today's age of bankruptcy court abuse.

Very well said. One of the best posts of 2012. Bravo!

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

 

[centralpilot]

If you want to talk about the ideal situation, it should be the pilots and management jointly working together vs. our competition. That's who the real "enemy" is.

Agreed. I would love it if we could get to a place where our pilots (unified) are working with management to make this a successful company with less poisonous morale. Unfortunately I think the company's idea of working together is chasing after the continuously lowering bar in this segment of the industry. With each regional liquidation or BK concession our position gets worse. The longer we bicker among ourselves the more we play into their hands. We need to resolve our disagreements internally & quickly.

 

[wms]

The mgmt is not just trying to run a good airline. The company does have an agenda of "control for control's sake", re; occurrences, alternate deadhead, no release after a trip, etc, and we should expect them to give that up. You can't run an effective company of 4000 pilots micromanaging their lives. The upper mgmt knows exactly what dirty tricks the occ plays and endorses it by their lack of action.

Also, mgmt wants smartpref. If you've been here more than a week you know mgmt never wants what's good for the front line employees, and if they do want it that should be a automatic no vote.

Mgmt wants to get rid of prefbid, the only real improvement ever to our qol at this company. That's an automatic yes vote.