Southwest off the runway at KDEN.

[waveflyer]

IB-
Were you flying Denver that night?
You familiar with that intersection?

You do know that it's an inclined 45 degree turn that requires a good amount of power regardless of conditions- it's also pretty isolated and there were fair-poor braking reports from crews landing on recently plowed runways- so how much better do you think it was at the intersection of P7 & ED, going uphill, and turning?

But you're totally familiar, right?

 

[SWA Bubba]

IB-
Were you flying Denver that night?
You familiar with that intersection?

You do know that it's an inclined 45 degree turn that requires a good amount of power regardless of conditions- it's also pretty isolated and there were fair-poor braking reports from crews landing on recently plowed runways- so how much better do you think it was at the intersection of P7 & ED, going uphill, and turning?

But you're totally familiar, right?

Probably not. Just one of the usual haters and pile-on toadies. Southwest could have a plane taxi into an invisible pothole at 2 kts, and all we'd hear about is Southwest taxi speeds. Hell, a parked plane on an overnight could get hit by a friggin' meteor, and somehow it would be related to Southwest taxi speeds. Facts are not required here, Wave. You should know that. This is FI.

Bubba

 

[Whine Lover]

Once again...Walken says it best:

http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/the-boulevard-of-broken-balls/1357618/

 

[IBNAV8R]

IB-
Were you flying Denver that night?
You familiar with that intersection?

You do know that it's an inclined 45 degree turn that requires a good amount of power regardless of conditions- it's also pretty isolated and there were fair-poor braking reports from crews landing on recently plowed runways- so how much better do you think it was at the intersection of P7 & ED, going uphill, and turning?

But you're totally familiar, right?

I am intimately familiar with that intersection in ALL weather conditions. I was based in DEN for 6+ years. Never had a problem. But, then again, I don't taxi like a bat out of hell under ANY conditions.

The quoted statement leads me to believe it is the writer who is unfamiliar with that particular intersection. I don't recall needing power until well after the intersection and going up the hill on ED. What I DO remember is that P7 is a long straightaway and that you have to consciously slow down to make the turn under good conditions and, be dead-slow under icy conditions.

But what do I know? I wasn't there. Therefore, it could not POSSIBLY have ANYTHING to do with excessive taxi speeds - for which SWA is infamous.

The denial and justification of certain posters would seem to strengthen that characterization.

 

[redflyer65]

I don't taxi like a bat out of hell under ANY conditions.

Neither do we. Have you seen a SW plane taxing at 30kts on the snow lately? I haven't, and I work here.

RF

 

[jonjuan]

Probably not. Just one of the usual haters and pile-on toadies. Southwest could have a plane taxi into an invisible pothole at 2 kts, and all we'd hear about is Southwest taxi speeds. Hell, a parked plane on an overnight could get hit by a friggin' meteor, and somehow it would be related to Southwest taxi speeds. Facts are not required here, Wave. You should know that. This is FI.

Bubba

Someone's a little cranky tonight.

 

[jonjuan]

"................high....,NHL.........

 

[scoreboardII]

lets see, CATIII to 35R, less than 1/4NM vis, SNBR, I think they were taxiing pretty slow...

 

[Dan Roman]

lets see, CATIII to 35R, less than 1/4NM vis, SNBR, I think they were taxiing pretty slow...

I would think you are quit correct, anything can happen to any of us and totally wrong to judge fellow airmen without knowing the circumstances.......that said, there is a very valid reason why, when SWA has this type of incident that pilots will raise the point that SWA does have more than it's fair share of pilots that taxi like Mario Andretti wannabes and come off as less professional than other airline pilots.

 

[canyonblue]

....... SWA does have more than it's fair share of pilots that taxi like Mario Andretti wannabes and come off as less professional than other airline pilots.

That's why I purposely taxi slow anytime I'm around another airline, I wouldn't want to Make you nervous. Just don't complain when you have to wait for me to pass by at 5 knots, I'm just being safe.

 

[HA25]

That's why I purposely taxi slow anytime I'm around another airline, I wouldn't want to Make you nervous. Just don't complain when you have to wait for me to pass by at 5 knots, I'm just being safe.

Sigh.. so it's either 5 knots or 35+ knots then? How about we just keep it under 15, or I'll even take 20 on long straights? I'm just glad Southwest doesn't operate something bigger.. I'd love to see you try that crap on a 633,000lb MD11 much less a 880,000lb 747...

 

[IBNAV8R]

I wasn't there so I can only speculate - knowing what I know about KDEN and that intersection in particular.

A company has a reputation for taxiing faster than most pilots feel is safe. Same airline involved in a taxiway excursion. No other aircraft went off the pavement at that intersection that evening.

What does the DFDR show? Did the 30 or so other aircraft that used that intersection in that hour report NIL braking action? It's one thing to screw up. It happens to all of us. It's quite another to not own up to your shortcomings and avoid another occurrence.

 

[Dash Power]

If anyone is interested in facts, the said aircraft was going 3mph while making the turn and the area in question on the taxiway was determined after the fact to have nil braking action.

All of us would have slid off the taxiway. Even the haters.

 

[Ops check good]

pilots will raise the point that SWA does have more than it's fair share of pilots that taxi like Mario Andretti wannabes and come off as less professional than other airline pilots.

So going as slow as a snail like AA is more professional?

 

[scoreboardII]

No other aircraft went off the pavement at that intersection that evening. .

Maybe because SWA was the first through there in a long time since it started snowing and then they blocked the intersection? Really dude? How about we get some facts instead of incorrect speculation.

 

[Ops check good]

Like I said before. Keep on bagging on them, that will get you some good karma. There is a reason it is called and accident. Do you really think that crew woke up that day and said "I feel like screwing up today"

 

[scoreboardII]

or said after landing in snow with less than 1/4 mile vis the FO said "hey captain, how about 30 knots to gate 49 so we can hit Doz Bog"?

 

[Dan Roman]

So going as slow as a snail like AA is more professional?

How in the world did you get that from my post???
I say again, it's unfair to judge anyone without being there. Including SWA.......but, there is a reason people jump on them about their taxi speeds.As HA25 said, why does saying taxing too fast is unprofessional means advocating taxing too slow???
You said you are a mechanic and they can take going off a taxiway at a slow speed with no problem. Fair enough Joe Patroni, but it is still highly unprofessional to need to get pulled out of the dirt.

(I wish I could remember the George Kennedy line about pilots and 707's and exiting runways from Airport, it would have been quite appropriate!)

 

[Dan Roman]

Like I said before. Keep on bagging on them, that will get you some good karma. There is a reason it is called and accident. Do you really think that crew woke up that day and said "I feel like screwing up today"

True statement, as I said it could happen to anyone. But it is important to learn from mistakes, IF it even was a mistake on his part.
The fact remains that having a hurry up and rush culture does result in a smaller margin of safety.

 

[HA25]

How in the world did you get that from my post???
I say again, it's unfair to judge anyone without being there. Including SWA.......but, there is a reason people jump on them about their taxi speeds.As HA25 said, why does saying taxing too fast is unprofessional means advocating taxing too slow???
You said you are a mechanic and they can take going off a taxiway at a slow speed with no problem. Fair enough Joe Patroni, but it is still highly unprofessional to need to get pulled out of the dirt.

(I wish I could remember the George Kennedy line about pilots and 707's and exiting runways from Airport, it would have been quite appropriate!)

best of the "Airport" movies... for the kids who don't know where you're going with that...

Joe Petroni: "this plane is built to withstand anything except a bad pilot?"
Captain: Tell your mechanic I've got over 3,000,000 miles in the air!
Joe Petroni: "And two feet in the ground!"...

and best one in my book! "good thing the 707 can't read?"