V2 to MSA or Accelerate to VFS????

[avbug]

I'm also the more experienced guy.

That's rather unfortunate for your operation, isn't it. Given your question at the outset of this thread, your experience level is rather minimal. I find it hard to believe a working professional would ask the question at all, let alone in the manner that it was presented.

Duh.

What would you say if you were a college graduate?

We all die as crews not individuals.

You do this a lot, do you?

Now my co-pilot is convinced that V2 to MSA is the way to do it.

You're copilot is convinced, you say. Never the less, we learn that you're the copilot, which you assert has never been a secret; this affirms that you are indeed the copilot...and yet you refer to your fellow pilot as your copilot. You're the first officer, copilot, right seat guy, then...not the PIC, just so we've got that straight. Never the less, you're the more experienced guy, the one that "dies together." Thanks for clearing that up. I'm curious about your assertion that you're not lying, however. You talk about your copilot being erroneously convinced of what you clearly don't understand, then go on to say that you're really the copilot, and then assert that you didn't lie. How do you manage that?

I always held V2 (SE) or V-whatever...

V-whatever? Perhaps you shouldn't resort to such complicated technical jargon. Perhaps you should plan on referencing a real airspeed, rather than V-whatever. Being rather nebulous, you may have a hard time basing performance data on V-whatever. Where do you find this defined (it's okay to look in Part 25 this time, incidentally...you won't find it in TERPS). Still can't find it? Shocking.

I think this V2 to MSA thing is gonna bite somebody.

How, exactly, is maintaining takeoff safety speed going to "bite somebody?"

 

[LegacyDriver]

(PDA not doing para breaks. Sorry. Gonna try html.)

You obviously didn't read what was written.I advocate following the cleanup schedule. There is a growing crowd that advocates holding V2 to MSA regardless. I disagree but when you have a CAE or FSI instructor teaching it that way it gives pause.

Also "V-whatever" means just that. Whatever speed you have at TO angle after V2. In the Falcon it was called "V-that" and this refers to not slowing back to V2 after an engine failure but holding what you have (there are numerous reasons for that).

I may not be typed in this airplane but I followed the same syllabus as the guy who did and while I may be the F/O I don't play the ego game. It is a team effort and we are both pilots hence he's my co-pilot and I'm his. When I was a PIC I may have had to make the final call but I made damned sure my F/O knew he/she was vital to the success of the flight. Obviously avbug you have a different view of CRM. Not my problem.


And yes I believe it is going to be a struggle to convince my co-pilot (PIC, Captain, left seater, ad nauseum) that V2 to MSA is not necessarily the best way to go.
How will it bite someone? When they hold V2 instead of cleaning up on profile and hit terrain they should have cleared. The advocacy of V2 to MSA is being preached as gospel with no data to back it up by those who peddle this method.That's not good, unless, as I asked before, I am missing something.

 

[NCherches]

V2 until no more yellow/red near me on the EGPWS sounds good to me

 

[avbug]

I don't play the ego game.

You're the king of the ego game. You're the king of the egotistical nothing-can-surpass-the-almighty-Legacy game, too. It's humorous to see you unqualified, second fiddle, and still knowing more than anyone else...even though you clearly have no grasp of the subject.

Sort of like watching a second-grader try to expound on astrophysics at a university. Sad, but humorous.

Obviously avbug you have a different view of CRM.

I said nothing of CRM. Obviously you have a reading comprehension problem, to say nothing of a comprehension problem in general.

How will it bite someone? When they hold V2 instead of cleaning up on profile and hit terrain they should have cleared.

Takeoff safety speed will cause someone to hit terrain?

Have you ever actually flown a departure procedure, calculated takeoff performance, or planned and flown an obstacle departure?

Your commentary would lead one to believe otherwise.

You seem to continue to hold on to the belief that there is some correlation between terminal procedures, and Part 25...a mistake you owned up to, inadvertently, at the outset of this thread.

What keeps you from smacking terrain? YOU. Think. Plan. Calculate. Know.

Is your performance calculated at V2?

Are you still suggesting that Simuflite or FSI is teaching something other than the manufacturer procedures?

That's not good, unless, as I asked before, I am missing something.

You're missing more than something. You're missing some things. A great many, it would appear.

 

[LegacyDriver]

The only thing missing here is someone sticking their boot up your a--. You need it. Now I remember why I ignored you for so long. Time to go back to that I'm thinking.

Part 25 and TERPS speak different languages. I'm well aware of what is what. I think the manufacturers should be required to give more data for different circumstances. If that means a change to the regs so be it.

Yes I am saying that people are teaching things that go against the manufacturer as I see it. Some CAE guys say I am right some say I'm not. I also worked for a company that had V2 to MSA as SOP even though the identical airframe (and manufacturer data) advocated a clean up at accel height then climb at final segment speed.

Holding V2 to MSA in a Cessna, Embraer, and some Falcons (not the 7X apparently) is not correct IMHO. But people who should know better are teaching otherwise. I'm sure V2 gives you angle over Vfs / Venr to a point. The question becomes, at what point.

I frankly think the person who lacks experience here is you, avbug. Even if that assessment is incorrect, you haven't followed the thread so your comments wind up irrelevant, adding absolutely *no* substance to this discussion. Come back when you have something to contribute.

And yes, the Legacy is bad a**. That has nothing to do with my ego as I didn't design it.
Go away. The adults are trying to have a conversation.

 

[avbug]

If the adults are trying to have a conversation, then it's probably time for you to be seen, and not heard. Isn't it past your bed time?

 

[7on7Off]

Holding V2 to MSA in a Cessna, Embraer, and some Falcons (not the 7X apparently) is not correct IMHO.

So I guess you're smarter than the engineers who suggested it, and a better pilot than the test pilots who confirmed it?

It was suggested earlier that you simply follow the AFM procedure. If you disagree with it, take it up with the manufacture, not the flightinfo crowd.

For the record, our SOP (mirrored from the AFM) is V2 to MSA (or top of charted climb), while maintaining takeoff flap configuration.

 

[Rick1128]

If you don't follow the manufacturers procedures, you basically become a test pilot. All your performance is based on following the procedures in the AFM. If you follow a different procedure, you are throwing all your performance figures out the window.

As for Aspen, a few years ago during recurrent in the Lear 35 and the G4, my sim partner and I did takeoffs out of Aspen (in the sim, of course) at max gross for the conditions and a V1 cut. What was interesting was the fact that we actually had better terrain clearance with an engine out than we did with both engines operating. Part of that was because of our slower climb rate we were a little further down range so that when we did make our initial turn we were over the valley instead of going over the ridgeline.

 

[LegacyDriver]

So I guess you're smarter than the engineers who suggested it, and a better pilot than the test pilots who confirmed it?

</p>

You misunderstand. The manufacturers above all call for an accelration segment to clean up and accelerate. At least that's how I read their data. (Other than the 7X which I'm told says go V2 to safe altitude.)
As for ur SOP if your average climb gradient in that configuration gets you clear of the terrain I have no objection. I am sure there are circumstances where that won't work though, making a cleanup necessary unless you are light.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Isn't it past your bed time?

I don't sleep. I was created in a science lab for the soul purpose of annoying as many people as possible on the internet.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Just talked to Team Cessna."Hold V2 until 1500 feet minimum or *obstacle* clearance (whichever is higher) but *not* to MSA."Getting a call tomorrow from them to reaffirm this position.

 

[avbug]

I was created in a science lab for the soul purpose of annoying as many people as possible on the internet.

That explains a lot. Junk science.

It's sole purpose, by the way, brightspark.

 

[LegacyDriver]

That explains a lot. Junk science.

It's sole purpose, by the way, brightspark.

Yes, I shoulda' caught that error being the bloodthirsty editor I am. Sadly when I am on my bberry I type funetiklee at times and rarely re-read my work. It takes forever for this thing to load. Thus if I am typoing and spelling stuff wrong it is because I am on a BBerry and not a PC.

That being said....

They tried to make me as big an a*****e as you are but the team broke the test tube creating you. They put it back together with super glue and that somehow diluted the d-bag factor when they used it to make me. An unexpected positive side effect was I can fly way better than you can, spanky.

You're such a toolkit you could be a spokesman for Craftsman. I'd say Snap-On but they can actually get hot chicks. From what I hear...you kinda' lack in that department.

Boom.

 

[avbug]

Just when I began to worry that you might actually be older than 14, you come up with proof to the contrary. Right on cue.

 

[LegacyDriver]

And I care what you think avbug because....??????You are one of the biggest internet trolls of all time. You should go see if General Lee needs help wreaking havoc around the Regionals and Majors forums.

 

[avbug]

And I care what you think avbug because....??????

I have no idea. That you continue to dig yourself into a deeper hole by responding is enough, I suppose.

With your expertise that's spouted from various orifices onto the computer screen over the past couple of years, one would guess that you have some element of experinece. Never the less, you're just getting around to getting an ATP...you're a baby, and talk like one, to boot. Little wonder, then, that you find a citation to be a challenge. The slowest, most simple non-piston airplane known to man, short of a hang glider, and you find it a challenge. We can't be expected to show surprise that you have trouble differentiating between terminal procedures and certification regulations, when you're sweating over a SIC checkride in a Citation.

Some recent gems from LegacyDriver...

Nice try. I'm doing an ATP from the right seat.

This, only a few days ago. Just getting to your ATP now? You sound off as though you're experienced...and all this time you've been what? A copilot in the mighty beginner-jet, the legacy? Not even a PIC?

Yeah but if ya get violated cuz u can't find the right switches in a maze of switches, buttons, and dials u won't be flying long. Yikes!This plane needs a flight engineer.

This, for a a SIC checkride in a Citation, where even the circuit breakers are color coded to keep one from making a mistake. The mattel jet confuses you. Amazing...for anyone else. For you? On par.

I got upgraded on CAL just because the agent saw my crew tag on my laptop.

Enjoy yourself. It may be the closest you come to an upgrade anytime soon. This won't hurt, of course, as you'll go right on calling your captain a "copilot."

I helped deliver the first 30 Legacys (Legacies?) that came out.

You did that as a copilot, didn't you?

Fuq me all ya' want.

More intellectual banter. You're a junior rocket scientist, aren't you?

Me? Stupid idiot redneck nobody pilot....I was hamburger after 3 : 20 in the box, having *NEVER* flown a jet before. It was brutal.

This, being commentary you made in July. You lasted three minutes in a simulator before breaking down, you say. Never the less, in the same post, you go on to say that you were pared with far more experienced pilots, in order to keep them on the straight and narrow. If you can't keep yourself straight in a single post, it's no wonder you're all over the map in any given thread, and that most posters spend their time making fun of you, rather than having a conversation with you.

Yep. Newhire F/Os like me, CRJ, and Rum were paired with those guys so they wouldn't kill themselves.

I'm telling you, those guys wouldn't have made it as a 121 F/O. Can't even pass a 91 ride without a *LOT* of help???????????????????????

Please.

Laugh at me all you want. When you catch fire I will talk you through the whole damned thing with a calm voice and I will be nine miles ahead of you *AND* the plane.

Sure enough, from that same thread, we can be absolutely sure you're the greatest thing in aviation since sliced bread, because you're there to tell us so. You're the voice of reason in an an emergency, talking your captain "copilots" through procedures, because you can't last three minutes in a simulator...and both confessions in the same post. Do you try to bury yourself like this, or does it come naturally?

Most of these people don't realize you are teasing me... They really think I can't fly. Now I know why I am not getting jobs.

I'm not sure you really do know. More's the pity.

Demanding pax? Are you f'ing kidding me? Sorry dude, RJ drivers deal with far far far more demanding pax than anyone I've ever seen in either Corporate OR Charter.

I'm sure you learned some very valuable customer service skills as a regional copilot in the ERJ. Skills like how to close the cockpit door, and pour coffee for your captain (the one you call a "copilot"). You've never really dealt with a demanding passenger, have you? Did you just say "dude?" You're really 14 years old then, aren't you?

Whereas about a third of the pure 91 pilots out there couldn't find the fire handle with both hands and a pointer. (Dual engine flameouts, golfballing airplanes after flying under anvils, driving off of taxiways into the grass, missing hold short instructions, not knowing how to de-ice, brain locking on depresses, inability to handle V1 Engine Fires--in the sim--etc. were *ALL* Part 91 guys. I never saw a single 121 pilot flub that up.)

I notice that you threw "in the sim" there. The crucible of your fiery experience. A true wonder, then, that you couldn't save those disasterous pilots from themselves (just how does an airplane get "golf-balled" in a simulator?). Aren't you the one who gets put with experienced pilots to save them? To save us all? Best of the best, and all that? A real work and a wonder? How could anything possibly go wrong when you're near? After all, you're a highly inexperienced copilot who is just reaching that staggering point in one's career when he can go for the ATP. In other words, you're just reaching that magical milestone when you're nearly qualified to open the door to the airplane. Or make the coffee.

Flying between any two points demands two things: SAFETY and STANDARDIZATION. Outside of that I don't care if it is Memphis to Nashville or New York to Kuwait City a 121 crew is at a base-level safer and more highly trained.

Wow...what staggering counsel. Have you ever been to Kuwait? You really, honestly have no idea what it is that you're saying, do you?

27? Sheee-it, dude. You got a lot to learn.

This, coming from the voice of experience? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. You have no experience. You're a kid, yourself (or an adult who speaks with the authority of a 14 year old. Either way, no matter).

Not good to speak ill of the dead but... You had a Captain with a history of failed checkrides that he managed to get by on. The thing that kept him from killing someone sooner was probably the standardization he had in the 121 and good F/Os.

F/O's like you?

How does one "get by on failed checkrides?" Do you think before you type?

"For Love of the Game" is such a great movie.

But he keeps the hot chick at the end.

I lost mine.

And the next one...

And the next one....

And the one after her.....

Shocking. Truly shocking.

My 121 F/O ride was brutal but I thought that was just because it was the first one. For my first 121 F/O Recurrent (more years ago than I care to remember) I went in "prepared" like I thought and nearly failed it.

We know. You've made it abundantly clear. You're deathly afraid of checkrides and the simulator, where you routinely do badly, even though you repeatedly assert that you're there to save experienced captain "copilots" from themselves because after all...you can do it right from both seats. Right?

 

[avbug]

There's more...

Though quite frankly, this "never slip a jet" thing is almost certainly less than entirely accurate. I'm sure there are plenty of jets that would not care if someone did that to them. I mean, let's face it, what would happen if you slipped a straight-wing Citation or Westwind? Probably not a darned thing. The EMB and Soverign don't have a lot of sweep to them. I doubt either would even notice if you slipped 'em a 1000 times.

*shrug*

Just keep on digging that hole. The nice thing about reading vintage LegacyDriver is that he digs his own hole, jumps in with both feet, and then buries himself without any sense of embarrassment. Not only do you save the day for your incompetent captain "copilots," but you're the guy that slips turbojet airplanes. *shrug*

Shee-it grasshopper........when I got hired as a Legacy CA I was making $53K a year and thought I was a god.

You still think you're a god. You're still wrong, too. When you were hired as a captain? A captain that can't last three minutes in a simulator, land in a crosswind. Of course, we know that you tend to use "captain" and "copilot" interchangably. Do you use "god" interchangably with captain and copilot, too?

Simply because you think you're god, doesn't make it so. You understand this, don't you?

If I had gone to the sandbox when I had the chance I'd be a millionaire by now (on an EMB *not* a Falcon, btw).

One thing we do not need in that part of the world is someone who thinks he's a god.

Only problem now is I'm at the point of no return. I can't do anything else (other than f*ck up another marriage, but that's a WHOLE OTHER ISSUE).

At least you have a business on which to fall back, next time you don't make it through a harrowing simulator session. You're probably better off wrecking marriages than wrecking airplanes. You'll take fewer people down with you.

Depends on the jet, jackazz. For Falcons I agree with you. However, dipping a wing if you can is an advantage. Nothing like rolling down a runway in a jet on one main gear like a B-17 at an airshow. BOOYAH!

More smart-talk. At least you think so, as as you're a self-appointed god, then that's good enough, for you. Too bad you never learned to fly properly; it shows.

Have you ever been in a B-17?

I slipped an EMB once when I didn't know any better (I was a total noob). Airplane didn't seem to mind but the Captain was sure to politely inform me that you don't fly a jet that way.

Did you politely inform him that you're a god?

I obviously don't pay attention any more since I will be working at Wal-Mart for the forseeable future any way...

Obviously.

Don't feel bad. People on this board have been trying to wreck my career for ten years...

They shouldn't bother as I'm perfectly capable of destroying my life on my own WITHOUT help. Just make some popcorn and watch.

Makes you wonder why people would spend ten years trying to wreck your career. That's a little like spending ten years trying to step on a paper airplane.

Yes, you're doing an excellent job of burying yourself without any help. Remember that you issued the invitation to come watch.

I'm almost ready to apply at Colgan myself.

Don't get too ambitious. You've got to be able to last four minutes in their simulator.

That's enough for now. You likely need some breathing time to go for that four minute simulator record for your ATP ride, lest you revert to hamburger while playing god for your copilot, when you're not busy wrecking marriages and working at walmart. Good luck. You'll need it.

 

[LJ45]

ouch

 

[LegacyDriver]

As usual, Avthug pulls sh*t out of his a**, twists it, shakes it, and spews garbage.I've had an ATP for over a decade and I'm flying the second fasted Cessna ever not the slowest, dipwad.Any way....Don't confuse outspoken with incompetent. While you are clearly both, some of us at least know how to read and respond in context.Youre just a troll and parlaying with you is a waste of energy. Nobody cares what you think. Based on my inbox my rep is more solid than yours. Scary isn't it?Physician heal thyself. I'm done talking with you. You're not worth my time.

 

[avbug]

Ouch, indeed. But wait, there's more...

I may never get a job in anything bigger than a Cessna 421....

We can only feel sorry for the 15 people you manage to shoe-horn into that 421, then.

I have about six leads on Legacy gigs. If I get one of those I'm in. Otherwise it is either 152s or Home Depot.

It's not as clearcut a decision as it seems, because heaven only knows the damage you might wreak at home depot with bad advice and inexperience. If you do go to work at home depot, you can call yourself an architect, or carpenter, or mason, or any number of other titles you choose to assume, even though you're really a bag boy. Much like referring to your captain as a "copilot," and referring to yourself as a captain.

AMEN! Praise the Lord! I will go where He sends me, even if it is to prison.

How about the rubber room?

I used to think that of my ex-wife because she had a v8gina.... Hmmm.

This was said in response to a poster who said: "If you have a gun, you can rob a bank. If you have a bank, you can rob everyone!" Logic was never your first choice, was it? What is it you'd have said if you didn't hold a college degree, again?

I swear to G** I applied to Home-Depot to work at the store... That's what we're reduced to.

You're really big on the whole home-depot thing. Perhaps a few months in the plumbing section will do you some good. Just don't try to convince anyone that you know what you're talking about, and hopefully nobody will get hurt.

If I can afford the occasional steak and have the kids around that's enough. Of course, $9 an hour won't provide that, but there are always banks to rob I guess.

And now, apparently with the bank robbery, you've come full circle, back to your wife's "v8gina," again. Whatever that means.

Thanks. I would but I'm done with flying as a career. Only for fun now.

Ah, seems like it was only yesterday (May, 2009, actually), that you avowed you were done flying, and the world became a safer place. Sadly, you were never a man of your word.

Sorry. I'm an emotional guy in case you can't tell.

Oh, I can tell. You're a poet, if anything at all.

Just not much of a pilot, it would seem.

I didn't get stuck with a hook, I just ate the bait and burped.

Seems to be an ongoing habit of yours, doesn't it?

I missed my daughter's dental appointment five times in a row I kid you not

And sadly you still suffer from post traumatic stress disorder, as a result. Tragic.

That's the beauty of a twin--your decision is already made for you. Having that third engine can complicate things if you act thinking you've only lost one engine, rotate, and try to fly the V1 Engine Failure Profile without realizing you've really lost two engines...

Most individuals who are flying a multi-engine airplane, be it two engines, three, or four, are smart enough to know when they've experienced an engine failure. Even two engine failures. Clear you, not so much. Why?

This is one that I have always thought would be the ultimate "Oh Shiite!" moment but maybe I haven't considered it enough.

- Max Weight Takeoff Slats + 20 with a Balanced Field
- Airplane hits a flock of geese at V1 and blows two engines out (you pick 'em as it doesn't matter to me)

From what I am repeatedly told there is absolutely no way the airplane will take you any further than the crash site under these conditions.

Is this true? If it isn't true what do you do?

Again, much like the question at the outset of the thread...if you have to ask, perhaps you shouldn't be entrusted with a balsa glider, let alone an airplane that someone can actually sit in.

That explains my upcoming, "Am I a Crossdresser?" post.

The truth finally starts to come out. Stop hiding in the closet.

I didn't have any sort of mental episode whatsoever. I did, however, very seriously contemplate quitting flying altogether.

You've no idea how grateful we can all be to you, for clearing that up.

I'm mouthy--I engage my mouth before my brain somtimes (and I tend to wear my heart on my sleeve).

Indeed

I'm not perfect. I'm a damned good and safe pilot but a highly flawed human being.

The first step is admitting it, isn't it? You were only a damned good pilot, but as we've seen, later went on to declare yourself a god. How can you be god if you're a highly flawed human being.

When yer five-year old daughter watches you get your eyes clawed out because someone downsized you out of a job I'd be amazed if you are half as composed as I was when I had my little meltdown.

Ouch. Eyes clawed out. You're a god, though. You can re-grow them.

Your meltdown doesn't sound very godlike, even for a highly flawed human being.

I thought the same thing until I went to my ex-wife and asked her to cooperate for the sake of our (*hers also she keeps forgetting*) kids and she belted me in the mouth.

Cut her some slack. She was only doing what we'd all like to do.

About me being a giant pansy. Something like that.

You like flowers, or you have a weight problem? Ah, yes. You wear your heart on your sleeve. Now I remember.

Perhaps it is time to retire from message boards. Being a national joke is a cross I am able to bear, but not one I deserve IMHO.

You see yourself as a national joke? If you don't deserve it, who does? In your humble opinion, you say? Didn't you tell us that you're god? Not very humble, really (unless you're actually God, of course). A cross you're able to bear? You nailed yourself to that cross. You feed off the humiliation. A cross to bear? I think not. It's what drives you. You love being a martyr, and take every chance to be one. Like now, for instance.

I felt the need to post this. If it kills my career then I'm at peace with that.

No such luck, unfortunately. You're back.

Besides, everyone thinks I'm a nut. At least now they know why.

Not at all. It's always been obvious.

Long story short my ex-wife beat the living hell out of me in front of my kids... My gf decided to dump me because she thought being linked with me would make her look bad (GO FIGURE, RIGHT GUYS? HAHAHAHAH! *ahem*) even after spending the night with me the night before she bus threw me (or just pretended not to like me any more--that was kinda' weird)

Let's not forget your subsequent confession that your girlfriend is also a cocaine addict. What a charmed life you lead. When a cocaine addict turns you aside because you make her look bad, it's time to stare down that mirror and see just what's wrong.

I've got way thicker skin than any of these rabble rousers can pierce, regardless. *shrug*

We shall see. *shrug*

Well I just got off phone with ----. He said to my banishment query:

"You're not banned--youre *worse* than banned. You can't even login to see you're banned!"

You're actually the only person to ever be banned there, which is quite an accomplishment.

I quit message boards entirely until Rum dragged me into this conversation (the impending death of which I am eagerly anticipating so I can return to self-imposed exile--all these boards do for me is generate stomach acid).

Are you keeping rolaid in business, reliving your own words?

So used to being the one getting bashed that I made a false assumption here perhaps.

Surprise, surprise.

How do you "use them properly" any way? They are brakes. You press on them and they are supposed to stop the plane. It ain't frigging "rocket surgery." Duuhhhhhh.

It's nice to be able to go back a little bit and dig up these technical gems. It's a wonder you fly at all when you could be writing tech manuals. Such wordiness, though. Truly, you're a complex person.

Until this thread came up I stayed out of the line of fire because it always ends up the same way: assaults on my character, skills, and intelligence.

Ever wonder why it always turns out the same, for you? Every wonder why you have the need to keep talking about retiring from the internet, or that the world has spent ten years concentrating on destroying your career? Or why people take pleasure in socking you in the mouth? Do you ever look in the mirror? Answers await you.

Dude, I grew up in South Texas. I didn't land into the wind until I went to the Regionals. Any time, any day, you want to meet for a X-Wind landing competition I'm game. Loser pays a year's salary.

Unless it's in a Falcon, right?

You'll do fine in the Legacy, though. After all, it's your favorite light twin.

Apparently I've won the argument because all you can do to discredit me is cast personal aspersions and innuendo.

And quote you, of course.

Narrow cabin????? You think the Legacy cabin is NARROW???

Painfully so. Yes. Not bad for a light twin, of course, but it's still narrow.

Now I'm gonna' go get my popcorn.

How's it taste so far? Probably just a little bitter.

 

[LegacyDriver]

ouch

Ouch nothing. I've survived far worse than this a**clown. *Yawn* Borrrrrrrring.

 

[avbug]

As usual, Avthug pulls sh*t out of his a**, twists it, shakes it, and spews garbage.

Actually, I quoted you.

I've had an ATP for over a decade and I'm flying the second fasted Cessna ever not the slowest, dipwad.

That's actually funny. It may be the *second* fastest citation, but it's still a citation...and you're still a copilot.

Interesting that after ten years of having an ATP you still can't land in a crosswind, and still fear the simulator, isn't it?

Any way....Don't confuse outspoken with incompetent.

I wouldn't dream of it. You're both.

Nobody cares what you think.

Of course not. This is all about you. That's why your words, verbatim, are in quotes. We all care what you think, and this is a celebration about you. And your violent ex-wife, your god-complex, and your cocaine-addicted girlfriend. And your missed dental appointments. And your disjointed references to your captain as a copilot, and your upcoming or recent ATP checkride...which was now ten years ago, or however you care to spin it this time.

I'm done talking with you. You're not worth my time.

So you keep saying...but you keep on responding, don't you?

I've survived far worse than this a**clown. *Yawn* Borrrrrrrring.

We know. You've had the world at large trying to destroy your career for the last ten years, or so you say. You keep quitting and walking away. But the best part is that you come back again, much like a punching bag that eventually swings back into range. Let's face it, mate. You thrive on abuse. Even if it's simply your own words strangling you to a gutteral rasp.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Yawn.... Wow. You have a bit of an obsession with me. I think u need to seek professional help there, bud. I finally got my own stalker. Perhaps a fan club is next. Speaking of being a pilot, do you even *have* a job? Seems to me all you do is spend time on flightinfo. I've seen your resume' -- not impressed. You pretend to be a lot smarter than you are and deflect from your incompetence by attacking others. Try a new MO. This one is boring.

 

[avbug]

Yawn....

Nope, definitely not a man of your word, are you? Did yo not just say you were done, no more responding, not worth your time? There goes that punching bag dynamic, again. You can't help yourself. Like a cat with string.

I finally got my own stalker.

You do? Where?

Responding to you in your thread makes one a stalker? That's a rather arrogant assumption. Do you feel you're worthy of stalking? You did tell us that you're a god. You also told us that as an inexperienced, wet-behind-the-ears copilot that can't last three minutes in a simulator or land in a crosswind, you're paired with captains to make them look good and save them from themselves...so your wearing your heart on your sleeve goes a little beyond your humble opinion. But then you're god after all, right?

You pretend to be a lot smarter than you are and deflect from your incompetence by attacking others.

Ah, there you go. You haven't been attacked. You've been quoted. The words which have hanged you...are your own. I said nothing about myself; this isn't about me, you see. It's all about you, and a celebration of your words. Legacy Driver, this is your life. You're welcome.

 

[LegacyDriver]

"This message is hidden because avbug is on your ignore list." -- Signal to noise ratio....rising.

 

[avbug]

Look at that. You responded again. You're not only entertaining, but controllable. Give the string a little pull, and you respond, as mindlessly as a cat.

-- Signal to noise ratio....rising.

Indeed it is: in direct proportion to the number of times you are quoted.

 

[CutEmUp]

ouch, indeed. But wait, there's more...



We can only feel sorry for the 15 people you manage to shoe-horn into that 421, then.



It's not as clearcut a decision as it seems, because heaven only knows the damage you might wreak at home depot with bad advice and inexperience. If you do go to work at home depot, you can call yourself an architect, or carpenter, or mason, or any number of other titles you choose to assume, even though you're really a bag boy. Much like referring to your captain as a "copilot," and referring to yourself as a captain.



How about the rubber room?



This was said in response to a poster who said: "if you have a gun, you can rob a bank. If you have a bank, you can rob everyone!" logic was never your first choice, was it? What is it you'd have said if you didn't hold a college degree, again?



You're really big on the whole home-depot thing. Perhaps a few months in the plumbing section will do you some good. Just don't try to convince anyone that you know what you're talking about, and hopefully nobody will get hurt.



And now, apparently with the bank robbery, you've come full circle, back to your wife's "v8gina," again. Whatever that means.



Ah, seems like it was only yesterday (may, 2009, actually), that you avowed you were done flying, and the world became a safer place. Sadly, you were never a man of your word.



Oh, i can tell. You're a poet, if anything at all.

Just not much of a pilot, it would seem.



Seems to be an ongoing habit of yours, doesn't it?



And sadly you still suffer from post traumatic stress disorder, as a result. Tragic.



Most individuals who are flying a multi-engine airplane, be it two engines, three, or four, are smart enough to know when they've experienced an engine failure. Even two engine failures. Clear you, not so much. Why?



Again, much like the question at the outset of the thread...if you have to ask, perhaps you shouldn't be entrusted with a balsa glider, let alone an airplane that someone can actually sit in.



The truth finally starts to come out. Stop hiding in the closet.



You've no idea how grateful we can all be to you, for clearing that up.



Indeed



the first step is admitting it, isn't it? You were only a damned good pilot, but as we've seen, later went on to declare yourself a god. How can you be god if you're a highly flawed human being.



Ouch. Eyes clawed out. You're a god, though. You can re-grow them.

Your meltdown doesn't sound very godlike, even for a highly flawed human being.


Cut her some slack. She was only doing what we'd all like to do.



You like flowers, or you have a weight problem? Ah, yes. You wear your heart on your sleeve. Now i remember.



You see yourself as a national joke? If you don't deserve it, who does? In your humble opinion, you say? Didn't you tell us that you're god? Not very humble, really (unless you're actually god, of course). A cross you're able to bear? You nailed yourself to that cross. You feed off the humiliation. A cross to bear? I think not. It's what drives you. You love being a martyr, and take every chance to be one. Like now, for instance.



No such luck, unfortunately. You're back.



Not at all. It's always been obvious.



Let's not forget your subsequent confession that your girlfriend is also a cocaine addict. What a charmed life you lead. When a cocaine addict turns you aside because you make her look bad, it's time to stare down that mirror and see just what's wrong.



We shall see. *shrug*



you're actually the only person to ever be banned there, which is quite an accomplishment.



Are you keeping rolaid in business, reliving your own words?



Surprise, surprise.



It's nice to be able to go back a little bit and dig up these technical gems. It's a wonder you fly at all when you could be writing tech manuals. Such wordiness, though. Truly, you're a complex person.



Ever wonder why it always turns out the same, for you? Every wonder why you have the need to keep talking about retiring from the internet, or that the world has spent ten years concentrating on destroying your career? Or why people take pleasure in socking you in the mouth? Do you ever look in the mirror? Answers await you.



Unless it's in a falcon, right?

You'll do fine in the legacy, though. After all, it's your favorite light twin.



And quote you, of course.



Painfully so. Yes. Not bad for a light twin, of course, but it's still narrow.



How's it taste so far? Probably just a little bitter.

tldnr

 

[Lear70]

Moderator Reviewed

I'm not going to delete the thread, as it's not a violation of the ToS, but I will say, if it keeps up at this pace, I'm going to move it to non-aviation chat as it's definitely jumped the shark.

/mod

 

[clr4theapch]

Yea.. what he said.... yall don't want me getting to this first anymore.. Lear is much easier than I am..

 

[75 Driver]

"This message is hidden because avbug is on your ignore list." -- Signal to noise ratio....rising.

I can not believe I read the whole thread, raining in Germany today. You've been spanked and found wanting, walk away from the keyboard.