Out of flying for a bit, what to do when airlines start hiring again?

[Rally]

Hi All,

I have been out of flying due to a illness for the past 4 years or so and haven't done any flying for the last year or so except for with the FAA in heavy jet simulators. I'm not sure how you would rate me in terms of time but I have around 2500 TT around 300 ME and an ATP-CFI-II MEI and a little previous 135 experience. When the airlines do start hiring again what do I need to do? Will just be current be good enough? Or do I have to go out and fly a bunch? As much as it might make my eyes bleed would one of those regional jet courses at ATP be worth it?

Any ideas?

 

[Uncle Bunkle]

Go to Law School.

 

[Rally]

Trust me, I'm thinking about it.

 

[CX880]

Hi All,

I have been out of flying due to a illness for the past 4 years or so and haven't done any flying for the last year or so except for with the FAA in heavy jet simulators. I'm not sure how you would rate me in terms of time but I have around 2500 TT around 300 ME and an ATP-CFI-II MEI and a little previous 135 experience. When the airlines do start hiring again what do I need to do? Will just be current be good enough? Or do I have to go out and fly a bunch? As much as it might make my eyes bleed would one of those regional jet courses at ATP be worth it?

Any ideas?

I dont know if this is a serious question but if I was you, I would hold off on getting current untill there is hiring and the industry has improved. You are definitely approaching the "over qualified" territory for regionals, you might have a chance with Compass but they want at least 500 to 1000 multi.

 

[Rally]

Yes it was a serious question. Yea I had the feeling of not really spending a bunch of money to get current until hiring started again when ever that may be. Didn't think I was overqualified though.

 

[PoorJetDriver]

Given the current climate I don't know how you could be overqualified. However, as someone else said maybe you should check your other options outside this screwed up industry.

 

[Rally]

I don't think anybody likes there "industry". Last time I went in to see my ENT all he did was complain about how the medical profession sucked. But I catch your drift.

 

[Carl_Spackler]

Go to Law School.

Just as long as you understand that the law profession is like the piloting profession. There are a few that make a lot of money and a bunch that are either middle income or just making it by.

If you want to change careers, have income potential, job security, and a pretty good schedule, go to nursing school. If you want to go in the law profession, prepare yourself for the fact that you might me advertising your $99 divorce special on a bus stop bench.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

Hi All,

I have been out of flying due to a illness for the past 4 years or so and haven't done any flying for the last year or so except for with the FAA in heavy jet simulators. I'm not sure how you would rate me in terms of time but I have around 2500 TT around 300 ME and an ATP-CFI-II MEI and a little previous 135 experience. When the airlines do start hiring again what do I need to do? Will just be current be good enough? Or do I have to go out and fly a bunch? As much as it might make my eyes bleed would one of those regional jet courses at ATP be worth it?

Any ideas?

Eagle is hiring now, and Pinnacle will likely start up this year. ASA won't be hiring any time soon, assuming that there aren't major changes with United.

I know for us (ASA), you would be expected to be current with at least 50 hours in the last 6 months. I also highly doubt you would get an interview without being employed in an aviation job in the recent past. Renting an airplane for 50 hours probably wouldn't cut it.

Of course, that is all assuming that we are hiring from the current pool of applicants, a lot of whom are furloughed or otherwise very experienced. Give it 2 years or so and you'll be able to get a job at most any regional with your current stats plus a little currency. The ball is going to be in the pilot's court once people start retiring.

 

[rumrnr78]

Rally- What are you doing to put food on the table now? Give us some more background so we can figure out some options for you.

Back around 2004 I tried to get a former student on at ASA. He was flying the ditch in Las Vegas but gave that up to make more money driving a limo. The hiring lady (forget her name but she was a line captain) said not only that he had to be current but she wouldn't consider him unless that current time came from a 135, 121 type operation. I know ASA is not hiring with folks on the street and this is old information but you might consider a 135 operator to fill in the gap.

Gives us some more details so the FI brain-trust can help you!

Cheers- Rum

Good luck

 

[Future Furlough]

Hi All,

I have been out of flying due to a illness for the past 4 years or so and haven't done any flying for the last year or so except for with the FAA in heavy jet simulators. I'm not sure how you would rate me in terms of time but I have around 2500 TT around 300 ME and an ATP-CFI-II MEI and a little previous 135 experience. When the airlines do start hiring again what do I need to do? Will just be current be good enough? Or do I have to go out and fly a bunch? As much as it might make my eyes bleed would one of those regional jet courses at ATP be worth it?

Any ideas?

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123969&page=56

 

[Rally]

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123969&page=56

So what exactly are you saying? Is this a good thing for me?

 

[gringo]

The other thread is simply a countdown until the "Age 65" rule really goes into effect.

Meaning, all the Age 60 guys who were about to retire when the rule was passed suddenly had 5 more years, which basically stopped the attrition by retirement.

The theory is that in 972, er, 971 days, these cats will hit Age 65, and the attrition will continue as it has in previous years.

I believe this is the "major hiring boom" I've been hearing about for the last 15 years.

Hang in there. If you want your wings back you'll figure out how to get them.

 

[pilotyip]

hiring boom coming in 2012, it is already starting to ramp up, apply everywhere, take the first job you get, even if it towing banners at your local airport. Then start looking for your next job, do not make QOL of life an issue in a job offer until you have 1000 hours of TJ PIC. Good luck, there are more bad lawyers than bad pilots, because the darwin effect keeps the bad pilot ranks low.

 

[rumrnr78]

I remember when I crossed 1000 Turbine PIC back in 2004 and my phone started ringing off the hook! Actually, that's not what happened. All I got to do was check a box (and yes I have a 4 year degree).

The first wave is not gonna cause a hiring boom. Why would the majors grow when they can feed at a lower cost? Do not base your future on age 65 guys hitting the street. And to the corporate guys, watch out, they will most likely take corporate jobs cause they "love" flying so much.

Rally- post your stats so we can give you better advice.

Cheers-

 

[johnpeace]

What to do when airlines start hiring again? Are you serious!?

Run away?

And to the corporate guys, watch out, they will most likely take corporate jobs cause they "love" flying so much.

They do! They love it so much they'll do it for less than half of industry average...and since they already have benefits through their retirement package, they don't need those either.

I knew those guys while I was teaching at the local airport and they actually used to hold up their job (on call ALL the time, managing the airplane/hangar, 'other duties' out the wazoo, etc) and say, 'just keep plugging away and one day you'll be able to land a gig like this'.

Um, WTF?

 

[ASA_Aviator]

What to do when airlines start hiring again? Are you serious!?

Run away?

If you hate aviation so much, leave the industry. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

 

[CX880]

If you hate aviation so much, leave the industry. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Lay off the ASA crack.

 

[Airscrew]

Apply to Colgan my man. Sh!t, this b!tch be hiring right now.

 

[beagle pilot]

Given the current climate I don't know how you could be overqualified.

Agreed about overqualified. While my airline appears to be leery of hiring furloughed pilots who have a good chance of recall in the next year or two, they do look for the best qualified applicants in terms of experience, maturity and flight qualifications.

Regarding the topic question, there previous comments about airline retirements are good ones. Another factor is the economy. Once it picks up those pilots now who are dissatisfied with their airline career will have more opportunities to pursue business positions outside of the airline industry. In this respect, I expect to see more regional airlines hiring either later this year or in the beginning of 2011.

 

[johnpeace]

If you hate aviation so much, leave the industry. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

I don't hate 'aviation', I just recognize the fact that there are better places to make career investments.

Aviation is a poor career choice for most people.

I have too much invested to leave...but my advice to others is to not come this way.

I'll probably have more positive feelings after being recalled and seeing my airline running classes every week and moving up the ladder. Right now though, I'm pretty disgusted with the whole thing.

 

[no1pilot2000]

Ramp,
Pilotyip has good advice. Apply to all those places that are hiring. If you prefer to work for a regional airline, American Eagle, Air Wisconsin, Colgan Air, and Commutair are some options you may wat to consider. Do some networking if you can. Some people on this web site love to dissect this industry and there's no reason to. If flying is something you want to do for a living, despite its up and downs, then pursue your flying goals.

Have a nice day!

 

[pilotyip]

1500 hrs?

I don't hate 'aviation', I just recognize the fact that there are better places to make career investments.

Aviation is a poor career choice for most people.

I have too much invested to leave...but my advice to others is to not come this way.

I'll probably have more positive feelings after being recalled and seeing my airline running classes every week and moving up the ladder. Right now though, I'm pretty disgusted with the whole thing.

That an investment? It is just a start, when you have 10K, and you are unemployed at age 50, that is an investment. It is still a great way to make a living. I got out for five years. Came back because it beats working for a living.

 

[rumrnr78]

Ramp,
Pilotyip has good advice. Apply to all those places that are hiring. If you prefer to work for a regional airline, American Eagle, Air Wisconsin, Colgan Air, and Commutair are some options you may wat to consider. Do some networking if you can. Some people on this web site love to dissect this industry and there's no reason to. If flying is something you want to do for a living, despite its up and downs, then pursue your flying goals.

Have a nice day!

I want to write this respecfully, so please no offense. Based on your profile you have no skin in the game. It all seems like a fun dream in your 20's but into your later 30's and 40's and you realize your mortality and retirement it can be a dreadful nightmare.

I hear all the stories about "flying is the dream". Try 45k gross before taxes and everything else, married with 2 kids and living in a crashpad.

I don't have kids but have lived that story in the past. It is no dream.

Best of luck in your training...

 

[pilotyip]

Great time

Nope have to disagree, this is a great time to get into flying. To be ready for the next big hiring push that has already started. Much like the posts from 2002 of "Run away from this business there is no future", it was followed by a hiring boom starting 2005. The same thing is going on today. Those who got jobs in 2005 were the one who were current and flying at the time, almost without exception they all kept there jobs in the 2009 layoff cycle. Those who elected to get into the game late when they saw the hiring going up, got hired in 2007/08, they most likely lost their jobs in the last down trend. Get in now in the start of the cycle.

 

[CX880]

Nope have to disagree, this is a great time to get into flying. To be ready for the next big hiring push that has already started. Much like the posts from 2002 of "Run away from this business there is no future", it was followed by a hiring boom starting 2005. The same thing is going on today. Those who got jobs in 2005 were the one who were current and flying at the time, almost without exception they all kept there jobs in the 2009 layoff cycle. Those who elected to get into the game late when they saw the hiring going up, got hired in 2007/08, they most likely lost their jobs in the last down trend. Get in now in the start of the cycle.

But the purpose is to warn people of this business you are just talking about the employment aspect of it. It's like saying in 2002 drug dealing was slow and grim, but in 2005 business went up again and those that got on got rich in 2009 while those that got in later were furloughed in 2009. The point of is this job has no future, pursue something else. Ask any major pilot out there 99% would tell you the same.

 

[no1pilot2000]

Rummr78,

No offense taken. If Ramp wants to consider flying for a regional airline, good luck. If, after reading these comments, Ramp decides not to pursue a regional airline pilot job, so be it.

 

[CUBMAN]

Pilotyip check your PM.

 

[BushwickBill]

Rally- What are you doing to put food on the table now? Give us some more background so we can figure out some options for you.

Back around 2004 I tried to get a former student on at ASA. He was flying the ditch in Las Vegas but gave that up to make more money driving a limo. The hiring lady (forget her name but she was a line captain) said not only that he had to be current but she wouldn't consider him unless that current time came from a 135, 121 type operation. I know ASA is not hiring with folks on the street and this is old information but you might consider a 135 operator to fill in the gap.

Gives us some more details so the FI brain-trust can help you!

Cheers- Rum

Good luck

Oh yeah just find some 135 to fill in the gap so you can get hired by an airline.

Great.

Thank god there are barely any 135 operators hiring. They certainly shouldn't hire some airline hopeful only to have him leave after he gets 50 hours.

Our indoc class is 40 hours long. It wont cost much to put him in the seat of a king air but it is still a huge waste for 135 operators to hire people like that.

Then what? Now your going to be sitting in the right seat of a king air. Any other position your looking at a huge cost for training.

 

[gringo]

The way I see it, you basically got two choices-

1) Whatever you did to get your first 121 job, do it again. Meaning, CFI, banner tow, etc etc. Look into ferrying aircraft- I understand there's a lot of it to be done from Hawaii to the mainland. Never did it myself, but I know a few guys who did and it seemed like a fun (if not a bit scary) way to stay current.

2) Network, network, network. Then network some more. I know a guy who's been out of the cockpit for about 4 years, save for a little bit of CFI'ing. Networked his way into the right seat of a widebody. Zero 121/135 time in years, and maybe 50 hours in a Cessna.

Call up everyone you ever flew with; you never know where they are now, and if they might be in a position to help you. And I mean everyone. Old CFI buddies you worked with years ago; they might be captains at the regional you're trying to get on. Old crashpadders you roomed with; they might be working at an airline you've been looking at. Captains and First Officers from your last airline... the list goes on. You never know where they are and what position they might be in to help you out.

Either way, if you really want back in, you'll figure out how to get there.