UAL/CAL Merger Buzz Article......(Again)

[BILL LUMBERG]

According to SCordleAB of AirlineForecasts”

Is he really?? That explains his anti-union tilt on every pile of $hit he spews for the papers.

 

[whatitdoing?]

I think this merger will go down this year. It just depends if Delta can turn a profit and start kicking our arses. If they do, then a merger announcement will happen shortly thereafter. But, if we can do a virtual merger....which they're doing right now.....and make a steady profit, a merger will never happen. The only thing that will happen is a whipsaw against both pilot groups. This is where we need to concentrate our efforts, not how we're going to get what's "ours". United pilots need to get ahold of their scope and we need to concentrate on DRASTIC changes in our contract. And if a merger does goes down, we need to all work together to improve this career for both pilot groups.

 

[Yuppyguppy]

It appears today that UAL is making a leap to a 52 week high in stock price due to a recovery cited in all of the business markets it serves. I would think the new Delta will be making a profit very soon with it's market exposure at least twice that of UAL. My guess is a merger is on the way soon too. Either way good luck to all. In the end a merged company done the right way (if and only if) will be much more stable and give mainline pilots the appropriate pay, security and retirement. We must end the outsourcing! That's why I like CAL scope.

 

[General Lee]

I think this merger will go down this year. It just depends if Delta can turn a profit and start kicking our arses. If they do, then a merger announcement will happen shortly thereafter. But, if we can do a virtual merger....which they're doing right now.....and make a steady profit, a merger will never happen. The only thing that will happen is a whipsaw against both pilot groups. This is where we need to concentrate our efforts, not how we're going to get what's "ours". United pilots need to get ahold of their scope and we need to concentrate on DRASTIC changes in our contract. And if a merger does goes down, we need to all work together to improve this career for both pilot groups.

Delta is a profitable company operationally, but the large loss stems from the oil hedging that went wrong. That cost a bundle. The merger has been very successful so far, and DL is starting to move planes around to maximize profit potential. Take away the hedges loss, and it would have been all positive numbers. That certainly wasn't a merger related problem, rather one guy rolling the dice it seems.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[RedDogC130]

deleted

 

[motch]

It will take more than 1 quarters positive financial results before the merger frenzy begins.
Yes, I believe that once Delta shows a full year's profit, the merger talks will really go full bore.
The fact that CAL and UAL's operations are being co-located in many locations will only help the process.
But again, if an understanding between the two pilot groups isn't negotiated beforehand.. this merger won't work.

If the time comes where-
CAL management wants the merger,
UAL management wants the merger, and..
UAL Pilots was the merger, but
CAL Pilots do not want to merger-

You will see a media blitz where the USAir/AmericaWest merger is brought up, over and over again.

How much money are they making? How many jobs have been lost? How much return have the investors gotten on that deal?

Always
motch

PS> Beside the 2 pilot groups coming to an understanding, there has to be a new contract in hand for CAL pilots AND an incentive package ala Delta..

 

[General Lee]

deleted

AirTran CEO Bob Fornaro told the Atlanta Journal-Constitution Tuesday that the discount carrier has lost flights and customers to a “much stronger” Delta during the past several years.

“Today, Delta is much stronger than the Delta we saw four or five years ago,” the AirTran exec said during the J.P. Morgan Aviation, Transportation & Defense Conference in New York. “They’ve been able to ultimately take back customers that we actually borrowed for a couple of years. They are a tough competitor.”

Fornaro said AirTran has reduced the number of flights it operates from Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport, its largest hub, by more than 20%, from a high of 260 in 2008 to about 200 today.

“We were able to gain a lot of leisure and business travel from Delta,” in the years following the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, which helped AirTran post strong profits in 2007, Fornaro told the AJC.

He credited Delta’s successful emergence from bankruptcy in 2007 and the 2008 merger as reasons for Delta’s resurgence.



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[whatitdoing?]

Delta is a profitable company operationally, but the large loss stems from the oil hedging that went wrong. That cost a bundle. The merger has been very successful so far, and DL is starting to move planes around to maximize profit potential. Take away the hedges loss, and it would have been all positive numbers. That certainly wasn't a merger related problem, rather one guy rolling the dice it seems.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Sorry General, just saying what our CEO has been saying in the press. As far as the merger goes, you couldn't be more correct. Your merger was well planned and everyone seems to be onboard. Hopefully we'll see the same results. I won't hold my breath....dynamics are way different.

 

[General Lee]

Sorry General, just saying what our CEO has been saying in the press. As far as the merger goes, you couldn't be more correct. Your merger was well planned and everyone seems to be onboard. Hopefully we'll see the same results. I won't hold my breath....dynamics are way different.

Your CEO is getting a bit "cocky" in the press IMO (look at below article), but I am sure they are thinking about a UAL tie up. If they want it to go smoother than the USAir deal, they will give you a joint contract with big improvements before the SLI.



UPDATE 1-Continental CEO: We're 'big threat' to Delta

Tue Mar 9, 2010 12:38pm EST

* CEO says will watch "competitive dynamics" of industry

* Says Continental will "bulk up defensively" if needed
* Says it is "premature" to gauge success of Delta merger

NEW YORK, March 9 (Reuters) - Continental Airlines said its strength in Latin America, Asia and New York poses a "big threat" to its larger rival and former alliance partner Delta Air Lines.

Continental, the world's fifth-largest airline, was part of Delta's SkyTeam alliance until last October, when it quit the airline network following Delta's merger with Northwest, which formed the world's largest carrier.
"In our prior alliance, we were partners with somebody who wanted to kill us," Chief Executive Jeff Smisek said at a J.P Morgan conference on Tuesday. "And it was a lot like being married to a woman who wants to poison your food -- it's just generally not a good idea."


Alliances allow airlines to share pricing and flight information, as well as save on costs. Smisek said Continental's switch to Star Alliance was helping to drive passenger traffiic.


He added that Continental's operations in New York, Asia and Latin America were a looming threat to Delta's network.
"We're a growing threat to them in the Pacific," Smisek said. "You watch the fight over JAL and they were taking out their checkbook and spinning like drunken sailors."Delta ultimately lost its bid to fold JAL into SkyTeam to AMR Corp's American Airlines.

Continental's switch also brought it closer to United Airlines parent UAL Corp, which is a founding member of the Star Alliance. The two talked extensively about merging until talks broke off two years ago.
Continental has said it would prefer to stay independent, rather than merge with another airline. Smisek said the airline would continue to watch "the competitive dynamics" of the industry in the wake of Delta's merger with Northwest Airlines. He added that the merger so far has gone smoothly, although it is "premature" to gauge its success.

"When we chose not to merge with United, it was a point in time decision," Smisek said, adding that he voted against the merger at the time. "If we think it's in our best interest to bulk up defensively, we'll do so," Smisek said. "But I think it's premature to make that decision at this time." (Reporting by Deepa Seetharaman; editing by Gunna Dickson)



Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Captain X]

I will be right there doing anything I can to get ALPA out of here if they screw us...with our contract.

I get a good laugh out of guys that seem to believe there is some mysterious and grand ALPA cabal or illuminati or some collusive force at work that has control over a given pilot group.

The outcome of the CAL contract is ENTIRELY, 100% up to you, me, and the other 4600 of us.

I am ALPA. You are ALPA. We are "they."

The only screwing will be what we do to ourselves.

It was EXACTLY the same way with the IACP. It will be EXACTLY the same way with any other union. If the pilot group doesn't keep the ship upright, it don't matter what letters our union has.

For C'02 the ALPA resources were simply not used the way they should have been. The pilot group was disorganized, fractionalized and plagued with infighting, political wrangling and a level of arrogance. There were groups that tried in vain to utilize National resources and they were rebuffed, not by ALPA National, but rather by members of their own MEC and NC. To that end, the resources at National simply threw up their hands, because there was no saving the pilot group unless it did so itself. In the end, the pilot group capitulated to a wave of fear that was propogated by certain MEC and NC members who will try their darndest to blame it on "ALPA National" or tell you that we got a "great deal."

At the end of the day, it was the NC who tentatively agreed to the deal, the MEC who authorized it to go to the pilots for ratification, and 58% of the pilot group that got us where we are today.

And one more thing...if we continue the "tear the house down and rebuild" M.O. that CAL pilots have followed for the last 10+ years, we will get NOWHERE.

 

[Continental]

Anyone listen to the Smisek/Rowe JP Morgan conference call. They say Cal is at a disadvantage by not having 70 seaters due to scope. Having 70 seaters flown by mainline pilots isn't an option because the economics flip over if that happens. Also they are in negotiations with the pilots about the scope.

Link ....(26-27 min mark)

Cal guys/girls we must not give up on scope. F the A++ and the A+++. Let em merge if they want it. FUPM!

Email your reps and let them know.

 

[motch]

Continental and Captain X-

Great Posts!

As you said, We are ALPA and We (at least most of the guys and gals I've spoken with) are not going to fold on EITHER Scope issues!

FUPM
Shut it Down~

Always
Motch

 

[densoo]

I get a good laugh out of guys that seem to believe there is some mysterious and grand ALPA cabal or illuminati or some collusive force at work that has control over a given pilot group....The outcome of the CAL contract is ENTIRELY, 100% up to you, me, and the other 4600 of us....I am ALPA. You are ALPA. We are "they."

The only screwing will be what we do to ourselves.

It was EXACTLY the same way with the IACP. It will be EXACTLY the same way with any other union. If the pilot group doesn't keep the ship upright, it don't matter what letters our union has.....And one more thing...if we continue the "tear the house down and rebuild" M.O. that CAL pilots have followed for the last 10+ years, we will get NOWHERE.

That pretty much sums it up. I think the union leadershp is light years ahead C02, but the pilot group hasn't budged. Monthly awards have massive amounts of non-flying credit waived, open time pickup is unabated, and the planes are on time. Hey, it's number one in employee satisfaction.

And, oh, submit your comments here to get the octopus off your face:
http://www.regulations.gov/search/Regs/home.html#submitComment?R=0900006480a41a09

We can get it done!

 

[whatitdoing?]

Your CEO is getting a bit "cocky" in the press IMO (look at below article), but I am sure they are thinking about a UAL tie up. If they want it to go smoother than the USAir deal, they will give you a joint contract with big improvements before the SLI.


Ahhh, which CEO isn't though. You don't think Anderson goes home and smirks at his greatness? Please. Granted, you're talking about CEO's, but you don't think Delta as an airline isn't cocky? I see so many billboards and commercials about the "World's Biggest Airline". "The World's Largest Premier Airline". So what's gonna happen if we merge and we become the biggest? Man, I'm concerned. What will the Deltoids do? The horror.....

 

[Ben Franklin]

The outcome of the CAL contract is ENTIRELY, 100% up to you, me, and the other 4600 of us.

So, it's really only 0.021739% up to me?

I've been trying too hard again, I see.



Sincerely,

B. Franklin