Go to ATI or stay at the regionals?

[CRJ Pilot]

As PHXFLYR said, think long and hard about leaving Comair for ATI if you have a wife and especially if you have kids at home. I left a regional for one of ATI's competitors, and yes the paycheck's a lot better and it's fun to see the world, but I still have not gotten used to being gone for 15 days or more at a time. I don't know if you're a family man or not, if you are the schedule at ATI could be a HUGE negative.

Anyways, good luck to you in making your decision.

 

[eyeamthechosen1]

What are your career goals? That would be my first question. You are obviously not happy at Comair. Were you happy before the economy tanked? Are you just bored?

 

[Midnight Flyer]

As PHXFLYR said, think long and hard about leaving Comair for ATI if you have a wife and especially if you have kids at home. I left a regional for one of ATI's competitors, and yes the paycheck's a lot better and it's fun to see the world, but I still have not gotten used to being gone for 15 days or more at a time. I don't know if you're a family man or not, if you are the schedule at ATI could be a HUGE negative.

Anyways, good luck to you in making your decision.

I have a different opinion. I fly for an airline with a schedule similar to that of ATI. IMO, the best schedule is the 2 weeks on, 2 weeks off (give or take a day or two since the months are not all 30 days).
For example, my father flew for the airlines, and while growing up, I can remember he was always walking out the door to fly. 3-4 day trips all the time. At least when you're home for 2 weeks, you can get on your kids schedule, and be able to take them to school and pick them up and be home to tuck them into bed. You're home at least two entire weekends a month. Planning events is easy. You can get large projects done at home. I only go to work literally 12 times a year. I sell my vacation days back to the company for $ because I have a 2 week or more "vacation" every month. Remember, wherever you are for the weekends, you can usually jumpseat home on Friday mornings and jumpseat back out to your weekend layover city on Monday morning. Many times, I've only been out 8 or 9 days a month.
It works for me and my family. I would go nuts knowing that I had the remaining 20 years of my flying career having to go to work every 3-4 days.

 

[FO 4 Life]

I agree. I went from week on/week off at a freight company to the airlines where it was either 3/4 on then the opposite off. I'm now back to where I can do 1 or 2 week trips. Much better schedule especially if you're a commuter. To each their own.

 

[N813CA]

I am/was happy at Comair. A year a go I was going to upgrade to captain and make a living. Now I am on the bottom and on reserve as an FO with 400 pilots on the street. I do have a family. I have an almost 4 month old at home. I have an interview coming up. I haven't been offered a job. I just don't want to burn any bridges if I were to turn down a job (If I was offered one). I really wanted your opinon and I have learned a lot from what you have told me.

 

[countbat]

My friend stay at Comair. You will make captain faster than ATI, which is not that cool anyway. Look at their history. It seems they always furlough in spring and you don't want that. A high tech aircraft when airlines will start hiring sounds much better than a DC-8. It might be a cool aircraft but still, it is an antique. In 2-3 years things gets better, maybe you will get some captain time - much faster at comair than ati- and being young you will get that dream job at a major. Plus you know anybody at Comair, you are familiar with schedule, maybe you get the chedule you want. At ATI you run into old, fat full of DC-8 crap Captains which will give you even more crap. You will be a FNG, nobody gives a darn about, for a long period time. Maybe for ever. I have a feeling all the captains at ATI have at least 10-15 years with the company and maybe many FOs have as much too. Maybe they have some new FOs for 1-2 years but that must be pretty much all of the new guys. If you have a job hold on it. The same way you have been living for the last 9 years, you could make an extra effort and wait for another 2-3 years and make a better chiuce for many years to come. You have time to wait. ATI is much more of a seasonal job. You don't need more FO time in bigger and older equipment. You need captain time. Good luck

 

[b707guy]

At ATI you run into old, fat full of DC-8 crap Captains which will give you even more crap. You will be a FNG, nobody gives a darn about, for a long period time.

Wow. Which one of us old, fat full of DC-8 crap Captains took a dump in your corn flakes? You remind me of a Libertarian candidate who sounds great right up the day before election when he lays out some stink bomb of asinine paranoid rhetoric which reveals his true colors. And with the exception of a few self serving FNG induhviduals, we care greatly about our NGs (notice the lack of an "F" in front of that). Plus, it's very likely you'll be either assigned or offered a 767 seat. So much for cool, but dated equipment. Everything else you said is reasonable, including your assessment of our seniority in seat. So WTF?

N813CA, you've got a tough choice ahead, and perhaps the worst part of it (at least for me it would be) is going into an interview uncertain that you want the job given that you have one that you like. "What if I get it?" Seniority and longevity go a long way in this industry as you well know. Our furlough history has very little or nothing to do with season. It has to do with business, or lack thereof. We've had promising contracts that fell through after hiring was done. We've had a massive drop in the past 10 years of military work. That's typical of a Republican power structure. Conversely, we've seen more military work in the last year under our current rule, such as it is. That statement is contrary to my personal political convictions, but it's the way it is in this segment of the industry. Right now, there are so many interdependent conditions and variables governing our future. A move here would be a crap shoot that pays off hugely in a few years, or it could be a bust. My advice would be go to the interview. If you're turned down, your decision is made for you. If you are offered a job, more info may be available to you to call the shot. Good luck!

 

[ABXbooger]

Leave Comair.

The pro's:

1. international heavy time: the only jobs out there right now are for guys with int'l heavy experience which you won't get at Comair. Plus the experience of being all over the world, you will never want for another "tell me about a time when..." story.
2. you are advancing your career: Comair is a decent place to work (at least it was when I was there '96-2000) and the CRJ is a great plane, but the 767 and even the DC-8 will make you a better (read more employable) then the CRJ
3. the current stagnation at the regionals has made an ever deepening pool of very qualified crj and erj drivers. when the hiring boom starts again, you will basically be at the back of the line with no pic time against guys with thousands of hours of jet pic. this after all the guys on furlough with heavy jet and pic time get their jobs.

The cons:

• the schedules: look at it this way...you will be gone for half of your kids life/marriage/free time. As a father of 3 (all girls, yeah I know...) I can tell you that flying is great but it is family that you should be working for. This is so different from person to person, but you probably have no idea how hard it is to be gone from your family for 2-3 weeks or more at a time.
• you will be in the ACMI world. do your homework and look closely at the companies that make up this segment. I am a student of history and if you look back over the course of this industry, you will see some trends and patterns that can lead to some crappy consequences for the employees. All I can say is "Caveat emptor".
• you will be working for the ATSG "family" of companies. Do your homework and see what this means.

This is all based on my experience over the last 18 years. I am now permanently out of aviation as a career and have bought in as a partner in a (hopefully) successful business. Good luck! You probably will not know you made the right or wrong decision for a very long time.

 

[fob727]

Booger,

Good post and good luck with your new career.

 

[waka]

I think you know the answer to that question. Granted, you'll be flying steam gages again however you'll probably see more light at the end of the tunnel at ATI. Plus it's a change of venue, something new to wrap your head around.
Good Luck in whichever you chose.

Go to ATI and don't look back! You might be on the DC-8 for a bit, but they are going away soon, and its glass after that. You'll see the world, get some realy good experience, have a lot of fun; Or, you can stay at wherever and go back and forth to cleveland, then to harrisburg, then back to cleveland, ad nausuem

Both you act like that flying steam gauges is a negative factor. If it comes down to glass vs steam, I'd much rather fly a steamship DC-8 than a latest technology soulless RJ any day. There's nothing wrong with steam gauges! Modern pilots these days!

 

[WabiSabi]

Both you act like that flying steam gauges is a negative factor. If it comes down to glass vs steam, I'd much rather fly a steamship DC-8 than a latest technology soulless RJ any day. There's nothing wrong with steam gauges! Modern pilots these days!

Agreed. I'd even rather retire flying a DC-8 than some RJ loaded with bells and whistles. Besides, you will have bigger cajones!

 

[b707guy]

This is all based on my experience over the last 18 years. I am now permanently out of aviation as a career and have bought in as a partner in a (hopefully) successful business. Good luck! You probably will not know you made the right or wrong decision for a very long time.

All good points, boog. The one thing I'll add regarding our schedule is there are only a few lines which have people away from home two weeks at a time. Almost anyone near the bottom of the bid list can get a reserve line that goes 8 on 6 off.

 

[nitefr8dog]

Both you act like that flying steam gauges is a negative factor. If it comes down to glass vs steam, I'd much rather fly a steamship DC-8 than a latest technology soulless RJ any day. There's nothing wrong with steam gauges! Modern pilots these days!

That is what I thought up until I logged about 300 hrs in the 767. I flew the DC9 for 13 years as FO, Capt. and ioe instructor (sat through alot of crappy landings) I loved the 9 and hated the "glass" for about 300 hours. Now it is fantastic, everything is better not just the glass. The new aircraft are quiet, cool in the summer warm in the winter and it is a blast to fly! Just my 2 thoughts.

 

[skyhookd]

Is Matt M still the CP at ATI?

 

[pilotpm]

Is Matt M still the CP at ATI?

Yes he is.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

SHOULD I STAY OR SHOULD I GO

Oh yeeeeeaaaaah

Wooh!

Darling you got to let me know
Should I stay or should I go?
If you say that you are mine
I’ll be here ’til the end of time
So you got to let me know
Should I stay or should I go?

Always tease tease tease
You’re happy when I’m on my knees
One day is fine, next day is black
So if you want me off your back
Well come on and let me know
Should I stay or should I go?

Should I stay or should I go now?
Should I stay or should I go now?
If I go there will be trouble
An’ if I stay it will be double
So come on and let me know!

This indecision’s bugging me
Esta indecision me molesta
If you don’t want me, set me free
Si no me quieres, librame
Exactly who’m I’m supposed to be
Dime que tengo que ser
Don’t you know which clothes even fit me?
¿sabes que ropas me quedan?
Come on and let me know
Me tienes que decir
Should I cool it or should I blow?
¿me debo ir o quedarme?

Split!
Yo me enfrio o lo sufro

Should I stay or should I go now?
yo me enfrio o lo sufro
Should I stay or should I go now?
yo me enfrio o lo sufro
If I go there will be trouble
Si me voy - va a haber peligro
And if I stay it will be double
Si me quedo es doble
So you gotta let me know
Pero me tienes que decir
Should I cool it or should I go?
yo me enfrio o lo sufro

Should I stay or should I go now?
yo me enfrio o lo sufro
If I go there will be trouble
Si me voy - va a haber peligro
And if I stay it will be double
Si me quedo es doble
So you gotta let me know
Pero me tienes que decir
Should I stay or should I go?

 

[reepicheep]

N813CA, remember that 500 hrs. PIC in an RJ will be worth more than 5000 hours in the right seat of a heavy. You need to take whatever steps will put you in the left seat the soonest. It will pay off when hiring starts again.

 

[ABXbooger]

I agree, Reep. But, as I mentioned previously, there are a lot of guys at the regionals in the left seat now and have been for quite some time. 500 hours PIC isn't gonna mean squat when the average CA has thousands.

Yes, PIC time is important, but I would argue that quality 767 or DC-8 international time is almost as important, even if it is SIC.

 

[nitefr8dog]

I agree, Reep. But, as I mentioned previously, there are a lot of guys at the regionals in the left seat now and have been for quite some time. 500 hours PIC isn't gonna mean squat when the average CA has thousands.

Yes, PIC time is important, but I would argue that quality 767 or DC-8 international time is almost as important, even if it is SIC.

Take the 500 to 1000 hrs pic turbine. You cannot even interview at Virgin without 1000 hrs pic turbine. All that for 36k at a start up.

 

[Lynxman]

Agreed. I'd even rather retire flying a DC-8 than some RJ loaded with bells and whistles. Besides, you will have bigger cajones!

Steam>Glass anyday