W.Times editorial: Obama secretly ends FFDO program?

[clippyrip]

Why would terrorists go through the hassle of airport security when they could walk onto a number of Greyhound buses without any resistance and blow them up?

 

[Tristar]

Why? Because a bus wreck makes the news after the second or third commercial, and is usually never heard of again. An airplane - that gets replayed over and over again. It's all about media exposure and creating terror (hence the name - cowardly pig-copulating beheading extremist mooslim terrorist). They will target whatever will cause the most fear and panic. In Europe (Madrid) trains worked - for 95% of the US, a train wouldn't be relevant - it's not how we go visit grandma. Airplanes, those we use, those make the news.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Are you guys kidding? The next event won't involve airplanes. They'll drop a railroad bridge in front of the City of New Orleans or limpet a cruise ship 5 miles outside the harbor.

 

[Redmeat]

Believe me, we had one of the original APSA nuts. He failed the FFDO program the first time, passed the second time and eventually was terminated when he "forgot" his weapon in a public restroom.

.

There's gun owners who appreciate hunting with firearms. For me it's about having a good excuse to get out in the woods into nature and watch the sun rise.

Then there is the pro 'right to carry' crowd. I call it
'small penis syndrome'.

Pilots are not cops. Their primary concern and thought process is flying the airplane and completing the trip safely aeronautically. It is not enforcing laws or their weapon or using it.

True LEO's on the other hand ARE charged with law enforcement and their weapon IS a constant integral part of that.

I can easily see how 'Joe Bob pilot' could leave his weapon on the back of the toilet after taking a big dump.

Pilots are very good at we do with airplanes, but good with handling deadly weapons on the job we are not.

If you want to play cop, go be a cop.

For the guy who had the weapon pointed at him...for the safety of your fellow pilots you need to report those occurrences.

 

[Tristar]

I say good riddance. This program was entirely precipitated by a bunch of gun nuts that thought they would get the right to "concealed carry" when there was absolutely NO reason for them to have a weapon.

And feared by hand wringing liberals who believe that the government will protect them (it won't, in fact the courts have held that the police in fact do not have a responsibility to protect individual citizens (Warren v. District of Columbia). Personally, I consider protecting myself and my family plenty of reason to have concealed carry (that and that pesky Second Amendment, which liberals go to great lengths to trash and reinterpret). As far as on the flight deck - the same still applies. Most of the problems I am aware of with the program arise from the lame brained procedures developed for handling the weapon - in, out, in, out, in, out. I am not aware of any other security or law enforcement protocol which involves as much handing of the weapon as FFDO, which is definitely contrary to safe practices - but that blame lies at the feet of those running the program.

The FFDO program will never have any value until you build a flight deck door with a gun port in it.

Not true, as the door is opened in flight a number of times for a number of reasons. Also, deadheading FFDO's should be carrying, acting in fact as Sky Marshalls (or do you believe they have no value either?).

If you just hate guns, then be honest and say, "I am in favor of only allowing criminals to have guns. I prefer honest, law abiding citizens to be disarmed and vulerable." Don't hide behind nonsense and rhetoric.

Otherwise, the door has to be opened for the FFDO to have any effect on the situation.

At this point it becomes obvious you have no idea what you are talking about or slept through secutity training. In either event, I'm not going to provide you with anymore information if you're on a fishing expedition.

$2M for this program? Total waste of taxpayer money.

Actually, compared to virtually any other law enforcement program out there, this one is a huge bargain in terms of the amount of manpower/$ spent.

If you want to cite meaningless statistics, to date it is an overwhelming success: 100%
There has not be a single US airliner hijacked since the inception of the FFDO program. Find another program with a similar success rate (and yes, I am resorting to hyperbole at this point - I certainly realize there are many other factors involved, but the fact remains that record stands).

Additionally, by all accounts the training the FFDO's recieve is outstanding and extends well beyond simply marksmanship. It's a good program that deserves to be made better, not ridiculed by minions of Chuckie "the American people don't care about porky amendments" Schumer .

 

[Flying-Corporal]

FFDOs? Good riddance. We've already had one monkey put a round through an airframe. Its only a matter of time before one of these guys shoots either himself or his flying partner.

$2M for this program? Total waste of taxpayer money.

Couldn't agree with you more. Most FFDOs that I've flown with don't even bother putting it on the belt in-flight, so what's the point of having it if it's locked safely in the box?

 

[Redmeat]

Also, deadheading FFDO's should be carrying, acting in fact as Sky Marshalls (or do you believe they have no value either?).
.

No they have value. They eat up all of the first class meals which I guess creates skychef jobs?

They also eat up a high revenue First Class seat.

 

[Flying-Corporal]

If you want to cite meaningless statistics, to date it is an overwhelming success: 100%
There has not be a single US airliner hijacked since the inception of the FFDO program. Find another program with a similar success rate (and yes, I am resorting to hyperbole at this point - I certainly realize there are many other factors involved, but the fact remains that record stands).

I think you give FFDO program WAY too much credit. There are many other agencies involved that keep flying safe.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I can't think of a single instance when an FFDO prevented something bad from happening.

 

[Britpilot]

I think you give FFDO program WAY too much credit. There are many other agencies involved that keep flying safe.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I can't think of a single instance when an FFDO prevented something bad from happening.

Ha, ha, ha, oh boy that's good. Other agencies keeping us safe? Like who?
You are not privy to the the FFDO program otherwise you may have some more information on what they know and do.

 

[Britpilot]

I say good riddance. This program was entirely precipitated by a bunch of gun nuts that thought they would get the right to "concealed carry" when there was absolutely NO reason for them to have a weapon.

ALPA was opposed to this program from the get-go if you recall. It was only when the gun nuts formed APSA that ALPA relented and grudgingly supported the program.

Believe me, we had one of the original APSA nuts. He failed the FFDO program the first time, passed the second time and eventually was terminated when he "forgot" his weapon in a public restroom.

The FFDO program will never have any value until you build a flight deck door with a gun port in it. Otherwise, the door has to be opened for the FFDO to have any effect on the situation. The Turkish 737 crash proved the strength of the door. In that crash, the F/O died because the rescuers couldn't get through the flight deck door for 45 minutes.

FFDOs? Good riddance. We've already had one monkey put a round through an airframe. Its only a matter of time before one of these guys shoots either himself or his flying partner.

1.Wrong or are you accusing me of being a "gun nut"

2.ALPA promoted this program, do you recall? "Qualified to Fly, qualified to Defend" I believe that was the slogan they used.

3.What?

4.The pilot in question was not a "monkey". He made a mistake. Have you ever made a mistake? want to know how many accidental discharges other LEO's have on a yearly basis? it might surprise you.

 

[Britpilot]

Then there is the pro 'right to carry' crowd. I call it
'small penis syndrome'.

Pilots are not cops. Their primary concern and thought process is flying the airplane and completing the trip safely aeronautically. It is not enforcing laws or their weapon or using it.



Pilots are very good at we do with airplanes, but good with handling deadly weapons on the job we are not.

Guess I must have a small penis then. I call it "The right do defend myself"

Tell that to a terrorist, they don't want you to complete your trip safely. The threat is real my friend.

That is your opinion with which I and a great many others do not agree with.

 

[PuffDriver]

This is the POTUS that ALPA wanted in there....Be careful what you wish for.....

Wait for it...wait for it.....
:bawling: :bawling: :bawling:

 

[Flying-Corporal]

Ha, ha, ha, oh boy that's good. Other agencies keeping us safe? Like who?

I am glad I made laugh, mate . TSA, for one. Police, two. Travelling public, three. Just because one has a gun, doesn't mean he is the king of the hill. If I am not mistaken Britpilot, police used to not carry weapons in England not too long ago.

You are not privy to the the FFDO program otherwise you may have some more information on what they know and do.

Well, if a disaster has been averted I think I should know about it as a citizen. The shoebomber disaster has been talked about in the media. We pay paxes that finance various programms, I want to know how necessary/effecient/useful/etc. it is. Prove me wrong, why sound so misterious???

 

[greyskyracer]

Couldn't agree with you more. Most FFDOs that I've flown with don't even bother putting it on the belt in-flight, so what's the point of having it if it's locked safely in the box?

I have mixed feelings about the program, but I do feel if they choose to be an FFDO that burden should lay on them. Strap your gun on your belt. I do not want a gun flying around the flight deck in severe turbulance. Take your gun with you on your walk around or when you run inside to take a dump. It is not my responsibility to watch it.

 

[skywiz]

Even if in box, there still is a value

Couldn't agree with you more. Most FFDOs that I've flown with don't even bother putting it on the belt in-flight, so what's the point of having it if it's locked safely in the box?

Not saying that they should keep it in the box... BUT part of the benefit of the program is DETERRANCE... terrorists are probably less likely to attempt a hijacking type attack if they know the pilot may have a gun in the cockpit.

 

[FR8mastr]

Then there is the pro 'right to carry' crowd. I call it
'small penis syndrome'.

One usually hears that line from a 30 something woman with about 500 CC's of substance shoved into her body along with a few ounces of poison injected into her face, commenting on some dude who can finally afford the sports car he has always wanted.
So if your not a woman what is the fascination with accusing anyone that does something you dont like of having a small penis?

 

[SplitBar]

I say good riddance. This program was entirely precipitated by a bunch of gun nuts that thought they would get the right to "concealed carry" when there was absolutely NO reason for them to have a weapon.

ALPA was opposed to this program from the get-go if you recall. It was only when the gun nuts formed APSA that ALPA relented and grudgingly supported the program.

Believe me, we had one of the original APSA nuts. He failed the FFDO program the first time, passed the second time and eventually was terminated when he "forgot" his weapon in a public restroom.

The FFDO program will never have any value until you build a flight deck door with a gun port in it. Otherwise, the door has to be opened for the FFDO to have any effect on the situation. The Turkish 737 crash proved the strength of the door. In that crash, the F/O died because the rescuers couldn't get through the flight deck door for 45 minutes.

FFDOs? Good riddance. We've already had one monkey put a round through an airframe. Its only a matter of time before one of these guys shoots either himself or his flying partner.

$2M for this program? Total waste of taxpayer money.

Agreed !

 

[turbodriver]

After having flown with FFDO's who shouldn't be trusted with a water pistol, I'm not surprised by this.....

 

[WMUSIGPI]

Erin Andrews ... aahhhh. That's a whole lot of sumpin.

Charissa Thompson is better....

 

[WMUSIGPI]

This Administration has already sent strong signals that it is hostile to the whole concept of defensive firearms in the hands of citizens. Sounds like par for the course to me.

Perhaps because this Admin. is a blink of an eye away from being Socialists???