Whats left of your USAir is worth more than what ALPA did or didn't do for u.

[pipe]

The sad thing about this whole USAPA issue, is the fact that ALPA National did not due away with the retirement or the seniority or the pay.

You know, I heard this with TWA/AA. You're right, but when ALPA doesn't lift a finger to prevent a wrong, they gotta take some blame.

They're the plainclothes cop in the room who got scared and watched the murder without ever pulling out their weapon. You don't get to claim innocence after that.

PIPE

 

[Prog 2/2]

I just stated I was not against ALPA.

I'd rather have ALPA where I am unless ALPA whether it be the MEC or organization would mess up my perceived career.

And in this situation at USAIR I and the person I am associated with that is there feel ALPA OUT is the only way DOH can be fixed and that is more significant than anything that ALPA could ever do for them and that is this Aho les opinion and am entitled to it.

Lemme guess, you're a product of the public school system?

Am I right?

 

[hmmm]

You know, I heard this with TWA/AA. You're right, but when ALPA doesn't lift a finger to prevent a wrong, they gotta take some blame.

They're the plainclothes cop in the room who got scared and watched the murder without ever pulling out their weapon. You don't get to claim innocence after that.

PIPE

Exactly, the MEC, ALPA national or whatever, didn't do anythng to stop it.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Exactly, the MEC, ALPA national or whatever, didn't do anythng to stop it.

Sounds good... and real easy to say....

however.... how does "whatever" stop it?

 

[Prog 2/2]

You know, I heard this with TWA/AA. You're right, but when ALPA doesn't lift a finger to prevent a wrong, they gotta take some blame.

They're the plainclothes cop in the room who got scared and watched the murder without ever pulling out their weapon. You don't get to claim innocence after that.

PIPE

Sorry.

There isn't any "blame" to be apportioned here.

The east got negotiation, mediation, and arbitration; exacly as the merger policy called for.

Now they don't like the outcome, and someone needs to pay.

Must be ALPA at fault, right?

It couldn't be that they had an unreasonable expectation, that the arbitration panel recognized, of stapling the majority of west pilots, now could it?

Naw that can't be it.

It must be ALPA.

 

[steveg]

And stop what? Who says it's unfair? What exactly was ALPA supposed to "Stop"?

 

[Prog 2/2]

Don't think it will matter much for the east guys. I'm looking hard right now and am talking to a bunch of people. They are ALL laughing at the fools out east and will NEVER hire them.

You and I must be talking to the same people.

Good luck with the search.

604/804

 

[steveg]

I was TWA, I saw ALPA screw up. For all of you buying the usapa crud and jumping into the fray, think before you leap. All this usapa stuff has nothing to do with ALPA. It's a land grab pure and simple. usapa has done a great job turning this into a referendum on ALPA (who I hate as much as anyone else) when in fact it has NOTHING to do with ALPA. usapa is simply another attempt to screw the AWA pilots.

 

[Caspian27]

It appears the USAPA guys have completely lost it. They'll get thier own union and the big unknown.

Interesting how the USAPA guys are justifying thier defection with everything against ALPA. Of course they don't want to talk about Nic, agreeing to binding Arbitration, etc.... As long as they can hate ALPA, justified or not... (and ALPA has done some wrong, but again... they only want to talk about that and not Nic)

Good luck, all you've got is yourselves... and whatever funds 2000 guys can scrape together.. Sounds good... and real easy to say....


however.... how does "whatever" stop it?

Rez,

I agree with you that East is going down the wrong path, and they should accept the "binding arbitration" that they agreed to, but:

What are you trying to say?!


I never understand your posts.....

 

[Hpilot]

Don't think it will matter much for the east guys. I'm looking hard right now and am talking to a bunch of people. They are ALL laughing at the fools out east and will NEVER hire them. Funny, but revisionist history and self-entitlement are not attitudes that carry over very well to a new employer. If you are a usapa supporter then don't even worry about dusting off your log book. Won't do you any good.

Exactly. I'm at a good company now and will make sure none of those scum sucking pigs ever gets hired here. On the way to the interview the captain whose flight I was jumpseating on was like:"Wait a second, are you east or west US? You're ex Am West, cool you can ride on us." Karma rules. Those A-holes will get it in the end.

 

[Wiskey Driver]

D.O.H. And whats you interest T.O. that you would identify my employer. I have never identified you. Your britches have gotten a little big for someone who was only voted in because nobody else but a bu tt buddy wanted the position out of a total vote I could count on less than two hands being that I was the one to do the count.

But at least he stepped up! What did you do?? Have you ever signed you name stating that you are willing to serve?? I'm betting no... Save that DOH crap for when CAL is looking to staple your as$ to the bottom of their list to protect those 4yr capt they have, then lets see you out here waving the doh flag then.

WD.

 

[hmmm]

Umm lets see... how many years and how many fights did USAir East pilots go through to deserve their original DOH seniority slot.

And how come its fair an AWest pilot can come in and take the East guys slot after the East guy had worked and fought so much longer compared to the west guy?


D.O.H.

And for your question who cares whether I stepped up. What does that have to do with anything. Ask the other guy if I did step up for anything. He knows who I am and knows I'll step up to anything and not back down. Will you step up to me in person. I'll be there. Will you.

And about you Cal staple. If I wasn't waving the DOH flag then I would be a thief. Whether an agreement or not it is stolen years of seniority.

 

[get2flyin]

Exactly. I'm at a good company now and will make sure none of those scum sucking pigs ever gets hired here. On the way to the interview the captain whose flight I was jumpseating on was like:"Wait a second, are you east or west US? You're ex Am West, cool you can ride on us." Karma rules. Those A-holes will get it in the end.

Nah. 3 years from now, everybody will forget. When I was an instructor, CO-EX and others were hiring but it was pay for training. The majority of us shunned it as wrong. We told ourselves those guys would be lepers and nobody would every hire them. I don't regret not paying for training, but they're all working at UAL and other places now. Guess we were wrong. They have good jobs but I have my pride. Only time will tell which of us made the right choice.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

What are you trying to say?!


I never understand your posts.....

Neither do I!!

Umm lets see... how many years and how many fights did USAir East pilots go through to deserve their original DOH seniority slot.

Please justify deserve. Especially at the Wests' expense.

And how come its fair an AWest pilot can come in and take the East guys slot after the East guy had worked and fought so much longer compared to the west guy?

Because the East agreed to using Nic. The East aggred to binding Arbitration. The East was advised not to go this route. The East was advised, work it out on your own terms not Nic. The East was advised "you are not going to like the Nic Award".

Why is it fair the East made thier own choices, agreed to the rules and then tries to change the rules? How is that fair?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Nah. 3 years from now, everybody will forget. When I was an instructor, CO-EX and others were hiring but it was pay for training. The majority of us shunned it as wrong. We told ourselves those guys would be lepers and nobody would every hire them. I don't regret not paying for training, but they're all working at UAL and other places now. Guess we were wrong. They have good jobs but I have my pride. Only time will tell which of us made the right choice.

Still hung up this? We live in a uber competitive economy.... some guy uses money to get an advantage and we chide him/her for it?

It is the American Way!

 

[Fly-n-hi]

If I wasn't waving the DOH flag then I would be a thief. Whether an agreement or not it is stolen years of seniority.

Um...nope. You have years of longevity...not seniority.

If you're the bottom guy at an airline and you've been there for 18 years you have zero seniority. Then, if that airline hires one pilot tomorrow you would be one number senior to that pilot...not 18 years senior.

It's not about how long you've been there, its about where you stand on the seniority list.

Hope that cleared it up for you.

 

[SaturnPilot]

Umm lets see... how many years and how many fights did USAir East pilots go through to deserve their original DOH seniority slot.

Fact is that ALPA had a merger policy that East guys knew before they went into this merger. That policy was NOT DOH. If DOH is the only "fair" way to go, then they probably should have lobbied to change ALPA merger policy before the merger.

Since you hate current merger policy as written, are you going to lobby to get it changed?

 

[becket]

Um...nope. You have years of longevity...not seniority.

If you're the bottom guy at an airline and you've been there for 18 years you have zero seniority. Then, if that airline hires one pilot tomorrow you would be one number senior to that pilot...not 18 years senior.

It's not about how long you've been there, its about where you stand on the seniority list.

Hope that cleared it up for you.

don't go and confuse gramps with the facts now!!!

The world, (at least America West) pilots most certainly owe him something!!! Why on Earth would one expect a grown man to be responsible for the choices he's made? When all else fails, go steal something...it works in the hood, why not at the airlines?

 

[Black Hawk]

This merger could have saved a lot of pilot's jobs and rejuvenated a dead career. Unfortunately it appears that pushing for a windfall will kill it off completely.

 

[Guppiedriver]

The self serving AWest pilots are not worth the paper their license used to be printed on that they didn't put the seniority proper on their own recognizance as men of morals and principle they are not, evidenced by their sitting there and accepting the ill gained spoils of war not due to them by their years in service based on Date of Hire.
[/COLOR]

Holy sh!t! That has to be the longest run-on sentence that I have ever attempted to read. I say attempted, because I still have no idea what this moron was trying to say.

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