ATA to wet lease scheduled airline to SWA?

[In The Wind]

The question is will WN walk away from 100 mil. in code share rev. They will never get that sort of return from another airline.....

 

[Crucianpilot]

FWIW, I jumpseated on WN last month and the captain said WN had obtained their international op certificate and would begin operating internationally this year probably Mexico and Central America. He got that from a training instructor during recurrent. Anyone else know about this.

 

[skiandsurf]

FWIW, I jumpseated on WN last month and the captain said WN had obtained their international op certificate and would begin operating internationally this year probably Mexico and Central America. He got that from a training instructor during recurrent. Anyone else know about this.

I dont see SWA doing those 20 minute turns in Cancun or Cabo.

 

[atafan]

FWIW, I jumpseated on WN last month and the captain said WN had obtained their international op certificate and would begin operating internationally this year probably Mexico and Central America

SWA could certainly be working in that direction. I don't think they would have already received the Int'l certificate yet because before you actually receive Ops Specs you have to demonstrate your plan and actually have proving runs and training in place. I don't think they have jumped through those hoops yet. They may be in the early process but just not yet.

IMHO

 

[Freight Dog]

I'm not sure that if Aloha was to take ATA's scheduled portion, we'd be able to codeshare with SWA due to our codeshare with UAL. I hear UAL is very jealous of their codesharing partners trying to court others.


Who knows....

 

[HalinTexas]

ATA had an agreement with Pleasant Holidays to do HI flying for many years. When the codeshare came about we were told my mgt. that WN did not want to share a codeshare with anyone. So, I would suspect that if AQ was involved somehow that the UA codeshare would "go away."

Also heard this wet lease is with LatinSky.

Mgt has wanted to keep the ATA certificate to take advantage of the military contract teaming. World and NA are on one team and ATA with Omni is on the other. They want to play both sides of the fence.

Heard from one of WN's guys Sat. that they have been flying airplanes down to C. Amer. for heavies. Don't know how much that would count for Int'l ops, but......

It will take longer than 3 months to get SWA spooled up on Int'l ops. HSA won't let them get their 20 minute or even 30 minute turns. Secondly, unless they get a some waiver, doubt it, then they'll have to start assigned seating to deal with pax manifests that must be forwarded between countries. Take a little while to get everyone spooled up since they've never done it before.

HI for WN? Forget it. It will take too long for them to get ETOPS. Took AK 22 months. Besides, the B737 is a terrible ETOPS airplane.

 

[Freight Dog]

So, I would suspect that if AQ was involved somehow that the UA codeshare would "go away."

It gets screwy considering that UA has a stake in AQ (the details of how much STILL aren't public), and they have a seat on our Board.

Wouldn't it be nice to know some stuff?

 

[HalinTexas]

It gets screwy considering that UA has a stake in AQ (the details of how much STILL aren't public), and they have a seat on our Board.

Wouldn't it be nice to know some stuff?

But then they'd have to kill you.

 

[RedDogC130]

We would still need to re-vamp the reservation system to allow foreign currency.

I spoke with our company head of operational safety a few months back and he said they would still need to create or improve the company security programs to deal with int'l ops. I don't know how long or deep that would be.

 

[Lear70]

It will take longer than 3 months to get SWA spooled up on Int'l ops. HSA won't let them get their 20 minute or even 30 minute turns.

20 minutes? Nope.

30 minutes? Maybe.

Money solves a lot of ills, and it's not the Mexico or Canadian side of it you'd have to worry about getting a quick turn out of it, it's the U.S. side.

Did several 30-40 minute turns like this in both countries. Not a problem. It's the down-time in the U.S. when the aircraft has to be completely down-loaded, searched thoroughly, cleared by your individual customs guy with 5 forms of paperwork to do, then re-pre-flighted by the flight crew after everyone else has monkeyed with it, etc that would get you.

Secondly, unless they get a some waiver, doubt it, then they'll have to start assigned seating to deal with pax manifests that must be forwarded between countries. Take a little while to get everyone spooled up since they've never done it before.

It wouldn't be that big of a deal. Assigned seating would flow nicely into the current zone-loading thing going on right now at SWA. I've actually seen some airTran 737's loaded faster than the SWA planes these days with that boarding process.

What makes you guys turn an airplane so fast is the ground crew. You staff nearly twice as many people and flip the ground-side faster than any airline I've ever seen.

HI for WN? Forget it. It will take too long for them to get ETOPS. Took AK 22 months. Besides, the B737 is a terrible ETOPS airplane.

No argument there...

My bet is when the 737 replacement comes online, SWA will have everything in place to start international ops with it - my bet is it will be a much better int'l platform.

Pure speculation, but with SWA so heavily involved in its design, I'd be highly surprised if it didn't fit the bill for int'l expansion.

 

[GuppyWN]

We're going to have everything "in place" to do international ops by 2009. Straight from Gary. We will have to assign seats but only on the intl' side.

ETOPS? You don't have to apply for it you just have to buy someone that's already got it. And if the 737 is such a terrible ETOPS platform then why is AQ ATA and AS doing it? Cause it's what's they've got.

Gup

 

[HalinTexas]

20 minutes? Nope.

30 minutes? Maybe.

Money solves a lot of ills, and it's not the Mexico or Canadian side of it you'd have to worry about getting a quick turn out of it, it's the U.S. side.

Did several 30-40 minute turns like this in both countries. Not a problem. It's the down-time in the U.S. when the aircraft has to be completely down-loaded, searched thoroughly, cleared by your individual customs guy with 5 forms of paperwork to do, then re-pre-flighted by the flight crew after everyone else has monkeyed with it, etc that would get you.


It wouldn't be that big of a deal. Assigned seating would flow nicely into the current zone-loading thing going on right now at SWA. I've actually seen some airTran 737's loaded faster than the SWA planes these days with that boarding process.

What makes you guys turn an airplane so fast is the ground crew. You staff nearly twice as many people and flip the ground-side faster than any airline I've ever seen.


No argument there...

My bet is when the 737 replacement comes online, SWA will have everything in place to start international ops with it - my bet is it will be a much better int'l platform.

Pure speculation, but with SWA so heavily involved in its design, I'd be highly surprised if it didn't fit the bill for int'l expansion.

If you've never done it before, this isn't something you can train by memo. It takes time to schedule the required personel to come and learn it. Pilot's and FA's are fairly easy to train to go to Mex., Can., but you can't throw money at those governments.

The hard parts are res. CSA's MX, dispatch. That also takes time. Then, there's the proving runs.

The 737 replacement is further off than the 787. What is SWA gonna use in the mean time? Meanwhile the competition is way ahead of ya.

It ain't what you see that makes it (or not) it's what you don't see.

 

[HalinTexas]

We're going to have everything "in place" to do international ops by 2009. Straight from Gary. We will have to assign seats but only on the intl' side.

ETOPS? You don't have to apply for it you just have to buy someone that's already got it. And if the 737 is such a terrible ETOPS platform then why is AQ ATA and AS doing it? Cause it's what's they've got.

Gup

Exactly X 2. But that still doesn't make it something you want to stick with. ATA has turned away more money because we can't haul freight to HI than I can count.

SWA might have more than one product line under it's banner, too.