DHL in talks to sell US Unit to FDX

[ABXbooger]

Weenie,

I would seriously watch what you say. Passing along "inside" information can be adverse to ones freedom, unless you like prison.

Things posted on an "anonymous" board are not anonymous and can and have led to serious ramifications, thats why people seriously doubt you.

 

[penguin22]

Euro, perhaps you could help me understand something. DHL paid big bucks to buy the customer base that we at Airborne Express had built. A much bigger U.S. customer base than DHL had been able to create on its own. That customer base was obviously satisfied with the service ABX provided for many years. Even you can’t argue with that. And we were profitable. Since DHL took over, however, that customer base has dwindled down to a fraction of what it was before DHL bought Airborne. Why?

Yet the only thing you seem to care about is whether or not we submitted to the politics of the DHL culture.

I would respectfully suggest you keep that in mind as you have a look around the corn field when you get here.


By they way, a couple corrections:

Secondly, Airborne never did supply chain management or designed and implemented complex logistical solutions. That's a whole different ballgame.

Are you sure about that, Euro??

“Airborne Logistics Services doubled in size between 1996 and 1999”
http://www.referenceforbusiness.com/history2/58/Airborne-Freight-Corporation.html

(Airborne Logistics Services is now rebranded as DHL Logistics Services)

Thirdly there's the international aspects. ABX used to be US domestic only, now they've got to handle a large number of international import and export shipments, something they are still struggling with in the ILN hub.

Yes, DHL's roots are International. But Airborne (now ABX) knows something of international shipments too. We received approval in 1984 to make ILN the only privately owned Foreign Trade Zone (FTZ) in the United States.

Fourthly there's the whole issue of Dangerous Goods. This is a massive earner for DHL, but something ABX was, and still is, utterly inadequately equipped to handle.

Dangerous Goods (‘Haz Mat’ in the US) was also a huge profit center for Airborne Express. You say we were “utterly inadequately equipped to handle” HazMat. I say we were able to keep our own HazMat customers happy for many many years before DHL showed up.
(empahasis on keep the customer!)


Euro, as someone who’s flown for 3 separate cargo companies from within my current job, I can say from my own perspective that DHL is by far the worst, ANA is by far the best, and the old Airborne Express somewhere in between.

Just offering you a different perspective

 

[shooter]

I'm way to detached emotionally to harbour any hatred towards something like an entire company. I am, along with a large number of DHL people this side of the pond, frustrated at the attitude we get from ABX management.

Then I would suggest that the beer offer in May hold and you are able to get with a few of the pilots here. Because while you say you are frustrated with the attitude from the ABX management, I can assure you that ABX is nothing short of completely dedicated to the success of DHL in the Americas. And there are customers that have been with Airborne their whole existence that are now UPS and Fed Ex customers. I am sure that is hard to stand by and witness and maybe DHL has interpreted other than actual ABX intentions. Other than that I would refer you to Clipper's post above, and point that Mr.Hete does have his duties to the stock holders. That is his job and what he gets paid for. If DHL would like a different relationship they should have done it during the initial separation. I do not pretend to have the answers or intend to excuse the top management of ABX if they have done things to offend DHL. If they have, I can be almost 100% certain none on this board are privy to the details. And if past experience is your deciding factor, you should be asking for them to run the whole operation in the USA. They have grown and ran a profitable business here, something DHL can't claim.
Wheww, after all that I can say I understand you may just not like them for other reasons and I can accept that. I can't stand Astar's part owner and president Dasburg and would never work for the guy. I don't have anything against the workers there and have worked with some of them in the past. But I will never work with them over there under Dasburg or that crazy General guy* even if given the opportunity.

* GRIDLOCK! (sorry, an SNL reference of retired Vice Admiral James Stockdale)

 

[HeavyjetDC8]

Regardless of perspective, the facts as argued by penguin stand for themselves - the only rational conclusion being that DHL's business model on this side of the Atlantic is fatally flawed.

 

[EuroWheenie]

Clipper/Penguin/Shooter

Thank you all very much for the postings you've taken the time to compose for my benefit, they have all been tremendeously educational and very well informed. I'll be the first to admit that I'm somewhat biased, perhaps a consequence of being subjected a one-sided presentation of facts. It is pretty hard to remain neutral when a very senior director, whom I have a lot of respect for, rolls his eyes and hisses (with a smile on his lips) "don't you f.ing get me started" when asking him how things are with ABX. Nor could I ignore what I saw with my own eyes on the ramp in ILN, it did remind me of a 3rd world operation (no offence intended).

I am not an expert in running big multinational companies, nor am I well versed in the US express market. My mistake, have I made any, is perhaps to apply what I know of ABX to the whole of the company. Well, I'm not to big to admit mistakes, nor am I (yet) to old to learn new things.

This thread has certainly had its ups and downs, but I am very pleased that we are at least able to keep it at an adult and reasonable level.

I'd very much like to extent an invitation to those of you, whether you're ABX, ASTAR or DHL, who feel like joining me for a couple of cold ones when I visit in May.

Internet boards are all well and good, but nothing beats sitting down over something wet, cold and alcoholic to exchange points of view - however adverse they might be.

Again, thanks all who have constructively contributed to my general education. I haven't completely changed my mind, and there are still things about ABX that frustrates the hell out of me. But it has been my experience that the world is neither white nor black, it seems to be primarily grey. I fell into the trap of forgetting that fact.

(Sorry for my poor attempts at sounding coherent, communicating in what is "only" my 2nd or 3rd language can sometimes be a tad tricky)

 

[ke4lir]

Clipperskip, Penguin22, Shooter, HeavyjetDC8...(and anyone I might have missed).........BRAVO!

Euro, as I am one of the bottom guys on the list, to the point of feeling like a 30 day subcontractor. Please join us in May and let the ABX gang show you how dedicated we are to make DHL Express in the US work.

 

[MJH767]

EW said:
"I'd very much like to extent an invitation to those of you, whether you're ABX, ASTAR or DHL, who feel like joining me for a couple of cold ones when I visit in May."

Many of us are wondering if we'll be too busy looking for new jobs to join you in anything.

 

[Jurasicpilot]

DHL bleeding here in the States is no secret. None of this really adds up or maybe it does and I just cant add. It would take FedEx a while to add the additional lift to absorb DHL domestic. If Im not mistaken didnt a news service somewhere report FedEx rejected the idea?

ABX does most of the DHL hauling and they just bought a load of DC8's and 72's with the purchase of CHI. I know those planes are already tasked, but is this a sign that ABX is altering it business plan or gearing up for something else.

Some one need to bug the phones and the board rooms. Its the only way to know for sure.

 

[ABXbooger]

Even then they probably lie to themselves..........

 

[erichartmann]

DHL bleeding here in the States is no secret. None of this really adds up or maybe it does and I just cant add. It would take FedEx a while to add the additional lift to absorb DHL domestic. If Im not mistaken didnt a news service somewhere report FedEx rejected the idea?

ABX does most of the DHL hauling and they just bought a load of DC8's and 72's with the purchase of CHI. I know those planes are already tasked, but is this a sign that ABX is altering it business plan or gearing up for something else.

Some one need to bug the phones and the board rooms. Its the only way to know for sure.

DPWN/DHL used a model that has worked for them elsewhere. They purchased a "local" business as a shortcut to expanding their business in country. Unfortunately for them they overlooked a few things. First, they didn't really understand the dynamics of the market they were entering. Second, they didn't understand the mindset of the people who were operating their "local" business.

The other sucessful model is to buy into a "local" business. The "local" business then uses the influx of capitol to expand the business. This may be what we are seeing with the re-aquisition of 49% of Astar, along witht the 49% of Polar.

Viewed in this light, what are ABX's future prospects? It could very well mean gradual phase out. Hete more than likely saow this as a possibility from the beginning. His choices were stark. He needs to keep DHL as happy as possible while expanding the 3rd party business a rapidly as possible, or ABX wouldn't survive. Sucessfully expanding the third party business has done several things. First, it provides additional business on which ABX may be able to survive. Second, it proves to DHL that ABX is a viable alternative to Astar, thus allowing for the possibility of keeping DHL as customer, or perhaps a business partner. Third, it allows Hete to fulfill his fiduciary responsibility to the stockholders of ABX which in turn allows him to keep his job.

What we don't know at this point is what the "master plan" is for either DHL or ABX. We don't know, for instance, if DHL is reacting in a reflex manner, i.e. option one didn't work let's try option two, or if they have thought things through and understand what they need to do. Depending on what the plans are, some of us may have to make some difficult choices ourselves. We may, for instance, have to chose between going with the aircraft to Astar if the plan involves an asset sale, or staying with ABX and Hete. Some will have no choice. Most of us have little choice but to stay and see where it all leads.

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

Depending on what the plans are, some of us may have to make some difficult choices ourselves. We may, for instance, have to chose between going with the aircraft to Astar if the plan involves an asset sale, or staying with ABX and Hete.

Interesting post, and I agree with most of what you say. But I'm a little confused by your last statement.

Doesn't an "asset sale" usually include select assets and rolling stock, without specifically addressing the employees?

I know that's how it worked when UPS bought Challenge a few years ago. The planes (and I think the ramp space) went to UPS and the cargo went with the planes, but the employees (the pilots, at least) stayed behind. There's still some bitterness down there over the way they (UPS and the IPA) handled that.

So what gives? Do you guys have language in your contract that prevents ABX from transferring assets without some sort of job protection?

 

[Clipperskip]

Yes, we have partial asset sale job protection provisions in our CBA. Only time will tell if it will be needed.



So what gives? Do you guys have language in your contract that prevents ABX from transferring assets without some sort of job protection?[/quote]

 

[hvydriver]

Yes, we have partial asset sale job protection provisions in our CBA. Only time will tell if it will be needed. So what gives? Do you guys have language in your contract that prevents ABX from transferring assets without some sort of job protection?

[/quote]

CS, first off, Whistlin' Numbnuts isn't with us anymore. Second, nope.

 

[Clyde]

Interesting post, and I agree with most of what you say. But I'm a little confused by your last statement.

Doesn't an "asset sale" usually include select assets and rolling stock, without specifically addressing the employees?

I know that's how it worked when UPS bought Challenge a few years ago. The planes (and I think the ramp space) went to UPS and the cargo went with the planes, but the employees (the pilots, at least) stayed behind. There's still some bitterness down there over the way they (UPS and the IPA) handled that.

So what gives? Do you guys have language in your contract that prevents ABX from transferring assets without some sort of job protection?

UPS did NOT take any of Challenge's planes. UPS bought CAC solely for their extensive route authority in Central and South America. The IPA had nothing to do with UPS' decision not to take the employees.

 

[hvydriver]

UPS did NOT take any of Challenge's planes. UPS bought CAC solely for their extensive route authority in Central and South America. The IPA had nothing to do with UPS' decision not to take the employees.

This is true. That's an urban legend that gets a lot of airplay.

 

[FastHap]

Hvydriver said:

CS, first off, Whistlin' Numbnuts isn't with us anymore. Second, nope.

HvyD, are you saying that our partial asset protections will not be needed? Or are you referring to something else with the “Second, nope.”??

 

[hvydriver]

Hvydriver said:

CS, first off, Whistlin' Numbnuts isn't with us anymore. Second, nope.

HvyD, are you saying that our partial asset protections will not be needed? Or are you referring to something else with the “Second, nope.”??

FH,

The second is nope, we wouldn't have anything in our contract that would preclude you guys from coming with the jets, should something like that happen. I recall reading in your contract that there was a certain percentage of a/c per fleet that could be sold without the company (ABX) sending pilots with them. I don't think that's any concern though. Our lyin' CEO (who can lie just as good as yours) said he's no longer interested in dealing with Hete at all.

 

[erichartmann]

FH,
....Our lyin' CEO (who can lie just as good as yours) said he's no longer interested in dealing with Hete at all.

We both know that if and when DPWN/DHL suggests to him that he should sit down and work out a deal he'll be at the table.

 

[hvydriver]

We both know that if and when DPWN/DHL suggests to him that he should sit down and work out a deal he'll be at the table.

Note my statement Eric. It starts off with "Our lyin' CEO".

 

[erichartmann]

Note my statement Eric. It starts off with "Our lyin' CEO".

I noted it. Actually I don't think he's lyin' in this case. I rather suspect is has been "suggested" to him not be interested, so he's not. If and when that changes he'll be at the table with bells and whistles on.