ATTENTION all JetBlue Pilots

[Fins Up]

I'm not going but I'll buy pizza for the 5 guys who do show up...

I think there will be a lot of supporters who don't show up for whatever reason. There are already over 300 pilots registered at JBPA. I'm sure some are just curious.

 

[ualdriver]

skywest has no union, they have a group of pilots that talk to management about issues but they are not a union. at JB there is a similar paper tiger called the pvgc.

JBPA is a union like SWPA,IPA,APA or NPA. The difference is that JBPA does not represent the JetBlue Pilots yet, we are starting the interest card campaing, once we have 50%+1 we can file with the NMB and an election will be held. on that election you can have IBT,ALPA,JBPA or any other union campaining for representation ..

Sounds like very, very good news to me. Actually, I think that it is very good news to any unionized airline pilot. It's too bad it's not ALPA, but frankly any union that puts an end to one pilot group undercutting other union pilot groups is EXCELLENT news. In fact, post a mailing address and I'd be happy to make a donation to such a cause.

So tell us, what kind of time line are we looking at? When do the cards go out? What's the deadline for the JetBlue guys to submit their cards?

 

[Dave's kid]

I think its premature for anyone to be posting that a union drive is in the "final push". Even if there are some 300 pilots registered at JBPA, that is a far cry from the numbers needed to actually bring a union to JB.

 

[AKAAB]

I think its premature for anyone to be posting that a union drive is in the "final push". Even if there are some 300 pilots registered at JBPA, that is a far cry from the numbers needed to actually bring a union to JB.

A journey of a thousand miles starts with one step. Patience and persistence equals prosperity.

 

[clickclickboom]

I'm not going but I'll buy pizza for the 5 guys who do show up...

Remember Bayou you in your cushy top 400 seniority with your" i got mine" nice 150K plus salary are the minority at jb.. There are another near 1600 here that want thing better for the majority.

Please take some time listen to the information and make a choice. You can educate yourself without having to immediately cast your vote.. All 1900 + pilots here can work together to make this a better company.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

flygirlqt-

Do you think the JBPA will purchase services from ALPA just like SWAPA, NPA, APA and IPA do?

Do you think the JBPA will join CAPA, just like SWAPA, NPA, APA and IPA do?

 

[A350]

ualdriver:

ALPA union pilots have spent the past few years, tripping all over themselves, undercutting each other. The only union pilots who haven't cut the throat of another union pilot are the independent ones (and the FedEx guys).

So, tell me again how this will keep pilots from undercutting each other?

A350

 

[gutshotdraw]

You forgot money grubbing, dues raping, National officer pocket lining.

Yep, I did. Too much eggnog...hic uke:

 

[ualdriver]

ualdriver:

ALPA union pilots have spent the past few years, tripping all over themselves, undercutting each other.
A350

The only reason why that might appear that way to the casual observer is that you were seeing the union carriers come to the reality that the JetBlue's, AirTran's, and Frontier's of the world made come true. As I've repeated many, many times over, I feel that the LCC's of the late 90's and early 00's reached critical mass, using their cheap airline labor to majorly undercut the legacies of the time. That "tripping all over themselves" that you saw was the union carriers (mostly ALPA) realizing that a $240/hr. + B plan + pensioned airline pilot cannot compete with large LCC airlines with $120/hr. + no retirement + no pension. Reluctantly, those union carriers made the choice of either coming down to JetBlue-like wages or perish. To you it's "tripping all over themselves." To us, it was reluctantly coming to the reality that JetBlue wages were here to stay. Now A350, we've had this debate before, have we not? You believe that carriers like JetBlue had little to nothing to do with the decline of pay, work rules, and retirement in the industry as a whole, and I believe they are very much responsible (moderately or largely responsible, depending on my mood) for the degradation. Agree to disagree?

So, tell me again how this will keep pilots from undercutting each other?

Sure, let me explain it to you. You see, JetBlue is a very credible competitor and cannot be ignored by the unionized carriers. As you may or may not know, there are many carriers right now, including American, Continental, Alaska that are renegotiating their JetBlue-like contracts. As an airline pilot, I want these airlines to "raise the bar," so that when it is my airline's turn to "raise the bar" in DEC of '09, I can build a little upon the gains that hopefully they will make. You see, A350, that's how it should work. Each airline gains "a little more" then the last each time a contract gets negotiated, bettering the lives of all airline pilots.

But here's the rub A350: Remember when I mentioned that JetBlue is a credible competitor that can't be ignored? The problem is that if UAL, AMR, CAL, Alaska, AirTran, etc., all get wages up, they will all have great difficulty compeiting against the likes of non-union carriers such as yours. You see, JetBlue can just conduct a repeat of what happened in the late 90's. They'll just use their discount airline labor pilots to undercut these newly negotiated rates and we end up right back where we started again- a group of airlines fighting to raise wages for all airline pilots being undercut by non-union carriers such as JetBlue, Virgin, etc., etc. Then the downward spiral starts again, then the cuts start all over, then guys like you will post on forums such as these how we're "tripping all over ourselves" to get our wages back down to yours (yet again). Get it?

So that's why I'm very happy to see JetBlue organizing themselves. It takes the most credible LCC that exists right now and hopefully, maybe, removes them from the side of the pilot pay/retirement/ equation that has been detrimental to the profession and moves them to the other side that may actually lift the profession up.

So like I posted, send me an address where I can send a donation to this fledgling organizaiton, as a unionized JetBlue is VERY beneficial to the industry, the profession, and selfishly, to me.

Gotta head to grandma's now. Merry Christmas.

ualdriver

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Good post UAL.... if the JBPA is accepting donations... I'll send some cabbage..... what about you PCL128?


There is no career carrier worth staying at that doesn't have Air Line Pilot Career representation...

 

[PCL_128]

Good post UAL.... if the JBPA is accepting donations... I'll send some cabbage..... what about you PCL128?

Count me in.

 

[BLUE BAYOU]

Let's see, 300 interested out of 1900 pilots is still less than 16%-- a far cry short of 50% required. This airline is not ready for a union and won't be for years. And much has to do with what ALPA has done for many of it's members these past 6 years post 9/11. ALPA had their opportunity to shine in sticking up for TWA, pay, benefits, retirements, AGE 65, the USAir/AWA merger and have failed miserably. An in-house union will be the best bet for new entrant airlines like Jetblue, but we're not ready for a union because too many pilots like me don't rightly care for representation. The airline is 7 years old. We don't "deserve" the right to get paid SWA wages yet because we still have to survive the infancy stage. Trust me, the defections at Jetblue to other carriers is going to come to a slow halt when other carriers slow or discontinue their growth plans with a recessionary economy, weak dollar and oil prices topping $100 in the near future. And as long as the other carriers remain somewhat near our wages and benefits (and most do) and until they start getting back their cutbacks and improve in a vast way in pay/benefits-- our management will remain at status quo or close to it. Additionally, there won't be many of us looking for a way to kick a company that is down and shaking the pant pockets looking for more change if there isn't any to be had-- but hey, look at UAUA, they bought back stock and gave $250 million to shareholders before they even thought of giving anything back to the work groups, and um, don't they have a union there??? There will be a union here at JBLU, but my guess would put it in about 5-10 years from now-- so relax, enjoy Christmas everyone!!! BTW, I'll still buy pizza for the 5 guys from bluepilots who show up to the meeting...

 

[IronCityBlue]

Maybe the meeting will only have 5 guys, maybe not. But I think when the cards come we will easilly have a 50% + 1 pro union return. I don't think most pilots will feel that arbitrarily waiting 5 to 10 years is in their best interest, since there is absolutely nothing to lose by unionizing at this time, other than 1 or 2% dues, which as you know is only a couple month's worth of a yearly cost of living adjustment. Unless management gets hostile, but in that case it prooves we needed a union all along now doesn't it? Anyway I seriouslly doubt 50% + 1 of JB pilots will choose to wait it out another few years or decade during a very uncertain time of mergers, revolving door management, open skies, etc. We shall see.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

What is with this hostile management talk? DN have made it clear... unions were good in the ol' days..but none needed now.

If he is smart he will flip flop like Kerry and welcome with open arms pilot career representation....

SWA does it.

And much has to do with what ALPA has done for many of it's members these past 6 years post 9/11. ALPA had their opportunity to shine in sticking up for TWA, pay, benefits, retirements, AGE 65, the USAir/AWA merger and have failed miserably. ...

Your understanding of ALPA failures is superficial and amatuer hour...

I think you should read and respond to UALdrivers post. The reason ALPA "failed" is in part to pilot groups like jetblue that fly for hourly rates much lower. It is hard to compete with that...

One thing the legacy carriers can learn from jetblue/SWA is productivity. One of the future keys to comeptitive success in business is a productive workforce.

If the legacy carriers could radically convert thier cultures to empower employees, companies like JB and Airtran will be in serious trouble. The good news, the old school stuffy types like Tilton and Steenland will never go for it...

Now....how do I contribute to the JBPA?

 

[SNOWBUM]

JBPA accpeps paypal donations, it is tax deductible.
the interest card campaing goes on full swing on jan 14, contitution ,policy manual,interim leadership to be elected then, as well as marketing campaing.

once JBPA has enough cards will file with NMB, obbiously it won't disclose what it considers enough or how many cards already has. 12 months from when the card campaing began is the nmb deadline but we expect to take much,much less. there is a lot of interet and support regardless of what some senior captain with some serious "i've got mine disease says" .

tax deductible donations donations at




https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_xclick&[email protected]&item_name=JetBluePilotsAssociation&bn=PP-DonationsBF&charset=UTF-8

thanks for the support