Is it really worth it?

[Flying Ninja]

Ninja, until you've occupied the right seat of a 121 aircraft and can speak from experience, shut yer yapper!

You are the epitome of "sour grapes."

...now go file for bankrputcy or something.

Ooops, did I pinch a nerve with what I said? Prove me wrong with what I have said in my previous post. I don't have to sit right seat to experience what I read and hear from all these regional pilots as to what life is all about as a regional pilot.

I would file for bankruptcy if that even helps my situation. But you can thank Georgey Bush for changing the law so that it would be absolutely meaningless for an individual to file. Corporations...now that's a different story. But individuals...you're SOL. Thanks for the tip. Next time you open your mouth to offer suggestions, base it on some sound facts. Good day.

 

[hindsight2020]

I think people tend to minimize the economic hardships the regional route presents to suit what they want to hear. In reality, it depends on what stage of life and what the economics of your present condition are when you get in. If you're in your early 20s, with (lack of) financial commitments which allow you to *maybe* slum it at Mcdonalds wages for the time you spend on the right seat, then perhaps. When you have responsibilities other than stocking the cabinet with ramen noodles then the proposition is outright scary.

Also if you're of the latter kind, you'll most likely have to build up some cash savings from your previous career to supplement your income for the time it takes you to hit the CA uprade at these regionals. Considering that alone, even at 1st year pay for 12 months, it sets you back many years. The majors are not the sure ticket to a career either, so once you make the jump you are still concerned about that crapshoot, and you sure as hell ain't going to be single and 21 by the time you work for these majors, you'll have much more at stake for sure. I've got co-workers at the unit (military) who tell me the horror stories of trying to commute to these joints working for $1600/mo gross. At least for the guard types, by the time he was through taking mil leave days to pay the bills, the min guarantee had gone down so low it cost him money to go to work. I know this is a specific personal circumstance, but my hat's off to the pure civi types trying to put food on the table on regional FO pay, the sacrifice in terms of pay vs days at home is horrendous. I know if the military hadn't been an option for me I would have been effectively priced out of the flying profession altogether.

Regarding the 9-5 comparison, the thought of working an engineering job made me sick to my stomach, but in hindsight the constant stress of living paycheck to paycheck, or credit, well into one's 30s is just as bad on your QOL, and I'm sure I could find a 9-5 job where I don't have to take work home with me (the supposed comparative advantage of airline jobs), and basically guarantee myself 40K/yr with a 4 year degree in basket weaving and not have to starve. Clonking out due to vocational frustration vs due to financial stress presents no difference in my book. I respect those who've stayed true to themselves and changed careers to suit their passion in life while dismissing a pay cut as a righteous opportunity cost to pursuing your dream, but I submit that this is all good and great until said paycut takes your family from a modest (or any kind of) lifestyle to not even meeting the cost of living threshold in the cheaper parts of this country (regional FO pay for example). Dismissing that is disingenous.

So as others have mentioned, your mileage varies. It works for some and not others. If I was intent of making an airline career via the regionals I would say one should be in their early 20s and live in base. Outside of that, forget it, it's not worth it. I'm sure the older career changers will disagree with that but I'm also sure they had enough cash stashed from the previous job to at least convince the wife it was worthwhile to go back to said income level.

Good luck brother!

 

[jvrac]

"If you fly a 4 day trip, and you commute, that 4-day trip could possible turn into 6 (a day to commute in each direction). Let's just say that you manage to keep it at 4 days a week of work. You got 3 days to yourself. But consider a 9 to 5 will be 8 hours a day typically and you get to sleep in your own bed every night, some of these pilots can work upwards of 14+ hours a day!"

Not all commutes take a full day. I used to do a two leg commute and it took 6-8 hours. A one leg commute can be quicker. It depends on how far you commute. I'm not saying commuting is a breeze, but it's not as bad as you're making it out to be. If you live in base, you can still sleep in your own bed every night, and work between 8-12 hours a day, oh, and have about 14-18 days off per month. It depends on how productive your trips are and whether or not you're senior enough to get those trips.

"I hear this a lot from pilots: "hurry up and wait". Let's not forget, at the end of the day, you are STILL working for someone. While the prison changes shape daily, it's still a prison."

It's not a prison if you enjoy being there.


"When I leave my office everyday, my day's over. No work ever comes home with me. But...an airline pilot may have to update their Jepp plates every two weeks...yes, they could do it while on the job but do they?"

Yes, actually a lot of pilots update their Jepps and other manuals on the job. You can even study for recurrent, etc. while on the job. You have access to all the manuals right there on the plane.

"Separation of work...ask the commuter how much separation there is when he's scanning and planning on which flight and what airline can carry him to his domicile while he's at home with the wife and kids."

This process takes between 10-15 minutes. ...maybe 20 or 30 if you really have to look hard.

"A police officer gets paid more, has a guaranteed pension at the end of 20 years, and offers plenty of variety on a day to day basis. And you get to sleep in your own bed. Between new gangsters, different parts of the neighborhood, and ever changing weather, the job offers more stimulation (and physical work out). As for the mental institution, I think knowing that I'm making 80% less than what my potential is at a 9 to 5 job would make me go to a mental institution."

I prefer not to get shot at while getting "stimulated".

In any case, it depends on your individual situation, lifestyle preferences, etc.

 

[Frap]

You're assuming the trips are commutable--often, they're not. With an 0500 report and a 2200 release in domicile, that 4 day trip (or reserve period) just turned into a 6 day.

And the man is thinking about starting his new career now. He ain't gonna hold 14-18 days off and even if he lives in domicile, he ain't gonna sleep in his own bed every night.

 

[Murdoughnut]

Ninja, until you've occupied the right seat of a 121 aircraft and can speak from experience, shut yer yapper!

You are the epitome of "sour grapes."

...now go file for bankrputcy or something.

If you know his story, he has a right to be pissed. Lay off the guy.

 

[Cardinal]

If you know his story, he has a right to be pissed. Lay off the guy.

Nonetheless, he hasn't experienced any of the upside thise job offers, and therefore reflects none of it in his post. The fun of flying expensive airplanes, the camraderie, and the fact that you don't take work home with you, Ninja hasn't enjoyed.

It's not all blue skies and butterflies, but a regional is only a gulag if you make it so. People hate their jobs all over the world, at every level, from Presidents, CEOs, engineers, doctors, pilots, all the way down to lav dumpers, hotel maids, and fishing guides. Conversely you can find happy, pleasant people in all of those positions.

Happiness and satisfaction are largely internal factors, having nothing to do with who signs your paycheck.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

If you know his story, he has a right to be pissed. Lay off the guy.

Thank you for not being overly presumptious.

I do know his story - intimately infact. He's plastered it all over every message board he finds time to post on.

We have endured the details of his plight many times over. He has been given suggestions and is basically a guy who thought he'd cut in front of the line and got burnt. He now owes well over 100K for next to nothing in ratings. He "blames" it all on the CAPT program. Yet many others have successfully completed the program and went on to flying jobs. All he does is bitch and complain about the program and how terrible things are.

Please do a search if you care enough to follow the ninja saga.

I just don't like that he comes on here and berates the profession like a salty legacy captain.

 

[Talian]

Thanks to all for your input. I guess it all comes down to how bad you really want to fly.

 

[Flying Ninja]

He has been given suggestions and is basically a guy who thought he'd cut in front of the line and got burnt. He now owes well over 100K for next to nothing in ratings. He "blames" it all on the CAPT program. Yet many others have successfully completed the program and went on to flying jobs.

So by your logic, as long as I cut in front of the line and didn't get burnt, it's all good. Why don't you take a step back and think for a moment (which I know takes a lot more effort for you) and consider why some of us didn't make it even though we graduated with top grades. Obviously you don't know my story intimately. Otherwise you'd understand where I'm coming from. And for the record, you still have NOT proved me wrong on anything I have said. And my points have been substantiated by others who HAVE sat right seat. Your position is looking mighty weak pal. People like you should apply and work for CAPT. They love guys who serve the kool aid to dreamy eyed people with money to give to them while delivering crap. On the bright side, at least once you're over the regional job, you can fall back on working for CAPT as a lying, dishonest, immoral, unetheical, and unprofessional used car salesman.

And just for you, yes, the upside to being an airline pilot is that you get to travel to different places, see different cities, party like a rock star with these HOT flight attendants, and fly shiny jets. Things I will never know about. But...all my other "berating" points stand...which you still have nothing to say to contest otherwise. Gee...is it perhaps I'm not berating but stating FACTS?