ALPA taking 2% from Bonus

[Soverytired]

How do you quantify "results" in order to set compensation? I would argue that Duane brought the best results of any President in quite some time. You and many other rank-and-file members would argue differently. How do you quantify this to set compensation?

You're arguing that "results" can't be quantified for an executive level position within ALPA? Nice job, if you can swing it. Apparently you don't have to produce anything except excuses. Sweet.

(clearly the rank and file disagrees, because DW ain't the man anymore)

 

[PCL_128]

You're arguing that "results" can't be quantified for an executive level position within ALPA? Nice job, if you can swing it. Apparently you don't have to produce anything except excuses. Sweet.

Yes, results can be determined by educated and informed members, but not by your typical ignorant rank-and-file pilot that judges results merely by how much bitching and whining is going on in the crew lounge about ALPA.

(clearly the rank and file disagrees, because DW ain't the man anymore)

Careful, you're displaying your ignorance again. DW wasn't voted out by the rank-and-file. Care to guess who voted in Prater? And for the record, it had nothing to do with dissatisfaction with Duane. It was all a political vote-trading fiasco.

 

[Soverytired]

No, it really wasn't. [in response to "Mesa's contract was concessionary"]Yes, some items were traded to make gains in other areas, but when looked at as a whole, the overall contract was a step forward. ALPA policy looks at the entire agreement, not just a few parts here and there. The single issue of Scope was a large enough gain to offset lots of other issues, and was the driving factor in these negotiations. The MAG agreement was compliant with ALPA policy, and the CCAir agreement was not. That's pretty simple, and that's why Duane had to reject the CCAir contract.

Oy! I'd say about 1200 Mesa pilots would disagree with you about the contract not being concessionary.

And yeah, I'm familiar with the "vote it in for the scope or your 1200 jobs will be give to 75 Freedom pilots".

Just read that . . . . 1200 jobs covered by 75 F8 pilots. No wonder JO thinks his pilot group is composed of morons.

It could more honestly have been sold as "Hey, just bend over and take it up the pooper . . you might just like it, don't knock what you haven't tried!"

Trust me, the previous contract was better. But hey, they're negotiating right now, so maybe in 2-3 years, and for the first time in 15 years, they might have a phenomenal contract. Definitely worth being a part of ALPA for 15 years just for that.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Ahh, the battered wife syndrome defense.

It's YOUR fault your husband beats you. You need to work harder and things will all be better. Because it's all YOUR fault, don't you see? You can't possibly expect HIM to deliver anything.

Very Weak.

 

[PCL_128]

Oy! I'd say about 1200 Mesa pilots would disagree with you about the contract not being concessionary.

And I'd say about 1200 Mesa pilots (or more) couldn't even tell me what RLA stands for, so their assessment of a complicated labor agreement isn't very germane.

 

[John Pennekamp]

What does that have to do with anything? Duane's house in Florida isn't any of my concern. The fact that he has to keep a second resident in DC is. The Association requires him to keep a residence in DC, so the Association needs to provide him with that residence since it isn't where he would normally live. "Stealing money?" He was paid whatever the BOD approved for him. I don't remember hearing any "nays" coming from the ASA table when the President's compensation resolution was being voted on at the BOD, so I assume that you didn't have a problem with it. Either that, or you're too spineless to voice your true opinion. Which was it? One of the other officers in my council at PCL sat on the compensation committee at the last BOD. Did he witness an outcry from the other members of the committee about lowering the compensation? Nope. You can't blame the President for getting paid what the BOD decides to pay him. Remember, Prater, the guy you voted for, campaigned saying that he wouldn't accept this "big" compensation package. What did he do? Exactly what Duane did. He took the money without so much as a small objection. The fact is that the BOD determines the President's compensation. The Officers aren't even allowed to be in the room when the BOD votes on the resolutions. If you want to complain about compensation, then point your blame at the BOD. Oh wait, that was you!

PCL, you're so far off in left field, you have no clue what you're even talking about. You obviously were not there. There were lots of "nays", especially in the back of the room, coming from the UAL and NWA MECs... and one ASA delegate, me. Were you asleep, or just stupid hungover?

As for me, I actually voted for Duane, even though I find him Woerthless. I decided that Prater was too scrappy to be taken seriously in the Beltway. Since that's all the president does is was schmooze politicians (and all Duane was good at), I figured we may as well vote for him. So stick that in your pipe and smoke it while you STFU.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Careful, you're displaying your ignorance again.

Watching you two debate is like having front row seats at the Special Olympics.

 

[PCL_128]

PCL, you're so far off in left field, you have no clue what you're even talking about. You obviously were not there. There were lots of "nays", especially in the back of the room, coming from the UAL and NWA MECs... and one ASA delegate, me. Were you asleep, or just stupid hungover?

Must have missed your vote. We were on the other side of the room, so I didn't notice anything coming from the ASA table. Sorry for the incorrect assumption. But yes, I was definitely hung-over.

As for me, I actually voted for Duane, even though I find him Woerthless. I decided that Prater was too scrappy to be taken seriously in the Beltway. Since that's all the president does is was schmooze politicians (and all Duane was good at), I figured we may as well vote for him. So stick that in your pipe and smoke it while you STFU.

Glad to hear it.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Must have missed your vote. We were on the other side of the room, so I didn't notice anything coming from the ASA table. Sorry for the incorrect assumption. But yes, I was definitely hung-over.

Glad to hear it.

Regarding Duane vs. Prater, you and I discussed it one night in the hospitality suite Don't you remember? Wonder why?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Hardly a kid. Been flying 26 years. ALPA never taught me what it means to be a pilot and sadly never will. They taught me politics and apathetic disregard though.

By the way, I see your current psition is "fixing ALPA". Why would you need to fix something that isn't broken ?

Just because you have 10K hours and have been paying dues doesn't make you politically effective. I am sure you are a better pilot than I.....

 

[eaglefly]

Just because you have 10K hours and have been paying dues doesn't make you politically effective. I am sure you are a better pilot than I.....

What has flying skill have to do with this ?

Stop sobbing. If ALPA was more effecitve and less lip service and dues check cashing, this industry would'nt be where it is today.

You can argue till the cows come home that it's the lack of "unity", personal apathy and any numnber of other excuses, but from a effectivness standpoint, ALPA can't even conquer the fatigue issue that is becoming rampant. Pay, pensions and working conditions ?

Pleeeez.....................

ALPA is a Chihuahua that sometimes barks loudy.............the airline bosses laugh whenever they do.

It's been that way for at least 15 years.

Joke.

 

[John Pennekamp]

What has flying skill have to do with this ?

Stop sobbing. If ALPA was more effecitve and less lip service and dues check cashing, this industry would'nt be where it is today.

You can argue till the cows come home that it's the lack of "unity", personal apathy and any numnber of other excuses, but from a effectivness standpoint, ALPA can't even conquer the fatigue issue that is becoming rampant. Pay, pensions and working conditions ?

Pleeeez.....................

ALPA is a Chihuahua that sometimes barks loudy.............the airline bosses laugh whenever they do.

It's been that way for at least 15 years.

Joke.

You're 100% correct. So what are YOU going to do about it?

 

[eaglefly]

You're 100% correct. So what are YOU going to do about it?

Realistically ?

Well, there's an outside chance I'll be flying for AA, so my annual $2400 magazine subscription would then lapse.

If not, then watching all the shiny-jet kids now coming aboard falling all over themselves to fly for peanuts, I'll probably be forced (just as you will) to fold my arms and watch Rome burn. My plan then, is in the meantime, to stock up as much as possible on marshmellows to at least have something to contribute.

Sad, but true.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Realistically ?

Well, there's an outside chance I'll be flying for AA, so my annual $2400 magazine subscription would then lapse.

If not, then watching all the shiny-jet kids now coming aboard falling all over themselves to fly for peanuts, I'll probably be forced (just as you will) to fold my arms and watch Rome burn. My plan then, is in the meantime, to stock up as much as possible on marshmellows to at least have something to contribute.

Sad, but true.

So what you're saying is that you admit defeat and you can't/won't do anything but bitch anonymously on a message board. I see. As long as it makes you feel better.

 

[eaglefly]

So what you're saying is that you admit defeat and you can't/won't do anything but bitch anonymously on a message board. I see. As long as it makes you feel better.

It's the only medicine there is. This profession is terminally ill and gets sicker every year.

Fight on, young soldier !

The fat cats are still giggling though............all the way to the bank.

For the forseeable future.

Now, where are those marshmellows..............