Netjets IBB 18 day schedule, 4 on 3 off?

[D_G]

If your seniority could hold 4 on 3 off (which works out to 18 on and 12 off in a 30 day month) will NJA scheduling allow it?
That way only 3 nites a week in a hotel and 4 with my wife.

 

[Mach92]

If your seniority could hold 4 on 3 off (which works out to 18 on and 12 off in a 30 day month) will NJA scheduling allow it?
That way only 3 nites a week in a hotel and 4 with my wife.

It may be possible BUT I doubt it. Something like 5 on 4 off or 5 on 5 off might work.

 

[Guitar Guy]

The 18-day schedule allows them to work you any 18 days in a month that they can, with the possibility of an 8-day tour once every 4 months if IBB is ratified.

It's possible with the PBS system that you would be able to bid shorter tours. From what I've heard, one of the criteria you'll be able to select in the computer system would be "shorter tours". That might get you closer to 4 on/3 off but it's guaranteed by any stretch of the imagination.

There is also the 15-day Flex schedule under IBB. That might get you closer to your 4 on/3 off goal. The Flex will have a maximum tour length of 5 days followed a minimum of 3 days off. One of our union leaders has said that he thinks the guys (and gals) on the Flex will not be spending 15 days at work each month.

And remember, only 40% of the pilots in any fleet/seat combination will be able to bid the 18-day schedule. Right now, there are a few fleets where the 18-day schedule goes senior for SIC's. It's hard to guess if that will still be the case if IBB is ratified, due to the 15-day schedule. Some people might prefer that one due to the possibility of more days at home for a 10% pay increase over the base 7/7 schedule.

Of course, this is all speculation until about November 21 anyways.

 

[gunfyter]

If your seniority could hold 4 on 3 off (which works out to 18 on and 12 off in a 30 day month) will NJA scheduling allow it?
That way only 3 nites a week in a hotel and 4 with my wife.

No way.

I expect 6 On 4 OFF or 7 on 5 OFF.

 

[ramf001]

Possible, yes, probable? Don't know.

Here is the section of the IBB proposal that deals with the Preferential Bid System and what you can actually reguest:

19.1(B)(2) 18-Day Fixed Schedule Line Preferences
A crewmember on the 18-Day Fixed Schedule may designate and submit some
or all of the following scheduling “preferences” to the Company via a Company-issued
electronic form:​

(a) Preferred days off;

(b) Preferred tour lengths; and/or

(c) Preferred length of time between tours.​

Scheduling preferences may be submitted to the Company at any time prior to

the first day of the month in which the 18-Day Fixed Schedule is published. To the extent​

practicable, the Company will consider a crewmember’s preferences in determining a

crewmember’s 18-Day Fixed Schedule. A crewmember’s schedule preferences are not guaranteed. (remember, these are based on seniority.)





​

 

[gunfyter]

I will lay money even the most senior will not see tours shorter than 6 days except on very rare occasion.

 

[RNObased]

I will lay money even the most senior will not see tours shorter than 6 days except on very rare occasion.

I will agree whole heartly. The 4 on 3 off isn't going to happen. You can ask all you want, but why do you think the current reserve guys don't work 18 days some months. Because they don't want to send them out for just 4 days, lack of productivity.

I know what the IBB says, and I know people have dreams of having it all. Below is the catch all the company will use when you don't get what you ask for.

19.1 B (c)A crewmember’s schedule preferences are not guaranteed

 

[Mach92]

I will lay money even the most senior will not see tours shorter than 6 days except on very rare occasion.

I'll take that BET!

How about your bonus?

 

[Mach92]

I will agree whole heartly. The 4 on 3 off isn't going to happen. You can ask all you want, but why do you think the current reserve guys don't work 18 days some months. Because they don't want to send them out for just 4 days, lack of productivity.

I know what the IBB says, and I know people have dreams of having it all. Below is the catch all the company will use when you don't get what you ask for.

19.1 B (c)A crewmember’s schedule preferences are not guaranteed

"H" Days are NOT NOT NOT guaranteed. In fact around the holidays there is no way to take all 4 because of a black out day.

Same as we have today. I'll take PBS !

 

[gunfyter]

I'll take that BET!

How about your bonus?

Well since I am about to take a paycut...

How about $1000?

Just so we understand what you are claiming...

With tours of less than 6 days in length...

It would mean at least 4 tours a month...on the 18 day schedule. Right? Possibly 8 days of airling each month out of 18 workdays?

I can see how that would be a good deal for the company.

You think lines with 4 tours in a month will be offered ... because only 3 tours in a month requires that at least 2 of the tours are 6 days or more.

 

[gutshotdraw]

My head hurts!!!!!! Can't we all just do 7 and 7 and call it a day?

 

[gunfyter]

No we cant.

Scheduling cannot be efficient with everyone on 7&7.

Reason: If demand were level day by day we could do it. No FIXED schedule like 7&7 can place manpower on the days when demand is highest.

What is needed is 7&7 to cover the minimum demand days... then a PBS, Reserve, Flex or some other type of schedule to place manpower to match demand.

 

[AirBear8]

If your seniority could hold 4 on 3 off (which works out to 18 on and 12 off in a 30 day month) will NJA scheduling allow it?
That way only 3 nites a week in a hotel and 4 with my wife.

I've been on the reserve schedule for almost 2 years now. I can count the number of tours 5 days and less on the fingers of one hand. With the cost of the airline tickets it's just not cost effective to do shorter tours. The only exception is when they're short staffed and have no choice. I once did a 2 day tour . I airlined to HPN on day one, sat hot spare for 4 hours then went to the hotel and airlined home the next morning. They spent almost $1000 on airfare and hotel for me to sit spare for just 4 hours. That's why they don't like short tours. And the reserve schedule will be replaced by the 18 day fixed schedule if the IBB passes. I wouldn't be surprised to see the 18 day sched consist of 3 six day tours.

AirBear

 

[Dassault]

No we cant.

Scheduling cannot be efficient with everyone on 7&7.

Reason: If demand were level day by day we could do it. No FIXED schedule like 7&7 can place manpower on the days when demand is highest.

What is needed is 7&7 to cover the minimum demand days... then a PBS, Reserve, Flex or some other type of schedule to place manpower to match demand.

Actually they could be quite efficient with everyone on 7/7 but it requires having more than just two days a week as start days, and those don't even line up. An overlap of one day would allow last crew to work morning of last day and new crew can airline to meet the plane and continue on in the afternoon. But they won't think it through.

 

[gunfyter]

6 on 4 off baby.

PBS will be to match you to the 6/4 line that mostly matches your desires.

 

[dime line]

6 on 4 off baby.

PBS will be to match you to the 6/4 line that mostly matches your desires.

Been there Done that,You want no part of a 6/4.
How many years have you guys been doing the 7/7, why doesnt it work now?

 

[CA1900]

Been there Done that,You want no part of a 6/4.
How many years have you guys been doing the 7/7, why doesnt it work now?

It works fine, and the majority of our pilots are on it. The 18-day is an optional schedule that lets you work more days for more money.

 

[imacdog]

Yep up to 90% of our pilots can be on 7/7 if they want it, whether or not IBB passes.

 

[gunfyter]

Been there Done that,You want no part of a 6/4.
How many years have you guys been doing the 7/7, why doesnt it work now?

Let me just clarify that this is my guess of how the 18 day sched will shake out.

 

[RJET]

I think we should have a 5 on/5off schedule, with this schedule we would still work 15 days out of a 30 days calendar month.
Maybe in 20013.