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NEWS FLASH - AWA pilots a bunch of rookies

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OnTheDole

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2003
Posts
166
from CLT news 14:

"US Airways pilots are the most highly-skilled and experienced pilots in the world,” said Capt. James Ray. “The America West pilots are much less experienced than we are and we brought a lot of seniority and years of service to the table and the arbitration failed to realize that.”

****************************** bag...
 
OnTheDole said:
from CLT news 14:

"US Airways pilots are the most highly-skilled and experienced pilots in the world,” said Capt. James Ray. “The America West pilots are much less experienced than we are and we brought a lot of seniority and years of service to the table and the arbitration failed to realize that.”

****************************** bag...
Click to expand...

I am sure there is someone out there that will spend the 20 minutes to research and compare safety records????
 
It's probably predicated on their international flying experience, which to be fair is a whole different ball of wax than flying US and North America.. but also to be fair, many former AWA (now US Air) pilot have international experience from the old days when AWA did that, and prior careers in the military or other jobs.. so it's a bit of a stretch to say ALL are more experienced.. But I think I catch their drift.

Bottom line.. AWA bought USAir.
 
:laugh: now that would be so funny if it wasn't so stupid. How do you get that cocky after 20 years in the right seat flying between Albany and pit
 
OnTheDole said:
from CLT news 14:

"US Airways pilots are the most highly-skilled and experienced pilots in the world,” said Capt. James Ray. “The America West pilots are much less experienced than we are and we brought a lot of seniority and years of service to the table and the arbitration failed to realize that.”

****************************** bag...
Click to expand...

I know James. This is not one of his sharpest remarks, but it doesn't surprise me that he said this.

The skill level, is not something that is considered. I still feel the arbitrator missed the boat on this one, but for other reasons.
 
OnTheDole said:
from CLT news 14:

"US Airways pilots are the most highly-skilled and experienced pilots in the world,” said Capt. James Ray. “The America West pilots are much less experienced than we are and we brought a lot of seniority and years of service to the table and the arbitration failed to realize that.”

****************************** bag...
Click to expand...

He's going to break all those straws he's grasping at unless he's careful.
 
FMS-Speed said:
It's probably predicated on their international flying experience, which to be fair is a whole different ball of wax than flying US and North America.. but also to be fair, many former AWA (now US Air) pilot have international experience from the old days when AWA did that, and prior careers in the military or other jobs.. so it's a bit of a stretch to say ALL are more experienced.. But I think I catch their drift.

Bottom line.. AWA bought USAir.
Click to expand...

the only thing complicated about international is trying to find lunch when you get there.
 
Ah its no big deal. He's just pandering to the masses, as a west pilot I'm not offended. If he truly means it, well thats his problem.

Just out of curiousity, does anyone know if he(Ray) has drawn cartoons for the alpa magazine?
 
.

LandGreen said:
I am sure there is someone out there that will spend the 20 minutes to research and compare safety records????
Click to expand...


Since 8/1/1983 (AWA was born)............


USAir - 7 fatal accidents - 234 Fatalities

America West - 0 fatal accidents - 0 Fatalities


All of the accidents since 1983 at USAir happened between 1989 and 1994. Was that during the PSA merger? I hope that this trend does not reappear with this integration...........

Right, Wrong, or Indifferent - BE SAFE out there !!!




.
 
I know a few former C-5 and C-17 drivers at AWA who have plenty of international time flying to the most remote and hostile places in the world. I guess they would still be considered rookies to this guy who probably spent most of his career flying between Philly and Detroit (both hostile places).

Just remember chump, you were very close to the unemployment line and had AWA not entered the picture you would not be flying to those super skill-intensive destinations like London and Paris.
 
I can understand his venting.............................sadly the seniority boat has sailed on this deal and most of the U guys are doing the rowing.

I suppose all they can do now is vent.
 
Doug Parker said:
.




Since 8/1/1983 (AWA was born)............


USAir - 7 fatal accidents - 234 Fatalities

America West - 0 fatal accidents - 0 Fatalities


All of the accidents since 1983 at USAir happened between 1989 and 1994. Was that during the PSA merger? I hope that this trend does not reappear with this integration...........

Right, Wrong, or Indifferent - BE SAFE out there !!!




.
Click to expand...
I think all of those fatal accidents were doing what is considered "easy" domestic flying. US A-holes!! Airline flying in general (including international) isn't that difficult. Tedious maybe, but not difficult.
 
eaglefly said:
I can understand his venting.............................sadly the seniority boat has sailed on this deal and most of the U guys are doing the rowing.

I suppose all they can do now is vent.
Click to expand...


You make it sound like the result of the Merged list is that they are subserviant to the west pilots.

This could not be further from the truth. The list went pretty close to a relative list. ie. if you were at 30% before then you are now within the same percentage give or take a few %.

The west guys are mostly relieved that it didn't end up looking like the BOHICA list that the SUPERIOR airmen out east wanted.


Think about it, with the TWA/AA intergration there were 16 year Captains from TWA furloughed where 2 year AA pilots were not. Why is it now such a crime that an 18 year FO at AAA is now still an 18 year FO
 
"US Airways pilots are the most highly-skilled and experienced pilots in the world,” said Capt. James Ray.
Click to expand...
:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
 
I do think the USAirway pilots got screwed, but what do you expect from them.... they treated the ALG and PDT pilots like $h!t, and know they are on the receiving end.... karma's a B!tch....

As far as the "experience" comment, that is typical legacy pilot BS.... they think they are better than everyone.... AWA is just a big regional in their eyes...
 
Think about it, with the TWA/AA intergration there were 16 year Captains from TWA furloughed where 2 year AA pilots were not.
Click to expand...

Wrong, AA guys with more than 2 and 3 years seniority got furloughed also, and many TWA guys did not.......
 
Airways guys originally didn't allow the wholly owned regionals (pdt, alg, psa) to operate RJ's because "they only know how to fly a straight winged airplane. they would not know how to handle a swept winged jet."

so.....
they...
.....gave them to TSA, Chautauqua....and da da da da...Mesa....

Mookie
 
Mookie said:
Airways guys originally didn't allow the wholly owned regionals (pdt, alg, psa) to operate RJ's because "they only know how to fly a straight winged airplane. they would not know how to handle a swept winged jet."

so.....
they...
.....gave them to TSA, Chautauqua....and da da da da...Mesa....

Mookie
Click to expand...

Yeah, O.K...............it's clear the U guys for the most part are tending to their tattered anuses, but just because they crapped on their regionals doesn't mean they should have been..................wait a minute..........what am I saying ?

Let's revise that.

How about what comes around, goes around.

I don't see any big tear shedding for U pilots. Most (including me) aren't thrilled they got the shaft, but few of us are losing sleep over it either.

Why argue.

It's a done deal and NOTHING U ALPA can do will change that (despite sabre rattling). They can dump ALPA, but that won't change BINDING arbitration.

It's over and they lost.
 
I don't know why you guys keep saying, "The East guys got the shaft" . . . . They got relative seniority, and it exceeded any reasonable expectations they had of remaining employed, or returning to employment. Sure, it's not what they would have liked, but it sounds pretty fair to an unbiased observer.

Fire away . . . . if it makes you feel better.
 
CSY Mon said:
Wrong, AA guys with more than 2 and 3 years seniority got furloughed also, and many TWA guys did not.......
Click to expand...

Ok I stand corrected

the most Senior TWA pilot on furlough had about 16 years of service and the most senior AA pilot on furlough had up to, lets call it 4 years of service.

LIKE I SAID

Why is it now the crime of the century that after the AAA/AWA seniority (not longevity) intergration, that an 18 year AAA F/O is still an 18 year F/O after the merger.

Remember the merger that even the newspapers remarked that now "US Airways will not have to liquidate because of the merger' etc.

some how the SUPERIOR airman of all times seem to forget that they, on May 18, 2005 had little to no career expectations. Despite their SUPERIOR ABILITIES (trying to stay positive and not mention any events between 1989-1994 that have already been illuminated).

Wake up we didn't get a windfall, however we did get the promise of the nightmare we are now living out, in having to deal with your arrogant sense of entitlement.
 
Last edited:
Ty Webb said:
I don't know why you guys keep saying, "The East guys got the shaft" . . . . They got relative seniority, and it exceeded any reasonable expectations they had of remaining employed, or returning to employment. Sure, it's not what they would have liked, but it sounds pretty fair to an unbiased observer.

Fire away . . . . if it makes you feel better.
Click to expand...

Thank You for putting your opinion out here. It's good to know that not everyone has the warped sense of entitlement that the east guys seem to have or at least that their leadership portrays them to have. I feel bad for those guys if there are any that see this for what it was, a relative intergration where no group got stapled.
 
Last edited:
Ty Webb said:
I don't know why you guys keep saying, "The East guys got the shaft" . . . . They got relative seniority, and it exceeded any reasonable expectations they had of remaining employed, or returning to employment. Sure, it's not what they would have liked, but it sounds pretty fair to an unbiased observer.

Fire away . . . . if it makes you feel better.
Click to expand...

There's your problem, you're an unbiased observer. When an outside observer(example arbitrator) looks at the facts and the merger policy it's obviously fair.
 
Hpilot said:
There's your problem, you're an unbiased observer. When an outside observer(example arbitrator) looks at the facts and the merger policy it's obviously fair.
Click to expand...

Your post makes no sense. The two parties were not able to resolve their differences themselves. What would you propose?

.
 

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