UPS window

[kermit99]

BIGBROWNDC8, I have all the quals and my application says "on file." Will they even look at it eventhough at the end it said it had enough qualified pilots?

 

[Fedora]

Mine shows "active" and "complete" and allows me to see and edit it.
The site still shows appointments not available.
Good luck to all!

 

[kermit99]

Thanks, mine says "on file" and complete, not attention required at this time. Just curious to others if this means they will not look at later or if your quals did not add up. If not, how can anyone not go and update it with good times, especially if it adds up over the year. Oh, and to check and make sure their app is all up to date. Thanks for the help.

 

[capt. megadeth]

Is that REALLY all there is when you get assigned in training? I'm debating what to do, if I could avoid ANC I would be more inclinded to apply. Commuting out of there would be impossible.

My guess would be that there is a 90% chance you would get ANC if you have MD11 experience.

 

[AV80R]

Don't give up!

The software kicked me out. If you don't answer ALL min questions as yes, I assume you will get kicked out also. I'm studying for the FE Written TODAY!!!

ATPCLIFF – The “FE currency” has been covered quite extensively here (use search function if you want). UPS (and I believe FedEx too) wants an FE written that’s no more than 24 months old (unless you have an FE ticket which of course never expires).

In other words, UPS does not accept the “121 exemption” for the FE written (…even though the FE written has expired it might be “current” if you’re working at a 121 carrier, etc… FAA yes – UPS – NO)

Folks, this application window is so elusive, please make sure you meet all the requirements before you fill it out – otherwise you might get locked out and in worst case might have to wait until next year before you can apply again. Fortunately for you the software kicked you out, in worst case you'd have gotten the “thanks but no thanks – you do not meet the minimums…” message.

I got in today and it accepted my application. It then thanked me but said I wouldn't be considered further. It must have an automatic scoring system to determine how viable you are even if you meet the mins.

Unfortunately, if you answered NO to any of the questions, for example regarding the Oceanic crossings experience, etc, I believe you’ll get the thanks but no thanks reply. Don’t give up quite yet, read below…


Guys/gals – please do not give up on UPS even though the application process seems to be so complicated and elusive.

Right now they want pilots with heavy and international experience but don’t give up. Eventually they’ll make this “requirement” a plus but not a straight requirement and they’ll start hiring regional guys again. They’ve always been very proud of hiring a great mix of pilots, part 121, 135, even 91, civilian, military, guard - they’ll do it again before you know it.

I know it’s very frustrating but please be patient and keep trying. It took me almost 8 years before it finally happened and there were times I thought about just giving up. Fortunately my friends wouldn’t let me and kept cheering me up and I kept reapplying and going to all those job fairs and then all of a sudden it happened.

I’m really not quite sure what I’m trying to say except maybe to “cheer” some of y’all up because I’ve been there and I know what it feels like. So once again, if you get a message “thanks but no thanks” because you do not meet one of their requirements right now - don’t give up! Keep checking every few months and hopefully sooner than later they’ll change the rules.

If not, look into Gemini, Kalitta, etc, they seem to be training their pilots just quickly enough for UPS and Fedex to snap them up.

» » » » » Persistence pays off and the wait is definitely worth it! « « « « «​

» » » » » » » » » » GOOD LUCK TO ALL BROWNIE HOPEFULS!!! « « « « « « « « « «​

 

[Mooseflyer]

I need to update my hours since I did not do the 0.3 hr/sortie conversion for military. I did not see anywhere to upload my resume, did anyone else?

Kermit,
The app specifially says NOT to include a military converstion when entering flight time. Also, they don't consider any "relief pilot" time as PIC - I'm assuming that means our military "other" time is out.

I was able to upload my resume.

 

[Mooseflyer]

For you guys who are getting a message of some kind - how are you getting them? Via email? Pop-up?

I didn't get a message of any kind when I finsihed my app - the only difference is the red "!" next to it went away and I can now see the "schedule an appointment with an HR prfessional" link.

 

[AV80R]

Moose - did you do the psych eval yet? It sounds like you're about to get an interview - good luck to you

 

[kermit99]

I did not add in the mil conversion time. So I put in 900 PIC, 300 Instructor for C-17, with a total of around 1200 PIC hours for the app. I dont have a clue as to why I would not be eligable or looked at. Maybe I missed something on the app.

 

[Mooseflyer]

AV8 - I sure hope you're right, that would certainly make my day. I haven't done any kind of psych eval, but then again I just finished my app about 12 hours ago. How is one notified to take the psych eval?

 

[kermit99]

I believe via email, from what i have heard. Moose, what base?

 

[Mooseflyer]

TCM, you?

 

[b707guy]

Kermit,
The app specifially says NOT to include a military converstion when entering flight time. Also, they don't consider any "relief pilot" time as PIC - I'm assuming that means our military "other" time is out.

I was able to upload my resume.

I don't think military "other" time ever counts, since most places are interested only in PIC/SIC. One thing I haven't seen is how evaluator time or check airman time can count for you. You're a required part of the crew, and are in a position to take the place of a crewmember if you observe discrepancy that might merit taking over. I haven't counted any of that time in my totals. For me it's not a great amount so no big deal. It may be for many of us out there, though, so it seems it should count for something. Any thoughts?

 

[kermit99]

I would include "other" time since being certed as an AC since you still signed for the jet when you go on long trips. Did not include "other" time for SIC because I was just a co-pilot then and did not sign for anything.

Was at TCM for 4 years, now CHS for past 1, took the VSP, looking to get in the Reserves and airline.

 

[L'il J.Seinfeld]

Kermit,
The app specifially says NOT to include a military converstion when entering flight time. Also, they don't consider any "relief pilot" time as PIC - I'm assuming that means our military "other" time is out.

I was able to upload my resume.

Moose--You Strat Air pukes fly your tails off. I would not automatically discount your other time. I flew tankers and we were almost always just a 2 pilot crew. Occasionally we would have a 3rd pilot. Before becoming an IP I would log some other time when I was the "A" code. The AFORMS printout can not account for this. The bottom line is that if you were the A coded all of the time was PIC, despit the USAF calling some of it other.

It won't matter after you get the call for the interview. All I took for the interview was my 2 page Flying SUmmary Report. The iterviewer asked me how I came up with my PIC. I told him when I upgraded and that all the time after that was PIC. I also included half of the "other" time and explained to him that it was from when I was the Aircraft commander but not in the seat.

Try to keep it simple so you can explain it when you are under stress and nervous in the interview. But at the same time you want to get as much credit as possible for your experience.

It's a good time to be a military heavy driver looking to get out!

 

[b707guy]

I guess just about all of my other time was time spent snoozing or along for the ride. My last five years, we didn't have copilots - everyone was AC qualified, but only one was designated as such for each leg, and we'd play musical seats over the duration of the trip. Most of our trips had a full crew plus DNIF cover. In other words, 3 pilots, 2 navs, and two FEs, plus a flight surgeon complete with a bag of goodies if we were going somewhere we couldn't afford having a sick crewmember putting the kaibosh on whatever we were doing.
Didn't mean to mislead. :0 I guess the important thing is to be able to defend your use of other time in your indicated PIC/SIC time. I figured if I had the thousand needed without using other time, that's one less thing I might have to 'splain or defend. Either way, its still shown in my AFORMS as additional time. But if you're comfortable with using it in light of the definitions given, go for it!

 

[AV80R]

AV8 - I sure hope you're right, that would certainly make my day. I haven't done any kind of psych eval, but then again I just finished my app about 12 hours ago. How is one notified to take the psych eval?

Elkflyer

I thought you had already completed the psych eval. because of the response you got: ”schedule an appointment with an HR professional.”

I thought this was the message you’d get after a successful psych eval, at least that was my perception based on some posts by people who’d already completed the eval.

Either way, with your heavy experience I’d say your call wil come much sooner than later. And once that call comes it’ll certainly”make your day,” - it’s a great feeling.

As always, I personally think job fairs are the best way to become “visible” to the recruiters (I know many here disagree with me on that). I’d copy and paste your latest application, bring your latest resume, cover letter and maybe copies of some online recommendations if you have any and then I’d head for the next AirInc, WAI or OBAB conference, any will do!

WAI got me the job and I’m not a woman! My friend (one of my sponsors) recommended it to me and he even attended the WAI job fair with me just so he could re-introduce me to the HR (I say re-introduce because I’d attended several AirInc seminars prior to that to no avail).

I am eternally grateful to him and to my other sponsors, wouldn’t have happened without them. Btw, I think the job fair indirectly helped me during the interview itself because one of the HR people I talked to at the seminar ended up conducting my interview!

Good luck to you and all other hopefuls!

 

[Jumpseater]

What is the UPS definition of "transoceanic". I have lots of time flying in Class 2 nav airspace to the carribean. I doubt this is what they are looking for but is it enough to check the box.

 

[757jetflier]

What is the UPS definition of "transoceanic". I have lots of time flying in Class 2 nav airspace to the carribean. I doubt this is what they are looking for but is it enough to check the box.

Four different boxes to check.
Pacific
North Atlantic
South America
Africa/Middle East

Not sure, but I would guess that their primary focus is operations in MNPS airspace or airspace where MNPS rules are followed. Such as NOPAC, WESTPAC, MIDPAC, Etc.

 

[Jumpseater]

Four different boxes to check.
Pacific
North Atlantic
South America
Africa/Middle East

Not sure, but I would guess that their primary focus is operations in MNPS airspace or airspace where MNPS rules are followed. Such as NOPAC, WESTPAC, MIDPAC, Etc.

I don't even know what that is, so I will wait for the next window.

 

[Fedora]

I suspect they're looking for MNPS, RVSM, NATrack and/or Norpac experience. Basically, if you've crossed the Prime Meridian or the International Dateline while flying somewhere, you've probably done a crossing and as such have "experience".
They offer no definition, so one crossing would seem to be enough to check yes. Now when they look at your logbook, they may feel that is not enough, but hey! By then you're at least in the door face to face.
I don't think they will consider going from New York Center to Miami Center to San Juan Center a transoceanic. Just my look at it.

 

[Fedora]

I'll cut and paste the instructions on PIC time as there seems to be a few questions regarding it.
Good luck to all.

• All flight time must be substantiated by certified Flight Records.
• Be as accurate as possible.
• Do not record fractional hours. Round to the nearest whole hour.
• Do not add military conversion.
• List all fixed-wing jet aircraft and all fixed-wing multi-engine turboprop aircraft flown up to a maximum of twelve aircraft.
• List all aircraft in order flown beginning with the most recent.
• UPS considers Instructor/Evaluator time as PIC time. List the PIC and Instructor/Evaluator time separately in the appropriate columns.
• Relief pilot time does not count as PIC time.
• Pilot-In-Command (PIC) time must meet all three requirements as outlined in FAR 1.1 'Definitions' listed below.
• Pilot-In-Command (PIC) means the person who:
  1) Has final authority and responsibility for the operation and safety of the flight;
  2) Has been designated as the pilot in command before or during the flight; and
  3) Holds the appropriate category, class, and type rating, if appropriate, for the conduct of the flight.

 

[b707guy]

Hey Mooseflyer and AV8OR. Regarding the online assessment, the order of things for me were I completed the application, then polished up a resume and returned to the site to attach it. That was Tuesday afternoon. Last night (Wednesday), I got an e-mail saying that they received my resume submitted online, and that based on my qualifications, they'd like for me to proceed to the next step, which is the two-part online assessment. No mention was made of the application itself. Maybe an attached resume is a high priority item for them. The e-mail also told me to look for a follow-on e-mail whose subject would be "Invited to Complete Process". That second e-mail came about twenty minutes after the first one, and included both a direct link to the website as well as a cut-and-paste url in case the link didn't work. It also said that the process should take no more than an hour to complete. I didn't have a full hour last night, plus I was hoping maybe someone would post some info here about it, but I did complete it this afternoon. I didn't time it, but I don't think it took more than a half hour. By the way, I had to use Internet Explorer to access it. I usually use Mozilla Firefox as my browser, and spent some time trying to access the site through that, but kept getting a "server not found" message. Anyway, after taking the assessment, I was given a message right on the site saying they'd be in contact with me. Don't think I can hold my breath much longer!

 

[kermit99]

How did you attach a resume? I did my application, and submitted it but wont let me go back into it to put a resume on. Now my application says "on file" with everything complete. Did I mess things up for myself, or do I have to wait until I am "acitve" to put a resume on? Thanks.

 

[AV80R]

B707guy »»» soon »»»MD11guy!

B707guy - great news, sounds like you're almost there. Very soon you'll be switching your screen name to MD11guy - at least for a year or so! LOL

Good luck to you with the next step, keep us posted please...

 

[TCMC17RES]

relief pilot?

I would include "other" time since being certed as an AC since you still signed for the jet when you go on long trips. Did not include "other" time for SIC because I was just a co-pilot then and did not sign for anything.

Was at TCM for 4 years, now CHS for past 1, took the VSP, looking to get in the Reserves and airline.

I assumed "relief pilot" was other time. I removed all other time from my PIC because I didn't want to get my one chance at an interview and surprise them with bad minimums.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

Thanx 4 all the helpful and informative posts.

cliff
YIP

 

[Mooseflyer]

Thanks for the info B707 (RUSH - what a great band BTW, hope to see them in July). I keep checking my email, but nothing yet. Keep us all posted and get to studying!.....

Three of my buds have been hired this year already, and all 3 only took 4-5 weeks from first call to class date.

 

[coho92]

Kermit/Moose

I used about 95% of my MP "other" time. Told 'em to take hours divided by sorties = ~3.7 hr sortie so most other was running locals with multiple pliots as PIC and not relief pilot duties. They looked at my flying history and logbook for a total of about 4 seconds and then on to the questions. As far as SIC other, throw it out and don't count it for anythinig other than total time for mil flying. Good luck with the FCC PFBIT

 

[wrgcareer]

FWIW,

I have about 5,400 hours with 1,130 turboprop PIC. I'm with my 2nd major airline where for the last three years I've been on the 757 doing a lot of Hawaii flying. After finishing the application, it said I wasn't competitive. I'm not sure where they've set their parameters, but my experience didn't make the cut.

Good luck to all.