T-38C Near Miss Video

[JimNtexas]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLVtstYAZLY&eurl=

I bet these guys needed new underwear after this!

 

[RJP]

I'm sadly disappointed that the best the IP could come up with was "oh my gosh". It's the new PC air force for ya.
Oh, and that HUD is ridiculous for UPT. Don't these kids learn to fly round dials any more?
Sad.

 

[Scrapdog]

Oh, and that HUD is ridiculous for UPT. Don't these kids learn to fly round dials any more?
Sad.

Yep - they learn both. It's called technology.

 

[Vandal]

Did you read this comment on youtube?

"Looks to me that the F-5 Pilot was not flying VFR Altitudes! Course 325 he should of been flying at even thousands +500 "2500, 4500, etc etc" but he is flying at 1500 ft! Unless he was in a designated Military Operations Area or Bomb Range! Looks to me that He was the one out of line for two reasons, 1 not flying VFR courses and Altitudes, 2 not maintaining Situational Awareness! "

hehehe

 

[The_Russian]

Did you read this comment on youtube?

"Looks to me that the F-5 Pilot was not flying VFR Altitudes! Course 325 he should of been flying at even thousands +500 "2500, 4500, etc etc" but he is flying at 1500 ft! Unless he was in a designated Military Operations Area or Bomb Range! Looks to me that He was the one out of line for two reasons, 1 not flying VFR courses and Altitudes, 2 not maintaining Situational Awareness! "

hehehe

What an idiot!

Anywho.....glad those guys were ok! That was way too close!

 

[SIG600]

Wow....

I like the "lets go home." Ya I'd need a smoke and a beer after that.

Did the A/V club nerds really need to put credits on there?

 

[airbrush]

Whew!

I was at Randolph back in June and spoke to one of the IPs in the squadron, and he said they determined that the aircraft missed each other by a bout 80 feet. Given the speeds and converging vectors, the margin of life and death was measured in milliseconds.

As far as the HUD being used for UPT, I don't think anyone at Randolph is actually in UPT. I'm pretty sure these guys are all rated USAF pilots undergoing training to be IPs.

 

[JimNtexas]

If a student is in T-38s I'm think it's safe to say that his end assignment airplane will have a HUD, unless its a B-52.

It only makes sense to make their trainers similar to what they'll fly when they get to the RAF (real Air Force).

 

[Lifter]

Did you read this comment on youtube?

"Looks to me that the F-5 Pilot was not flying VFR Altitudes! Course 325 he should of been flying at even thousands +500 "2500, 4500, etc etc" but he is flying at 1500 ft! Unless he was in a designated Military Operations Area or Bomb Range! Looks to me that He was the one out of line for two reasons, 1 not flying VFR courses and Altitudes, 2 not maintaining Situational Awareness! "

hehehe

Let me understand there point here, he should be at VFR altitudes? HHMMM, 1500 ft MSL puts him about 600-700 ft AGL around the Randolph AFB area. That means he must have been on a low level route (either IR, VR route since T-38s are to fast for SR routes) VFR altitudes don't apply on those routes and definitely not below 3000ft AGL last time I checked. Been out of the AF for over 3 years, but unless they changed something it sounds to me like the civilian traffic was buzzing around VFR at 600 feet AGL cutting across military low level route he probably didn't know existed. Is that enough for their point 1? Their point 2, no SA hhmmm let's see, he's at 325 KIAS (approx) civilian traffic probably around 180-210 KIAS (guess) that puts closure rate around 500 KIAS. That's greater than 8 miles/min or approz .13 miles per second closure. Let me guess his cross check at 500 feet can pick up all traffic covering .13miles each sec? So that dot on the horizon 2 miles away is a blurr past the windscreen in less that 20 seconds. Maybe what they should be asking is rather, "shouldn't the civilian pilot be tooling around above 3000' AGL at hemishperical altitudes and get the h*ll away from published low level routes.

Let's just be glad they were lucky, the big sky theory worked, and everyone made it home safely.

 

[pkober]

I'm old school, dogg, flew the T-38A.

Does the "C" have TCAS?

 

[Scrapdog]

I'm old school, dogg, flew the T-38A.

Does the "C" have TCAS?

Pk - yes it does. When I was finishing up IFF at Moody in '01, they were just recieving their first batch of the T-38C. Same underpowered jet as the T-38A or AT-38B model unfortunately, however the avionics suite was quite impressive...but of course lacked any radar. I never flew one in my course (I had finished up already), but got a couple of back seat rides with IP's against other students currently in the course. I remember the IP's were using the TCAS system kind of a like a poor man's datalink. They had the students squak a mode 3C of some standard number already co-ordinated with ATC, and they were able to keep track of them throughout the sortie on the color moving map/TCAS display. "Blind" issues went way down, which is a good thing...and they were able to maximize training more effectively. That's my 2 cents...maybe more current guys from IFF or UPT have more insight.

 

[frog_flyer]

His name was Shaved Dog's Ass.....

 

[FL420]

Years ago four of us were dropping practice bombs on Inky Barley or Kitty Baggage(I forget which one) in R-2512 along the Colorado River border between California and Arizona. I had just dropped and looked back to spot my hit. When I looked up the belly of a Bonanza was rapidly filling my windscreen. I was about 30º nose up and all I could do was punch the nose over at about 2 negative G's.

Unfortunately, we didn't have a spotter in a T-28 that day to chase down that putz and ID him. It wasn't worth the gas to send an F-4 to chase him down. He was headed eastbound right toward some other restricted areas. He probably never knew how close he came to meeting his maker. At least we might have had a chance with our friend, Martin-Baker.

 

[SIG600]

Those targets are still there. I was constantly amazed at the traffic running east/west skirting the Mexico/US border.

 

[RJP]

When I.......I never.....in my.....(I had........ I remember..... my 2 cents...

WINDBAG!

HUDs are great unless you're some poor guy that goes from a -38 at SPS to a -135 at Altus. Sheppard's still open, right?

 

[stonewall]

HUDs are great unless you're some poor guy that goes from a -38 at SPS to a -135 at Altus.

Were you that poor guy, RJP?

 

[Fury220]

WINDBAG!

HUDs are great unless you're some poor guy that goes from a -38 at SPS to a -135 at Altus. Sheppard's still open, right?

You'd have to be pretty dang unlucky for that to happen. Sheppard is home of ENJJPT, and all the US grads go on to fly one of the following:

F-15C/E, F-16, A-10, B-1, B-2, B-52.

It's pretty much impossible to be an ENJJPT grad and end up flying a KC-anything, unless you Palace Chased into a guard unit with heavies.

It's pretty safe to say that 85% (probably more) of ENJJPT grads go onto fly jets with HUDs.

 

[peter185]

At Laughlin they showed a video to compliment the one posted of a near miss between a T-38 and a T-6 from Randolph. So much for deconflicting the low level......

 

[RJP]

It's pretty safe to say that 85% (probably more) of ENJJPT grads go onto fly jets with HUDs.

There ya go. 15%. Whatever.

I wanted a KC-135 but it wasn't available in the drop. Shame. Anything's better than a porker.

ciao.

 

[Huggyu2]

In years past, Sheppard has had assignment drops where almost no one got a fighter. I have a friend who's class got none. He got a C-130.

I was at Laughlin in March, and some students told me that if the HUD goes out, it's akin to a minor EP: they come back 1 to a full stop. Nevermind that thousands of pilots have done landings in the T-38 without one for 40 years. They do have a dual sortie where there is a "Special Syllabus Item" to do landings without a HUD (gasp!). "Put the thing on the thing on the thing" (can you believe that one?). But I guess that SUPT is making a product for the 21st century,... and that product better be able to use a HUD.