Alaska Airlines increases hiring minimums.

[av8instyle]

Just saw this on the website. What a crock.

PilotFull Time - Regular posted 11.07.06Seattle, WA

Requirements

Description:
Performs as Pilot in Command or Second in Command in the transport of passengers, mail, or freight, or for other commercial purposes. Responsible for all aspects and conduct of flight to include preflight of required paperwork and restrictions,conduct of safe flight and all post flight duties.

Must have knowledge commensurate with holder of airline transport pilot certificate and have knowledge of all aspects of applicable FARs and AIM.

Pilots airplane to transport passengers, mail, or freight, or for other commercial purposes. Reviews aircraft's papers to ascertain factors, such as load weight, fuel supply, load, route, or schedule to ensure safety of flight. Reads gauges to verify oil, hydraulic fluid, fuel quantities and cabin pressure are at prescribed levels prior to start engines. Communicates with control tower, ground and flight crew.

Domiciles:
Seattle, WA
Los Angeles, CA
Anchorage, AK

Minimum Qualifications:
Experience: Minimum of 3000 hours total pilot time in fixed wing aircraft. Minimum 1000 PIC hours in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) aircraft or single-engine high performance military jet or 750 hours PIC in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) and 2000 hours SIC in multi-engine (turbojet/ turboprop) aircraft or single-engine high performance military jet. Minimum 50 hours flown within the last 12 months.

Education:Four year degree required from an accredited institution.

Licenses and Certificates: Airline Transport Pilot (ATP)

Health: Applicant must hold current First Class FAA Medical Certificate. Vision must be correctable to 20/20 in both eyes. Non user of nicotine products.

Legal Status: Applicants must be able to prove legal right to work in the United States. A background check will be completed for each applicant.

Candidates must possess:
-Excellent judgment and leadership skills
-Demonstrated command ability and maturity
-Ability to communicate effectively and learn rapidly
-Sound analytical ability and high tolerance to stress
-Professional demeanor and appearance

***Please note that these are minimum requirements and the majority of our applicants considerably exceed these standards.

Equal Opportunity Employer

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

It's kinda hard to have 1000 PIC in a jet and not have 3000 fixed wing, isnt it?

 

[P-Dawg_QX]

It's kinda hard to have 1000 PIC in a jet and not have 3000 fixed wing, isnt it?

My thoughts exactly. Not a big deal, IMO.

 

[jonjuan]

It's kinda hard to have 1000 PIC in a jet and not have 3000 fixed wing, isnt it?

Think military guys, especially lower time fighter jocks versus their transport bretheren.

 

[HA25]

Don't military get a conversion? Seems like it would be fair.

Eitherway, these minimums are a joke, I mean here I am exceeding all published minimums at every airline I've applied to, no incidents, accidents, failed checks, anything... and not a single call.

Oh, I forgot to mention.. I don't know anyone at anywhere that is hiring!

 

[av8instyle]

Think military guys, especially lower time fighter jocks versus their transport bretheren.

Exactly. Like most of the bros in my squadron that have YEARS of experience flying high performance aircraft and all of a sudden they are out of the picture. I think it's just a shame that they're gonna miss out on a lot of experience.

 

[av8instyle]

Don't military get a conversion? Seems like it would be fair.

Nope. no conversion. What a crock.

 

[HA25]

Exactly. Like most of the bros in my squadron that have YEARS of experience flying high performance aircraft and all of a sudden they are out of the picture. I think it's just a shame that they're gonna miss out on a lot of experience.

What I find is amazing is the corporate jet world and 135 world..

for a while I flew at a bottom dweller 135 that had citations and their upgrade requirement was 3500TT and 1000 Multi engine.. so in effect an F16 pilot with 3000TT was unable.. on the other hand, an idiot they hired right into the left seat of a Citation 560 (I was a 3300TT FO at the time, but mind you, had prior 121 PIC in ATR 72's and 2000+ turbine multi).. anyway, this idiot came from Empire flying caravans and flew Cessna 414's before that.. so his total experience in jets was 0, and his highest altitude flights were in the teens' in prop's... They deemed him "qualified" as a captain and he ended up running out of gas (or damn near) after landing with 6 gal in the plane.

This is the kind of twisted logic in of our profession that drives me crazy.

 

[ferlo]

Those mins are very reasonable...but then again, we've had 6 resignations in 6 weeks so maybe they should look at something else other than mins. They're far to arrogant for that though.

 

[av8instyle]

Those mins are very reasonable...but then again, we've had 6 resignations in 6 weeks so maybe they should look at something else other than mins. They're far to arrogant for that though.

Something else other than mins is right. Not taking anything away from other lines of experience, a guy that has 1500-2000 of fighter time has been flying jets for 10-15 years. That's a lot of aviation experience that this friggen company is thumbing their nose at. These mins are NOT alright. They need to be back where they were. They always have the option of not taking certain people that don't have "3000". But they have effectively eliminated a lot of experience by imposing these mins.

 

[av8instyle]

...and another thing...since the Kashhole I have not had ONE person ask me for any help getting on at Alaska. What does that tell you? Don't answer that. I already know what it tells you. My point is that the pool of good candidates shrunk significantly after the cut and these new mins won't help.

 

[HA25]

Honesty, do you HAVE to have a recommendation to get on at Alaska? I've heard that the times are a secondary issue to knowing someone.

 

[av8instyle]

Honesty, do you HAVE to have a recommendation to get on at Alaska? I've heard that the times are a secondary issue to knowing someone.

Not 100% on this but I think the majority still walk in with either a LOR or a handshake from the CP at OBAP/WIA/Kit Darby, etc.

 

[thunderworm]

of course it helps to know someone as it does in every job, but i know that knocking the company you are applying to dosen't help much either. i agree that time is not the only thing a company should look at. there should be others ways to get noticed. right now it seems to be internal recs. as a group we should come up with other ways to get noticed. until then we must all play the game in order to win.

 

['72Gremlin]

..., we've had 6 resignations in 6 weeks so maybe ...

Haven't heard about this. Can you elaborate?

 

[capt. megadeth]

I wouldn't think anyone (military or not) would get hired with less than 3000
hours anyways.

 

[GuppyWN]

Maybe I'm missing the point but if I had the choice between a fighter dude that spent 15 years getting 3k hours in a purely tactical environment vs. a civilian/tanker dude that did it in 5 in an operational environment I'd rather have the recency and abundance of quality time.

Call me crazy.

Gup

 

[Flybet3]

Those mins are very reasonable...but then again, we've had 6 resignations in 6 weeks so maybe they should look at something else other than mins. They're far to arrogant for that though.

Wait, wait, wait! You had 6 resignations at ALASKA AIRLINES?! did I read this right?!

 

[SIR MILO]

Doesn't almost running out of fuel and landing with 6 gallons of gas, make a regular operational day in the military.
I think if you can pull that off and not have the superior training of a military pilot that makes you pretty good.
Anyways why would any of you military guys want to work at such a puny little place like Alaska, we all know your far better then that...

 

[Draginass]

Aren't the unwritten "competitive" mins way above 3000TT anyway. There's lots of guys out on the street from just American that have a ton part 121 and military experience and tons of time in civil airliners. I don't think Alaska is worried about the experience pool.

 

[FR8dognit]

What I find is amazing is the corporate jet world and 135 world..

for a while I flew at a bottom dweller 135 that had citations and their upgrade requirement was 3500TT and 1000 Multi engine.. so in effect an F16 pilot with 3000TT was unable.. on the other hand, an idiot they hired right into the left seat of a Citation 560 (I was a 3300TT FO at the time, but mind you, had prior 121 PIC in ATR 72's and 2000+ turbine multi).. anyway, this idiot came from Empire flying caravans and flew Cessna 414's before that.. so his total experience in jets was 0, and his highest altitude flights were in the teens' in prop's... They deemed him "qualified" as a captain and he ended up running out of gas (or dang near) after landing with 6 gal in the plane.

This is the kind of twisted logic in of our profession that drives me crazy.

Some of these smaller companies might be restricted by their insurance companies. I know at two previous employers this was the case. Very exact numbers on what experience they thought the pilots should have. I was at the lower end of most of them but I have a lot of Military buddies that wouldn't have qualified.

 

[Old School 737]

I know a few newer hires had a tough time getting through the program with many extra sim sessions. My guess is that they are trying to tighten up a bit so as to not have to spend extra time and money on training.

 

[Remington]

I imagine the fighter or low-time military guys could go get a job at the regionals to build-up their flight time, learn 121, etc??

 

[lumax]

Six guys resigned since Sept. A couple were new hires (4-5 months) and others were on the property for about 3 1/2 years.
One went to Emerates, don't know about the others

 

[JohnnyP]

so in effect an F16 pilot with 3000TT was unable.. on the other hand, an idiot they hired right into the left seat of a Citation 560 (I was a 3300TT FO at the time, but mind you, had prior 121 PIC in ATR 72's and 2000+ turbine multi).. anyway, this idiot came from Empire flying caravans and flew Cessna 414's before that.. so his total experience in jets was 0, and his highest altitude flights were in the teens' in prop's... They deemed him "qualified" as a captain and he ended up running out of gas (or dang near) after landing with 6 gal in the plane.

.

Yep, based on qualifications, the guy flying the 414, beech 1900, emb-110, etc, is more qualified to enter coporate operations than the fighter guy. The guy you speak of obviously messed up, but would be initially more familiar with that type of operation than the fighter guy would be (assuming flying fighters is all he/she has done). I mean, how much experience operating in bad weather, in an aging propeller aircraft, etc, would the fighter guy have?

Not trying to speak poorly on fighter and/or military operations, but flying a 1900, metro, something of that sort, is going to prepare one for corporate/airline flying more than flying fighter would.

Like one guy said above, your getting 3000 hours in 10-15'ish years of flying in military, as opposed to a lot more flying in the "prop trash" world, doing the same sort of flying your going to be doing in your corporate/airline job.

You speak of this guys flight experience only being in the "teens in props", even more reason he will be more prepared for the corporate/airline world, albight he obviouisly screwed up at some point, according to your account.

I dont fly fighters, but do you guys regularly fly low and slow in the weather, in props?

By the way, they hire guys with zero jet time, into jets, on a regular basis, seems to work out fine. There are going to be rotten eggs, military or civilian.

 

[HA25]

Don't misunderstand, I'm not saying the fighter jet pilot is better, or more qualified.. but I'm saying quality of time, and relevant time should be an over riding factor.. In the end, anyone with 3000 hours in any kind of jet, single, multi or otherwise is qualified to fly anything, or at least can be trained to be.. but someone who's only flown low performance single engine prop's and some recips twins has no place in the left seat of a jet.. PERIOD.

I'm a civ background guy myself, and used to hate the preferential treatment mil guys with 2000TT would get over commuter guys with 4000TT most of which was in CRJ or ATR's but lets' not swing the axe to far the other direction either..

 

[tico]

I know a few newer hires had a tough time getting through the program with many extra sim sessions. My guess is that they are trying to tighten up a bit so as to not have to spend extra time and money on training.

That is not the new hires fault it is the fault of the weakest, longest most expensive training program in the industry brough to you by your weak, scared to fly friends on the second floor at the Alaska Airlines flight
operations training center

 

[Ih8AFYesmen]

Yep, based on qualifications, the guy flying the 414, beech 1900, emb-110, etc, is more qualified to enter coporate operations than the fighter guy. The guy you speak of obviously messed up, but would be initially more familiar with that type of operation than the fighter guy would be (assuming flying fighters is all he/she has done). I mean, how much experience operating in bad weather, in an aging propeller aircraft, etc, would the fighter guy have?

Not trying to speak poorly on fighter and/or military operations, but flying a 1900, metro, something of that sort, is going to prepare one for corporate/airline flying more than flying fighter would.

Like one guy said above, your getting 3000 hours in 10-15'ish years of flying in military, as opposed to a lot more flying in the "prop trash" world, doing the same sort of flying your going to be doing in your corporate/airline job.

You speak of this guys flight experience only being in the "teens in props", even more reason he will be more prepared for the corporate/airline world, albight he obviouisly screwed up at some point, according to your account.

I dont fly fighters, but do you guys regularly fly low and slow in the weather, in props?

By the way, they hire guys with zero jet time, into jets, on a regular basis, seems to work out fine. There are going to be rotten eggs, military or civilian.

Not to start a mil vs. civ thread and I'm not a fighter guy either, but flying an ILS or any sort of an instrument approach is second nature for any military pilot (atleast the fixed wing types). Yes, fighter guys do fly approaches to minimums and often with another aircraft on the wing (formation). Flying an instrument approach in the weather after a complex mission would be a no brainer, IMO.

 

[JohnnyP]

....

Don't misunderstand, I'm not saying the fighter jet pilot is better, or more qualified.. but I'm saying quality of time, and relevant time should be an over riding factor.. In the end, anyone with 3000 hours in any kind of jet, single, multi or otherwise is qualified to fly anything, or at least can be trained to be.. but someone who's only flown low performance single engine prop's and some recips twins has no place in the left seat of a jet.. PERIOD.

I'm a civ background guy myself, and used to hate the preferential treatment mil guys with 2000TT would get over commuter guys with 4000TT most of which was in CRJ or ATR's but lets' not swing the axe to far the other direction either..

I understand what your saying, and maybe im crazy (go talk to my buddies).

I know that either guy (military of civvy) can be trained at eithers job, im sure ill get flamed for that one.

But when it comes down to it, your going to be training a civilian guy to fly a turbine engine (who has already been dealing with problems with possibly questionable equipement, stuck in the weather, limited options...

As opposed to training a fighter guy to deal with the situations tossed at the guy who is flying the 414, metro, etc....

Im sure its possible im offbased somewhere, but wouldnt it be "easier" to train the civvy guy to work with the turbine engine on a citation series. etc, and throw him into the weather, problems, situations they have already seen before, as opposed to training the fighter guy to operate in this foreign environment, in the weather they arent ever stuck in, possibly flying a turboprop they have never seen before, even though they might have already operated the engine of an F-16?

Im crazy im sure, card carrying certifiable actually, but id pick the corporate/airline/prop guy who has already seen all the crap (except for the simple operation of the turbine engine) as opposed to the fighter guy, as long as the other chap wasnt a lunatic.

Man did we get off topic here.

 

[Bill Nelson]

They raised their mins to be more inline with SWA. They wan't to be offered employment by SWA after the buyout that has yet to be announced. Comming soon though!