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That right there is the whole problem!
When negiotiating pay issues there shouldn't even be a "Hopefully".
But, Hopefully SAPA will grab its ba!!s and man up,Hopefully it will be for everyone, not just the new hires (cuz' if I was JA and the board thats what I'd be pullin' for - to get people IN the door - losing people off the top is not so bad a thing because with it goes higher salaries)

Hopefully, Hopefully, Hopefully.....

You know what I Hope for - SAPA to be a little more antagonistic.....That would be nice......Oh, wait I just woke up....never mind.

Antagonistic (adjective)
1. indicating opposition or resistance

Synonym of antagonize = Mollify = Placate, Pacify, Appease.

Poor wording on my part. Hope or not, the pay rasies will come around. In the meantime, I'll keep voting against pay packages that don't include everybody.

 

[Gandalf]

This is just not true.

That is a ridiculous oversimplification that ignores the complexities of the issue. The ones who actually made an informed decision and chose a "no" by not voting (as opposed to those who were apathetic and didn't call) were potentially saying a couple of things: that they didn't like ALPA; they were happy so far with the way the company treats them-including compensation and work rules; that management wasn't firing people left and right for bogus reasons and that they are independent, free thinkers. Their vote in no way prevents them from doing something differently in the future.

Even though I voted differently than they did, I support the decision that these fellow pilots made. The ones who were lazy or were incapable of coherent thought and action, well lets just say my opinion of them is other than supportive.

Fly Safe.

-JP

The problem is there is not going to be a future point for "them" to doing differently. ALPA is not coming again for a long, long time if ever again. Why would any other union(Teamsters, etc) come anywhere close? An in house union such as SWA - which has a great management-labor relationship - has been tried and failed. Even the mighty SWA has a LEGITIMATE, LEGAL union with which BOTH sides have rules to abide by, grievance processes, contracts, etc.

There is no Regional Airline Pilots Association, so unless there is something else that you can think of for someone to really, truly REPRESENT us.....then there is no "doing differently in the future."

If the pilots of SKYW really don't want any union ever, but they really want some type of LEGITIMATE REPRESENTATIVE BODY, then in my opinion SAPA needs to be majorly reformed. Get it out of the control of management. Even then, with an at-will set-up, management doesn't have to listen to anything SAPA says or proposes.(It has done it in the past and I am sure it will happen again.)

This last email from SAPA shows how ineffective this system is...."It APPEARS that first year pay rates are some of the lowest in the industry. (DUH-How did it get there - uhh SAPA) Next we talked about how the Brasilia pilot’s base rates were left out of the last pay package. (DUH - How did this happen - SAPA.).... As for the jet rates, it looks like the 50 seat rates are near average while the 700 and 900 rates are starting to fall below average. (DUH - How did this happen - SAPA) Along with pay scales we also discussed blah, blah, blah. (DUH - SAPA haven't we been dealing with most of these issues for years?)

 

[Tomct]

I was wondering when "Tomcant - the internet toughguy" was going to show up. This thing almost went 5 pages without a "SHUT IT" I was getting worried.

Oh never mind...your avatar say's it all! Too Easy!

 

[FORESTGUMP]

Well who knew that it would take "Joe Duche" this long in the thread to make an Anti-Union statement! Hey Joe....how big is your "bonus" check going to be THANKS TO THE UNION LEADERSHIP? Yeah...that's what I thought...SHUT IT!!!!! JackAss!

Not to answer for someone else, but.... Not nearly enough, Not nearly what they promissed to get us and its a bonus rather than retro (so it takes a bigger tax hit if I understand correctly) that ALPO is going to steal 1.95% of.

 

[Jmoney]

Run Forest, Run!

Not to answer for someone else, but.... Not nearly enough, Not nearly what they promissed to get us and its a bonus rather than retro (so it takes a bigger tax hit if I understand correctly) that ALPO is going to steal 1.95% of.

I believe it makes no difference whether it is designated as "retro-pay" or "bonus" the tax hit is the same. You simply get charged for anything like that at the max rate, and get something back in the refund if you are in a lower bracket.

There are very few things that are taxed differently-maybe insurance settlements, or proceeds from some lawsuit, but pretty much anything else and the tax man is going to get some As$!

 

[Dubya]

Who do we all thank when we take pay cuts and work rules get thrown out the window?

....still waiting for an answer to the best question posted yet. Anyone? Anyone?


W

 

[front9]

Originally posted by a big loser named Tomcant: Oh never mind...your avatar say's it all! Too Easy!

Too Easy? My avatar represents the struggle Mesa Pilots(read: real pilots) & I had to go thru every day with management. What does your avatar say? You fly a 777...HA!!! What a :angryfire LOSER! We almost went to page 5 without a tought-guy remark from you. Where have you been? I have nothing but respect for my fellow ASA pilots & even voted for ALPA this last drive @ SKYW, but you & Scarleft have nothing to contribute to this forum except tough guy BS and name calling. Eat a .

MOD INPUT: TOMCAT & FRONT9 WILL BE DUKING IT OUT ON THE PLAYGROUND THIS AFTERNOON BEHIND THE SWING SET WHICH IS ACROSS FROM THE MONKEY BARS. ALL BETS OF LUNCH MONEY, BUBBLE GUM AND CANDY BARS.

 

[SKYWRJGUY]

Actually, perhaps if some sort of deal that showed the 'bonus' (retro, whatever) as return on investment by the group, it could have been taxed at capital gains rate instead.

 

[MoroniMetro]

Too Easy? My avatar represents the struggle Mesa Pilots(read: real pilots) & I had to go thru every day with management. What does your avatar say? You fly a 777...HA!!! What a :angryfire LOSER! We almost went to page 5 without a tought-guy remark from you. Where have you been? I have nothing but respect for my fellow ASA pilots & even voted for ALPA this last drive @ SKYW, but you & Scarleft have nothing to contribute to this forum except tough guy BS and name calling. Eat a .

MOD INPUT: TOMCAT & FRONT9 WILL BE DUKING IT OUT ON THE PLAYGROUND THIS AFTERNOON BEHIND THE SWING SET WHICH IS ACROSS FROM THE MONKEY BARS. ALL BETS OF LUNCH MONEY, BUBBLE GUM AND CANDY BARS.

Struggle for MESA? You chose to work there. If cutt-throaters like you chose not to, that POS airline would not exist. Get a F-ing clue.

 

[Tomct]

Could not agree with you more Forest.

Front9...my avatar is a picture of an airplane I like...got anything else! Thought so...go back to sleep you Duche! By the way...I would not take you out by the monkey bars, I would just kick your Azz in the hall, take your money AND your girlfriend!

Happy Holidays!!